New Crockett

[doubleset]

One final modification I made to my Crockett was to replace the front sight. After some initial experimentation with alternative sights (front and back), I reinstalled the original rear sight, got a nickel blade front sight from TOW (that required NO modification for the base to fit the Crocket dovetail!), tediously filed it down, and epoxied a length of fiber optic sight rod to the top of it. This has rendered the front sight nicely visible in all lighting conditions except for those approaching total darkness.

It took substantial trial and error -- and a huge amount of time -- to get the blade filed down so that when the fiber optic was glued on, the sight worked as I wanted it to for 25/50/100 yds. But (for me) it has made the rifle much more pleasant to use. And although it hasn't increased the rifle's accuracy, it has increased both my accuracy and my confidence.

 

[Stub]

Range report.

Before heading to the range I took the gun apart and cleaned it. I started with BP solvents on patches to get the heaviest factory lubes out. Then.I pumped it through several cycles of a warm soapy water bath. This was followed by dry patches, then WD-40 on patches. The finally step was patches with Barricade.

I removed the barrel rib and tighten the ramrod thimbles. Then I replaced the rib. I use loctite on all the screws. Now, the first problem. The rib screw nearest the muzzle wouldn't get tight enough to pull the rib against the barrel. I pinched the barrel and rib together but the screw stopped before holding them together. I wasn't sure if the rib was separated from the barrel before. I tighten the screw but stopped thinking I might strip the threads or break the crew off. I decided I would just have to live with the small gap between barrel and rib. I put everything back together and headed for the range.

When I got to the range 3 of the men I shoot our club matches with were there. I started using the load I've read a load of you use. 20 grains 3 F real Black powder. .310 round balls, and .011 patch lubed with beeswax\crisco.
First shot at 25 yards from rest hit 1 1\2 inches right and 1\2 inch high. That would have been a great time to pack up and head home. One of the better shooter come over and told me how great that shot was for a new gun.
But, I never got good groups. All the shots were high 1-3 inches. All shots were to the right.
I assumed, incorrectly, that a little high at 25 yards would yield about on at 50 yards. However, my hits at 50 yards were at the top of the 10 inch target.
I switched lubes, several times. Each time the poi changed but still no good groups. I went to a thicker patch but the thinner patches required a tap on the short start with a hammer. Once started the ram rod was able to seat the ball without much trouble.
I used 20 then 15 and then 30 grains of powder. Results all the same, high hits and poor groups.
Before I left the range the fellow that had encouraged me earlier said,"the old timers used to say, that you wouldn't know where your hitting until the gun has been shot 100 times. If that is true, I'm about1\3 of the way there..
When I got home, I removed the ramrod and the end rib screw fell on the floor. The hole seems to be bore in the barrel at an angle. After a short struggle, I got the screw in at an angle with Loctite and I am hoping for the best.

 

[Greg B.]

My Crockett had the same screw hole problem. I finally got mine in after having to enlarge the hole in the rib a little. Loc tite and it’s been fine since. It does take a while for the barrel to settle in. Make sure everything stays the same when shooting groups. Same lube, same amount, same seating pressure, etc. I’m still playing with mine to find the most accurate loads and I’ve got around 300 balls through it. Mine shot best with .315 balls and pillow ticking. I use the Schultz 7/1 dry patching cut at the muzzle. Keep working and you’ll find a combo that works for you.

 

[doubleset]

So a couple of things here:

(1) Regarding the screw hole problem with the rib ... I encountered the same problem when I took the rib off and tried to put it back on. It was clear at that point that the rib was slightly bowed and that the screws would bend it flat against the barrel, but that if I put one or more of the screws in a bit too tightly to start, then the final one wouldn't go in. So I put each screw in only a turn or so as the first step. Each of them went in without cross-threading. Once the rib was on loosely in this manner, I tightened the screws in turn, and the rib ended up fully tight against the barrel. So I got away without enlarging any of the holes, but I won't say that this wouldn't be necessary for someone else.

(2) I wouldn't worry too much about the sights until I'd shot it more. Another possibility would be to see how someone else at the range shoots it and what they think. My problem with the original sights wasn't that they weren't dead-on (they were), but that I had a very hard time seeing that small brass front sight, and so I lacked consistency in sight picture. If your shots are hitting high, this MAY be because you're unconsciously elevating the front sight so it sticks up a bit above the top of the rear -- in order to SEE it -- and so you're really just aiming high. This doesn't mean that something like the silver nickel blade sight from TOW wouldn't help (it's more visible than the brass Crockett sight). But you might try putting a little white paint or fingernail polish on that Crockett front sight, and try it again -- concentrating on the sight picture. Then you'll have a better idea of what you're dealing with.

