New Guy with questions

[monkr]

I want to get into black powder shooting. I would like to get a ruger old army but cannot afford it at this time. I was looking at a 1851 navy old silver that I could afford. Looks real sharp. My friend who shoots civil war re-enactment said these guns were not accurate and a pain to shoot. Would like someone elses input. I would appreciate any help for a first time old guy. Hope to learn alot from ya'll

 

[Homesteader]

I can't say much about that particular revolver, but if it's in good enough shape most smokewagons will do a pretty good job. Better than you'd think, probably. In my experience, anyway. Obviously they're not as easy to use as a modern CF, but that's not why we're drawn to charcoal burners, right?

My advice would be to read through some of the old posts on this site, and maybe pick up a book or two on muzzleloading from the library. You'll start to get specific questions, and there are a lot of talented & knowledgeable guys here who'll be happy to help you out.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Welcome to the forum!

I'm a revolver pistolero myself, and I believe that the Colt replicas shoot pretty darn well!

People who tend to not shoot well also tend to make excuses, including blaming their equipment. I shoot my black powder revolvers "out-of-the-box" and manage to win lots of competitions using them.

If you need any help, just ask! Lots of folks here to help you!

Dave

 

[Dphar]

I want to get into black powder shooting. I would like to get a ruger old army but cannot afford it at this time. I was looking at a 1851 navy old silver that I could afford. Looks real sharp. My friend who shoots civil war re-enactment said these guns were not accurate and a pain to shoot. Would like someone elses input. I would appreciate any help for a first time old guy. Hope to learn alot from ya'll

The Colt open tops are accurate. If you hace a good one you don't need a Ruger. But with all the import revolvers the quality varies. They should be reasonably tight, they should be well finished with no buffed down corners and they should have visibly deep rifling. These things indicate that the makers were doing a little better job.
I owned one Ruger years back and sold it because it was so big, heavy and ugly compared to the Colt. Its something Ruger made to cash in on the BP market.

The Colt Navy/Army are the fastest (period) gun fighting guns out there. Faster and more accurate for me on steel plates etc than the Colt SAA. Though once practiced up it is very good as well. But the SAA needs more use of the sights. The open top can simply be sighted down the barrel for ranges of 10 yards or even more.
One of the most accurate revolvers I ever owned was a Western Arms 1860 Army. It was very accurate even to 100 yards (6-8"). If loaded just right.
I did add a rear barrel sight to it because it was such a nice shooter.
If you buy one I personally would buy a Cimarron. They are imports but they are a little better quality (it varies with all italian makers depending on what the importer *wants to pay*) since Cimarron holds their feet to the fire a little better than some or at least has in the past. Cimarron Firearms has a website.


Dan

 

[Poor Private]

Heck there are old guys with experience, who still has questions-- Myself included. Each of us still run into things we need help with. And since I joined I found that this is the best place to come and get answers. :thumbsup:
I find that most BP pistols and longguns surprise alot of people in thier accuracy. I only have 1 center fire pistol, but I have 14 BP ones- guess which I prefer.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Heck there are old guys with experience, who still has questions-- Myself included. Each of us still run into things we need help with. And since I joined I found that this is the best place to come and get answers. :thumbsup:
I find that most BP pistols and longguns surprise alot of people in thier accuracy. I only have 1 center fire pistol, but I have 14 BP ones- guess which I prefer.

That's one of the many reasons that I'm still here! I'm still learning myself, including reading about the Rogers & Spencer revolver's accuracy on another thread where six shots made one ragged hole at 25 yards! :thumbsup:

Dave

 

[zimmerstutzen]

Everbody gotta start somewhere. I like the look of the colt guns, and own four colt repros. To me it seems that they are just slightly more effort to clean than a remington repro, There was some real junk sold over the years. Make dure the gun is checked out before purchase.

Yep the Ruger is heavier. But it is my favorite groundhog gun.

 

[Zonie]

You said, "I was looking at a 1851 navy old silver..."

Just a couple of thoughts here.

Many of the plated guns have a brass frame and although a brass frame is safe to shoot they must be shot with light powder loads.

The reason for this starts with brass being softer than steel it is easy to leave a dent in it.
When the gun fires, the cylinder is driven rearward with all of the energy that is driving the ball forward. When this happens the frame must stop the rearward movement of the cylinder and the area that does this is rather small.
That can cause the cylinder to 'hammer' away at this area until it is deformed and allows the cylinder to rattle back and forth.

