New Englander .54 problem

[OBX-TXN]

I have a New Englander .54 that appears to be in excellent shape except for a chip in the toe which to me is no big deal. I took it to the range equipped with .530 balls and an assortment of patches ranging from .010 to .018 all dry lubed w/ the Dutch Schultz method.

I settled on .011-.012 patches because more than that required absurd efforts. The patches were marked .015 on the package but the micrometer said between .011 and .012.

I started at 65 2f and all went well until 80 2f ... when I started having patch burn thru. It's not a huge deal because my granddaughter will hunt with this gun loaded at 65 or 70 2f ... she needs to keep her shots to 50 yds anyway.

But my question is ... for further load work with this gun should I try .520 balls and thicker patches. I have a ton of ticking at .017 and .018 ...

 

[excess650]

If you're happy with the groups you're getting with the thinner patches and charges lighter than 80gr, call it good. A deer at 50 yards won't know the difference between 70gr and 90gr.

IMO, a hunting load needs to be loaded without difficulty with the under barrel rod.

FWIW, I tried .475s and .480s in a TC .50 looking for the elusive magic combo and it didn't appear.

 

[Wes/Tex]

If you want to use the higher charge, just push down a lubed patch before loading the
patched ball. Two patches seem to do t he trick and is cheap.

 

[mooman76]

Not likely you will shoot better with smaller RBs and thicker patches. If you use an over powder wad or even another patch wadded up, it will help stop the burn through. Patches vary on thicknesses. Everyone measures differently and allot depends on how much they are compressed when measured.

 

[OBX-TXN]

I do have a bunch of pre-lubed patches of undetermined age ... heck they might be 15-20 years old. I'd much rather use up them than the wonder wads I was planning to use on conicals ...

 

[Dr5x]

I'm not sure there was a question in your post but my only moment is that 535 balls might give you a better fit.
2Æ’Æ’ is the best powder at that caliber but you might experiment with 3Æ’Æ’Æ’..
I am surprised that your patches began burning when you moved to 80 grains and not before. A burned patch is Daniel Boone's way of telling you patch material is too thin. So I figure the patch material was switched when you increased the powder charge.

Congratulation on have a grand daughter interested in hunting. They are rare.

Dutch choultz

 

[Wes/Tex]

Congratulation on have a grand daughter interested in hunting. They are rare.

Dutch choultz

Amen! :hatsoff:

 

[Wes/Tex]

I do have a bunch of pre-lubed patches of undetermined age ... heck they might be 15-20 years old. I'd much rather use up them than the wonder wads I was planning to use on conicals ...

Forget the conicals...just ram down one of the old patches before loading the patched ball. Bet the burn out quits!

 

[Loyalist Dave]

A deer at 50 yards won't know the difference between 70gr and 90gr.

It's been my experience that a deer at 100 yards don't know the difference with 70 grains of 3F and a .530 ball, whether it's from a New Englander OR from a Colerain on a flintlock.

LD

 

[BigBoreBLR]

Post some pics of the patches. They could be getting cut by the rifling instead of burning.

You could try another type of patch, but the same compreased thickness.

 

[BrownBear]

I settled on .011-.012 patches because more than that required absurd efforts.

That would be the deciding factor for me, burn or no burn. This is after all, for your granddaughter. My wife long ago taught me to keep her happy if I wanted a hunting partner. And difficult loading was one of the surest ways to lose her interest.

BTW- Her favorite load for deer hunting with her 54 cal is 60 grains of 3f. I tried to slip an 80 grain measure into her kit, going so far as even labeling it 60 grains. She caught on instantly! Just doesn't like the extra noise and recoil. Another keep-her-happy insight.

In fact the 60 grain charge slaps deer silly. She won't shoot deer past 50 yards (more keep-her-happy), and the deer can't seem to read that more powder is needed for a hunting load. We've never recovered one of her round balls from a deer, so I'm not about to climb on a soap box and insist she use heavier loads.

 

[OBX-TXN]

It's way off track but ...