Also, at this point, you haven't shot the rifle enough to know how it's really shooting. You say you shot "from a rest". But what does that mean? And how much? Before I did anything about sight replacement, I'd shoot quite a bit (like at least 50 shots) at 25 yds. from a sandbag rest at a clear and reasonably-sized bullseye target (like 3"-4"), focusing on a consistent sight picture and cheek weld, and not canting the rifle. Don't be jumping around with different loads until you know you're doing everything right with a particular load (say 20 gr and a 0.015 patch at 25 yds). If under those conditions, it's producing good groups (i.e., as good as you can expect given however good your eyes are), then you don't have a particular problem with that sight. Then shoot at 50 yds and see what happens. I put at least a hundred shots through my gun before I started in the direction of changing the sights. And that's not because the original sights didn't work perfectly correctly. It was because I couldn't see the front sight well enough to get a good and consistent sight picture. The nickel blade from TOW helped that (and painting it white helped it), but I still wasn't happy with my consistency -- and knew the problem was still the visibility of the front sight. Sticking the fiber optic rod on top of it solved all the problems -- for me. But a lot of people who have posted on this forum about shooting the Crockett seem perfectly happy with the original sights. They just have better eyes than I do.

 

[Stub]

Hopefully I have the rib screw problem taken care of. Time will tell shooting will loosen the screw.

I am heading to town to see if I can find a screw with a better head to replace the tang screw.

I put orange nail polish on the top edge of front sight so I can see it more clearly.

I shoot off commercially made front and rear shooting bags. These are on top of cement shooting benches.

I've shot about 20 shots at 25 yards and 10-12 shots at 50 yards.

It's possible that my shooting style is part of the problem, I got a new to me 54 cal barrel for my TC Hawken and had trouble with that shooting high also. In that case a higher front sight corrected the problem.

 

[doubleset]

Hopefully I have the rib screw problem taken care of. Time will tell shooting will loosen the screw.

I am heading to town to see if I can find a screw with a better head to replace the tang screw.

I think I got mine at a True Value hardware store. But it took a while with a file and sandpaper in the drill press to downsize the head for that tang.

 

[Stub]

The hardware had a variety of screws of the right size and thread but none in the right length. I bought several screws of different heads and metals to try out. I shortened a brass screw with a flat blade head. The head is much more sturdy than the original screw. The screw matches the brass trim on the gun so it looks more like it belongs on the gun than the silver ones. If I damage the head on the brass screw it can be replaced for less than $1.00. Now the challenge will be to not lose the original screw.

 

[doubleset]

My original screw resides in my "small parts" gun box. Brass is a good choice and will look nice. I couldn't find one around here when I was looking and setteled for the SS. Brass is soft, but easy to replace. In those circumstances, I always buy a few. In general, however, I'm a fan of slotted heads only with hard screws.

 

[Stub]

I've wanted a brass punch to move gun sights. I ask about buying a brass punch whenever I go into a new hardware store. I almost always get a deer in the headlight look from the store clerk. Today, I bought a 1\4 inch brass rod. I cut off a 4 inch piece of rod to use as a punch. Hopefully the short rod will work as a punch and not damage my guns.

 

[doubleset]

You can get brass punches on Amazon. Grace is a pretty good brand. Of course places like Midway and Brownell's have them as well. You should probably have five or six sizes. For any gun work you may need steel punches too. You'll use them not only as punches, but as "pins" to align holes so you can then push the real pin through straight and easy by pushing out the punch. Gunsmith ("hollow ground") screwdrivers in various sizes are also a necessity. I have a set with a handle and replaceable tips, but I favor single drivers for real work. Again, Grace is a good but inexpensive brand. I also have some Delrin punches when I don't want to take a chance even with a brass punch. Or use a piece of hardwood dowel. All sizes of punches turn out to be extremely handy once you start working on guns. I don't think I could have done the trigger upgrades on my wife's AR-15 or my CZ-455 without using punches to align things at several points. They're real handy on both BP and modern handguns for that as well.

I strongly recommend getting a small brass/plastic hammer like the Lyman "Tapper Hammer" that has three different screw-in faces (brass, plastic, and steel). It has an amazing number of uses on guns and around the house. You can get a really cheap (but very useful) little hammer with brass and plastic faces at Harbor Freight. Might find some punches there too.

The brass rod is useful approach, but I bet it cost more than a punch would have cost you.

We're way past the point where we can have reasonable expectations of a "hardware store" having actual hardware or a variety of tools. But they sure do have a lot of lawn care products, grills, car washing supplies, lawn/patio furniture, etc. And they must be real high quality as measured by the prices.

