New 1861 Navy by Pietta - jams

[rinejl]

Have shot this new cap and ball revolver several times as it came from the factory with terrible cap jams. Have read that you should replace nipples with Slix Shot nipples - I have done that and still the jams continue. The new nipples came with directions to use Remington #11 percussion caps but I have not been able to locate any locally. I did find one retailer who sells them but is out of stock. I have been using CCI #11's and, as I said, am getting many jams. The accuracy has been great, though. I've been using Tripple7 FFFg equivalent with 15, 18, & 20 grs. Looking for suggestions on how to reduce the jams.

 

[ASMman]

Hello rineji,

Sounds like you might need to have a cap rake installed.
It's a post which stands behind the nipple on the frame,
and the hammer straddles it while striking the cap.
I know Mike Brackett installs them, goonsgunworks.com.

AntiqueSledMan.

 

[bang]

I found that a twist of the wrist to the right as it's cocked pretty much solves it. I very rarely get primer jams.

 

[TNGhost]

There are a lot of videos on fixing cap jam problems out there, many centered on the hammer face, and the way it cuts and/or grabs the caps off of the nipples.

One method prescribes filling in the safety notch on the face of the hammer which tends to grab the caps and pull them off the nipples. This has the unfortunate side effect of not being able to use the safety pins. Not the best solution and actually can have negative consequences beyond just rendering the safety pins unusable.

Another solution presented is to "break" the sharp edges of the hammer face with small files to prevent them from grabbing the cap. I have done this on my revolvers and it helps and find it works and is one valuable part of solving the cap jam problem.

Back pressure which lifts the hammer off the cap at the moment of detonation is also been proven to be a problem, blowing the cap off and under the hammer. Replacing the nipples that are worn or bored too large, with those with a smaller opening helps, as does making sure your mainspring is stout enough to keep the hammer down.

As the Duelist states in his video, this does not seem to be a historic, period problem, and is something related to the reproductions, and I agree with him that the less finished hammer face of the repros, and perhaps a weaker mainspring than the originals, as put forward by Eras Gone, are the culprits.

 

[rinejl]

Wow! Thanks so much for your comments and these videos. I will take the advice of duelist1954 as well as adding a main spring if cleaning up the hammer doesn't fix my problems adequately. Very new to this forum and am impressed so far. I'll let'cha all know how I make out.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I've also had pretty good luck doing like Bang suggested by holding the gun to the right as I cock it to get any loose cap parts to fall out rather than into the action.

 

[TNGhost]

Keep us posted

 

[Gee Dog]

I use eight different Piettas in Remington and Colt style with date codes ranging from 1996 to 2017. One is an 1997 1861 mod and I use a lot of T7. All run real well on stock Pietta cones. On my guns No. 11 caps are way too wide and will fall off from just gravity. I use Remington No. 10’s and get consistent reliability. After detonation the spent caps have to be manually removed. I have polished the hammer faces to remove the “teeth”. Falling spent caps are not a problem on any of those guns. Sure, it happens occasionally but not often enough to be statistically significant.
… … Try some Remington No. 10 caps Rinejl and tell us what happens.

 

[sawyer04]

I have an old Army sold by Richland arms back in 71, The mechanics of it are closest to Uberti. #11 caps were recommended when it was new but were too loose unless squeezed together, #10 caps were the same problem. I filed a couple of thousands off the nipple and #10 caps worked fine. Even a brand spankin new reproduction should be disassembled and cleaned of burrs and checked for nipple clearance.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Also, keep in mind different cap manufacturers caps with the same number size may fit differently on the nipples. In other words a number 11 Remington isn't the same size as a number 11 CCI.

 

[condorsp]

The Slix Shot nipples should work fine with the correct cap.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Condorp, it is interesting the Remingtons and CCI #11 are about the same diameter and RSW too. The length is the difference.

 

[Zonie]

There are two ways of making a cap fit tighter on a nipple. You can either make the cap's diameter smaller and keep the length the same or, you can keep the cap's diameter about the same and make the length of the cap longer.

Looking at the chart above, CCI has chosen to make the diameter of the CCI #10 cap, smaller than the CCI #11 cap. That will make it fit tighter on the nipple.

Remington has chosen to make the diameters about the same but made the #10 cap longer than the #11.
By making the #10 cap longer, the bottom end of the cap will be pushed further down on the tapered cone on the nipple than their #11 cap will go.
Because the nipple cone is tapered, the further down the cap extends, the larger the cone is so, the tighter the cap gets.