When Jenny was 11 she came to me and said "Pahpaw, when my dad was 12 you took him deer hunting with a muzzleloader ... and when Uncle Billy and Uncle Seth were 12 ... you took them too. And I'm almost 12 and you haven't said anything to me about going deer hunting!"

And I said "Oh honey you couldn't kill a deer ..."

And she put her hands on her hips and proclaimed "You want to bet ...!"

 

[OBX-TXN]

She is the kind of person who wants to learn to do things for herself. She reloads the TC Hawken .45 she learned to shoot blackpowder with and can disassemble an AR down to the same level as a good infantryman.(That was her first move up from a .22)

I had originally thought of my Cherokee for her to hunt with but when I saw how she handled the recoil of a .308 I knew she could handle the .54 loaded to 65 or 70 2f.

We typically mountain bike to get back off the main road and the shorter New Englander is mighty handy then. (I have spinal stenosis and sometimes walking is very painful but for whatever reason I can bike pain free...)

And I'm glad to hear about the 60 3f being effective. On the plus side our deer are small. On the negative ... it's swamp and you want them to drop pretty quick ... blood trails get difficult in water ...

 

[BrownBear]

We typically mountain bike to get back off the main road and the shorter New Englander is mighty handy then.

You'd fit right in with a bud up here. He and his wife do virtually all their hunting via mountain bikes. In a couple of hours they can be back into places where NO ONE else hunts- beyond the reach of hikers, on trails too narrow for ATVs, and far from lakes where float planes can land.

The secret of their system is a pair of B.O.B. Bike Trailers. Haven't ever tried one myself, but they insist you hardly know it's back there even when the going gets rough. They haul in their camp for overnight trips, and they've hauled out lots of caribou and moose. Ought to be just fine for deer. The secret is the very low profile for controlling heavy loads.

Their one rule however, is "Never, ever, try to ride downhill with a load of meat. Walk it down. They haven't yet invented the bike brakes and tire treads that will control a heavy load of meat going down a steep grade." :shocked2:

 

[Dr5x]

What you are suggesting is to use an old patch between powder and patched ball which is what we have been calling a "Wad".
The cure all for the too thin shooting patch

Pt works but its like taking your sister to the Prom.

Dutch

 

[nkbj]

It's way off track but ...

When Jenny was 11 she came to me and said "Pahpaw, when my dad was 12 you took him deer hunting with a muzzleloader ... and when Uncle Billy and Uncle Seth were 12 ... you took them too. And I'm almost 12 and you haven't said anything to me about going deer hunting!"

And I said "Oh honey you couldn't kill a deer ..."

And she put her hands on her hips and proclaimed "You want to bet ...!"

You gotta love that!

 

[OBX-TXN]

That trailer is interesting especially it's light weight of 13.5 lbs. I have tried tying the deer onto the bike, then walking the bike/deer out which usually involves several attempts to get the deer tied so something doesn't get into the wheels. (One particularly grueling attempt at this that also involved swimming a canal ... when I finally got back there was a better deer standing right next to my truck ... )

And I've also used "deer karts" which I leave in my truck until I get a deer. That of course means retracing my trip ... and taking a chance that one of our many black bears doesn't claim my deer ... (On the Wildlife Refuge that doesn't allow bear hunting the bears are pretty aggressive.)

 

[BrownBear]

I'm sure the BOB folks had their reasons for rating their weight capacity at only 70 pounds (rough terrain maybe?), but my friend and his wife usually exceed that by quite a bit.

Doing the math on their moose hauls, I'm betting they're up around triple weight! That could go a long ways toward explaining their braking issues on downhills. :grin:

 

[OBX-TXN]

Not understanding "Pt" Dutch?

 

[OBX-TXN]

Post some pics of the patches. They could be getting cut by the rifling instead of burning.

You could try another type of patch, but the same compreased thickness.

Since Photobucket went crazy I don't know how to post pics ... but some look like a donut and others look like they are almost a donut (multiple small holes right in the middle) so I don;t think they are being cut by the rifling. A different patch material similar thickness might be a possibility.

Exactly why would not a slightly smaller ball and thicker (say .018) not be a solution ... ? Not arguing ... just curious ...