Oh, I'd beware on that TOW sight of using the brass punch. It's a copper base and that's softer than brass. Use wood or plastic on it.

 

[Stub]

Once again thank you for all your useful information!

 

[Stub]

I think I've located the cause of my gun shooting high. It is the lose screw thats behind the trigger (Me). On club match day I took 2 guns, my usual 54 and the Crockett. I arrived early and shot the 32 resting on my hand which was supported by a stack of lumber, at 25 yards. This resulted in 2 shots 1\2 inch low and 1 inch apart. I moved to 50 yards. 2 shots fired. They hit a inch high and 2 inches apart. At 100 yards one shot hit way left (wind) but in middle of target. The next shot was high middle target. So, 25 and 50 didn't look too bad. The match is 3\4 25 & 50 yard shots. The I wasn't concerned about winning the match (too many better shots than me) so I decided to use the 32 in the match.
The first two shots at 25 yards hit high in the 5 ring with center hold, freehand. I aimed lower, the next shot was high in the 6 ring. The last 2 shots I held 6 o'clock and they hit med 7 ring high. all the shots were much higher than before the match from rest.
Moving to 50 yards x sticks the shots were all 2 inches right in vertical string. 3 shots were in the black.Then we did 50 yard freehand. My first shot was high almost off the target paper. No more center hold, I held at 6 o'clock and two of the 4 shots were in the 10 ring.
At 100_yards with center hold I hit once per 5 and that was low.
The only difference between the shots before the match and during the match was me.
When shooting free hand I generally fire as the bulls eye comes under my front sight as the gun is rising. I think the gun continues to rise as I fire putting the hits high. Shooting from rest results in hits mid target. 100 yards with the 32 is anybody's guess.

 

[hanshi]

How long ago did you get that rifle? I got mine from Midway at the end of Sept. in 2021. I wonder if it may have suffered from being made during the Covid scourge (which hit parts of Europe particularly hard).

I got the Crockett maybe "20" years ago. I found it at the LGS in town. It had a wood ramrod, a 3/4" barrel, lock was satisfactory and never caused a problem in all those years. I cleaned the rifle and stepped outside to set up a target. Off the bench at 25 yards the group was not much larger than that tiny .311" ball. It never let me down but the squirrels never knew.

 

[Stub]

One thing was new for me at the match. I had been using a patch lube made of beeswax\Crisco mixed 50-50. I had been swiping the barrel between shots. Following a suggestion, I used a Dry lube mixed 1\7 on the same patch material. Again swiping between shots. It was nice that the dry lube wasn't as messy as my grease lube however the fouling was much worse.

 

[Greg B.]

The dry patches definitely leave more fowling. I settled on that method because it gave me the best consistent accuracy. That said, I keep playing with other combos hoping to find a lubed patch that works as well for me.

 

[Stub]

There was more black fouling as I swiped between shots, but that wasn't a problem. After the match I always do a light cleaning before I leaving the range. Usually a few patches with solvent yields fairly clean patches. Not this time. At home usually a little soap and water pumping and the bore is clean and ready to dry and lube. This time I pumped soapy water and changed patches until I had a big pile of patches. I then switched to Simple Green and the patches started coming out fairly clean. At the end I still didn't have patches that were as clean as I like. I used some WD-40, dry patches then Barricade. I'm going to have to clean some more in a few days, but my Grand kids need my attention for a few days.

 

[Maven]

Stub, et al., You may find this information on offhand shooting helpful: Offhand Shooting Technique

 

[Stub]

Maven
Thanks for the tip, it was good reading.

 

[Maven]

You're most welcome Stub. One more suggestion about patch lube(s). Long ago I tried [the late] Dutch Schoultz's dry patch method and didn't care for it at all. However, since you already have Ballistol, try a 1 Ballistol : 6 (or 7) water. You can shoot almost all day with it if you keep your patches just shy of dripping. If you want a "grease" lube, e.g., for hunting when you don't want a wet patch in the bbl. all day, especially if the temperature is < freezing, google Stumpy's Moose Snot. It's easy to make (You don't have to use castor oil if it's hard to find in your locale. Peanut oil will work too) and you can get as many as 6 shots off before you need to swab your bore. A small caliber, however, may require more swabbing even with Stumpy's,
but not with the wet mixture I mentioned earlier.

 

[Grenadier1758]

I, too, prefer the damp patch with 1 part water soluble oil (Ballistol or NAPA Cutting Oil) to 7 parts of water. This is a great patch lubricant for use at the range. An oil lubricant such as Track of the Wolf's Mink Oil is probably a better choice for hunting as it won't dry out when left in the barrel a long time.