Need some help!

[Dstone1992]

I have the opportunity to make a trade for this smoothbore I'm new to all of this but I belive its a caywood northwest trade gun. Can someone give a value of what they think its worth? And are these guns something I could still take out and shoot if it checks out? I know nothing about them anything helps thanks in advance-Dstone

 

[hawkeye2]

That looks like a significant crack in the stock. I hope the bore is more rust free than the lock. It may have been built from a kit judging by some of the work.

 

[Jakeytoo]

That crack under the side plate would cause some concern for shooting it

 

[Dstone1992]

Yeah it does look like a pretty good crack. I will probably pass on it. I have some traps he wants but Id rather trade them for something a little nicer

 

[Brokennock]

It looks similar to a smoothbore pistol I acquired. Trigger guard and side plate not inlet, just screwed onto the surface, dame markings of the fox....
Is this an in person trade or over the internet?

 

[Dstone1992]

Internet deal...........scary....

 

[Brokennock]

Internet deal...........scary....

Since you can't lay hands on the gun and check that crack and other construction issues,,, I would walk away.
If you could lay hands on it you would be able to determine if the issues are fixable, and if those issues are within your ability to deal with.

 

[Brokennock]

Internet deal...........scary....

Concern being that the inletting issues, or lack of inletting, could be indicative of other inletting issues.
My trigger guard and side plate wouldn't be bad on their own. I didn't notice them when I 1st agreed to buy the gun, and might have anyway.
not real noticeable.


More noticeable, but correctable, but twisted also.

Unfortunately these were indicators of problems elsewhere. Again, that I didn't notice at 1st.
note that flint and frizzen do not line up.


Pan cover/base of frizzen does not meet side of the barrel.....


See the shim? I'm assuming the lock was inlet too deep. So, the builder of this kit shimmed the lock out leaving the gap between frizzen and barrel and misalignment of flintcock and frizzen.

But wait, there's more,,,as Billy Maise would have said...


Sear bar and top of trigger are also shimmed.

These last two are fine, they are what they are and offered a simple and effective fix for what would have been at best a horrible trigger pull and at worst a completely nonfunctional trigger.
But that shim next to the pan is a problem I'm not sure I can deal with myself.

All I'm getting at is that the small issues (small depending on how bad that crack really is) seen in your pictures could be signs of bigger problems elsewhere.

 

[stank]

Value? I would probably go 300-350. Just to get the parts. The crack under the side plate is bad

 

[nit wit]

Parts today are at least $600 or more. A crack can be stabilized, if the bore is good. 350-400 bucks would be a good deal.
Nit Wit

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Parts today are at least $600 or more. A crack can be stabilized, if the bore is good. 350-400 bucks would be a good deal.
Nit Wit

That's a big IF...,

If it was a Caywoods, then it was bought as a "kit". The engraving in the wood on the sideplate mortise is rather ham-fisted, and numerous file marks on the tang, to have been done by Caywoods. (imho)

LD

 

[MSW]

if the crack is as big as it appears, and you can't put your hands on it, i would take a 'pass' on this one

 

[Jakeytoo]

I recall there was a company back in the eighties that used the sitting fox as their logo. They advertised in Muzzleloader and Blackpowder Times (?).
I don’t remember the name and all of my magazines have been gone since ‘97. No one wanted them so they were destroyed, another loss from my divorce.

 

[Flintandsteel]

Appears to be a Sitting Fox kit. Crack in stock is from improper inletting at rear of barrel channel. The bolt is taking the recoil.

 

[Dstone1992]

I turned it away. Thanks for all the input. The search continues!

 

[smoothshooter]

It

I have the opportunity to make a trade for this smoothbore I'm new to all of this but I belive its a caywood northwest trade gun. Can someone give a value of what they think its worth? And are these guns something I could still take out and shoot if it checks out? I know nothing about them anything helps thanks in advance-Dstone

Danny Caywood would never let a finished gun that looked like that out of his shop. Possibly one of their kits someone did a poor job on.
More likely it is a gun from a company called Sitting Fox that sells semi-custom guns farmed out to builders that work at home having varying levels of expertise.
The sitting fox stamp is one that has been around for a couple of hundred years or so. It was originally stamped on guns built in England for the American Indian trade. The Indians were known to be attracted to guns and ofher products from stamped with the figures of animals.
The Sitting Fox company and others who make replica trade guns will often use the fox stamp on their smoothbore trade guns like manufacturers in the past have.

 

[Pete G]

Run, Forrest, run

 

[Flinter 2]

It's a Sitting Fox kit, they are a seller, they buy their parts from the lowest bidder, assemble them into kit form and sell them, if someone wants a finished gun they contract with one of their makers to put it together, reviews on line run from pee poor to passable on both their kits and finished guns, I would pass also.
As far as kits go the kits put out by Kibler are getting rave reviews for their high quality and ease of assembly, they aren't cheap, their French Fusil and English trade gun kits are going for about $1000.00 on average, but 90% of the work is already done, the stocks are shaped, all the inletting is done, holes are all morticed, for someone on a budget who wants a quality long gun and don't mind putting in a few hours of work and assembly they appear to be the best game in town.

 

[Dstone1992]

I Ordered a kibler smr in .36 a while back still waiting on it to come in. I have been thinking about also ordering a tow full stock hawken in .58 I have heard they are no cake walk but if I dive into it I think I can get it together. Going back to the smoothbore I do want one but I was hoping to trade these antique Samuel newhouse wolf traps I have for one but I might have to sell them out right and use the funds to purchase one.

 

[Flinter 2]

I Ordered a kibler smr in .36 a while back still waiting on it to come in. I have been thinking about also ordering a tow full stock hawken in .58 I have heard they are no cake walk but if I dive into it I think I can get it together. Going back to the smoothbore I do want one but I was hoping to trade these antique Samuel newhouse wolf traps I have for one but I might have to sell them out right and use the funds to purchase one.

I love my smoothbores, I have two Center Mark Fusils, I also had a beautiful 12ga. New England Fowler that Ed Parry (BlackHart Long Arms) from CT. built for me, I let it get away several years ago, but it looks like I may be getting it back.
I like .54 cal., I have a Cabin Creek Yorktown and a custom percussion half stock Hawken also in .54cal., IMHO it's more economical long term to buy quality when ever possible, even if you have to wait until you've saved enough to afford it.