Another weakness of brass framed Colts is the attachment of the cylinder pin.
The brass that holds it in place can move allowing the cylinder pin to become loose.

These things usually happen over a period of time if maximum powder loads are used in the chambers so, if the powder loads are kept on the light side they don't happen as quickly. In fact the gun may work quite well for thousands of light loaded shots.

Because the gun is plated, the only easy way to determine if the frame is brass is to use a magnet. Do this away from the hammer on the recoil shield.

As for the trigger guard, these were brass on the originals and they are brass on the replicas.
The grips back-strap was also brass on most of the originals although some steel back-straps were made.

As for accuracy that is pretty much the luck of the draw.
Some are quite accurate while others are doing good to hold a 8 inch group at 25 yards.

As with all muzzleloaders, each gun will have one or two powder and ball loads they like and many others they don't like.

If you intend to use your gun for fun shoots and plinking the gun your looking at will probably do just fine if it is in good condition now.

PS: If "old silver" means a steel gun without bluing and the frame is steel you can dismiss what I said above. :hmm:

 

[grampaJ]

If you can pick up an Uberti in any of the Remington or Colt styles, they will have a steel frame around the cylinder and will get you started without breaking the bank. My first C & B was a brass-framed "Sheriff" .44, shorter barrel 4 or 5" IIRC. My son-in-law still has it. Start anywhere and keep making smoke. GrampaJ in NC
BTW I've got a ROA that I love, too. .36 usually means "Navy" and Army's are .44. Hope that helps.

 

[Toomuch_36]

Heck there are old guys with experience, who still has questions-- Myself included. Each of us still run into things we need help with. And since I joined I found that this is the best place to come and get answers. :thumbsup:
I find that most BP pistols and longguns surprise alot of people in thier accuracy. I only have 1 center fire pistol, but I have 14 BP ones- guess which I prefer.

That's one of the many reasons that I'm still here! I'm still learning myself, including reading about the Rogers & Spencer revolver's accuracy on another thread where six shots made one ragged hole at 25 yards! :thumbsup:

Dave

I shoot '58 Remmingtons myself.
But regardless of that. The model, Colt, Rem., Spitler & Burr, Lemat or ect. You can manage accuracy like this only by working up a good load and getting lots of practice, not by the type of the gun.

Toomuch
.........
Shoot Flint

 

[bkovire]

if you have 160$ check out Cabela's, if you don't, try going to a pawn shop, you can lock feel, test how it spins remove the cyl, look down the brl, take a friend that knows his/ hers stuff if you don't. i have bought many a good gun by doing this in fact i have a chance to get a gpr 54 250$ looks like its been smokepoled 2-3 times, and know they don't clean them up, just as is, aslso looking at the bison 44 23in brl with spair cyl. 175$

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Yes, I know what you mean :thumbsup: .

Some guns shoot straighter than others...some folks are just Pistoleros like me! That cloverleaf at 25 yards was done with a rest!

I usually don't brag too much...just enough to be recognized as pretty good shot :haha:

Take care and keep em in the black!

Dave

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Are you sure that's not the 12" barreled brass frame .44 C&B pistol? A 23" model would be really unique!

Dave

 

[bkovire]

yes i am, had to take a double look, i even measured it. the pawn broker said the fellow that took it in, had it made just for bison, had bad times, could not pay to keep it in, been in back for year or two, he found it day before i went in, thought it was a toy at first, it's the real deal. the pawn broke has known me for 10 years, i always get good deals, just wish i had money when it counts, hope it's not gone, won't be for another 3 weeks before i have spending money. :thumbsup: if it don't sell, it will be put in the back room, wish i could get in back, just to see what i could find!

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Sounds like a copy of a revolving rifle. I think that Colt made them, but I could be wrong. I know that Remmy made the 18" model, and Uberti makes a replica now of the 18" C&B.

Dave

 

[monkr]

:grin: Thanks guy you have been alot help. Thinking now about a 1858 army from cabelas for around $200.00. If I really enjoy it will save and get nicer gun.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Remember that there's a brass frame as well as the steel framed revolvers, and the steel frames will hold up better in the long run, especially if you "load it up" on occasion.

Keep 'em in the black!

Dave

 

[bkovire]

you could be right, it even comes with rifle stock. looked on int, could not find ifo. for it. found others like it, not the same. its brass framed.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Uberti makes the steel framed model with 18" barrel and a shoulder stock. I've shot a friends...it's a real HOOT, just got to remember where to put your hands and where NOT TO!

Dave