New shot pouch

[Brokennock]

Been working on 3 more bags, one for someone who wanted one like my 1st one. And two others of slightly different design and construction.
Here is my 3rd bag, second design. A tiny bit wider than my 1st, and definately deeper, but, no center divider, and folded across the bottom and stiched up the sides, with a larger inner pocket on the back wall with a matching one outside on the back. Using one of the "designer double shoulders" from Tandy that I picked up a while back, and cheating using precut leather strap. Antler buttons were hand made by myself. Hemp thread used throughout. Some pics were taken when the bag itself was about finished but the strap and back flap/button was not.

Thanks for looking. Comments, questions, critiques?

 

[necchi]

Looks good,

critiques?

,Slow down,, make things "straight" instead. Roll/curve the cut of material in your lower corners so you don't have all that extra material there,, that's why your corners don't tuck out clean.
Honestly looks good, simply offering constructive critique :thumbsup: :redface:

btw,, that not a shot pouch.

 

[Brokennock]

It's also not a "possibles bag".

Thanks for the tips. Not sure i'm following you on the "make things straight" critique. I do have a tough time making straight square cuts, even using a roller cutter along a straight edge. Unfortunately my working conditions/area are primitive and cluttered at best.

 

[necchi]

I didn't know constructive critique pandered excuse, :idunno:

p.s., "shot" is/are small particles of lead or other sometimes uniform used in a smoothbore for various reasons.
"shoot" is a different word with many forms like shooter, shooting, shooters.

p.s.s Or you could just call it a bag, or a leather bag, or thing to carry things in.

 

[Dane]

Wow!
Please don't ask for comments or critiques if you don't want them.
Here's mine.
Not bad for your first attempts.
You still have a lot to learn.
You asked.

 

[Brokennock]

What?! I never said I didn't want them, nor was I try v to make excuses, I was seeking clarification on what was meant by making things straight, and offering the assumption that it was some edges not cut square. And I'm not sure how that effects the corners.
I don't even care if you think it sucks, say so, and be clear as to why.

Oh well, I'm sure I will get more clear comments and advice from folks like BrownBear and Artificer.

 

[Artificer]

p.s., "shot" is/are small particles of lead or other sometimes uniform used in a smoothbore for various reasons.
"shoot" is a different word with many forms like shooter, shooting, shooters.

p.s.s Or you could just call it a bag, or a leather bag, or thing to carry things in.

The terminology "Shot Pouch" Brokennock is using is correct nomenclature for the 18th and early 19th centuries.

Short answer from George:

"Shot pouch and shot bag are the only terms I've ever seen used for that item in all the old literature I've read. All other terms are modern, IMHO." http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showpost.php?post/1581279/

Spence has also provided a number of period documentation quotes to back that up on the forum.

Spence has made a very good argument for using period terms, on more than one occasion, even for someone like himself who is not a reenactor.

Since there is a lot of confusion on the original terminology of "Shot Pouch," more recently I have been using the term "Shooting Pouch" so more modern readers know what we are talking about, even though that is not period correct.

Now what REALLY gets confusing to the modern reader is when they talk about "Shot" and "Balls" in period literature from at least the late 17th century through the early 19th century.

Most of us are aware of the term "Balls per pound" when they talked of bore sizes in the period. So that is perhaps/probably the most widely recognized period term for what we usually call "balls" today. They also used the term "Ball Bag" for a small pouch carried on the belt that held either Balls and/or what we modern folks call "shot." They also used the term "Ball Screw" for what we call a Ball Puller.

However, back in the period it really can get confusing to the modern reader when they talk about "shot" and really mean what we call "balls."

I know the first time I read "Colonial Frontier Guns" by T.M. Hamilton, I kept seeing many period references to what we would call "balls" and they called "shot." They seemed to distinguish different types of "shot" by names like Rupert shot, swan shot, rabbit shot, etc., etc. for what we would call modern shot used in shot guns or smoothbores. However, they also used the term "shot" for the single large balls used in smoothbores or rifles.

Gus

 

[Artificer]

I guess it is too late for me, because I kept trying to figure out if I was looking at one pouch or two pouches. Took me a bit to figure out it was only one pouch. :redface: :haha:

More coming later on today when I'm more awake.

Gus

 

[BrownBear]

I do have a tough time making straight square cuts, even using a roller cutter along a straight edge. Unfortunately my working conditions/area are primitive and cluttered at best.

Dunno how this thread attracted all the fluff and snot, and it embarrasses me for the site that you'd get it when asking for critique and help. Hopefully I can give you at least a glimmer of what you're asking for.

As for cutting straight, first time I've heard anyone being criticized for not cutting straight when so many guys are turning out "primitive" bags that are anything but straight. In fact yours looks like a pretty credible home-built by a guy looking for functional beauty using the tools and materials he has at hand.

If you really want to "color within the lines" and make straight cuts with leather (not saying you have to or should even think about it unless you want it), soft leather and those pizza cutters are a bad mix unless the leather is pulled tight. Then you have to make sure the leather is evenly tight in all directions so it doesn't go wonky as the cutter relieves the tension.

My best luck with soft leather is to cut a pattern out of cardboard or stiff paper, lay the leather out smooth and flat, then trace around the pattern with a sharpy. If you're going to use the pizza cutter, put a stiff straight edge down along your lines, press hard on the straight edge, then roll away. But with that soft leather I prefer to us a box cutter (right along with the straight edge and pressure), or better yet big sharp scissors.

I wish I could remember whoever famous said it, but they got it right: "Damn the torpedoes. Full Speed ahead." And to heck with teachers who tell kids that they have to color within the lines. :wink:

 

[Artificer]

More on cutting soft leather. The further one gets from the back or center of the hide, the more soft leather will stretch in every kind of direction, before and after the leather is cut out. IOW when one gets closer to the skin that had been the belly or legs, the leather is going to stretch differently and in more directions. You even run into this a little on Veg Tanned thinner leather.

So, even if one could get the edges of the pieces cut perfectly straight on soft leather, they are going to curl/stretch "out of straight" when one tries to sew them to other pieces. (I believe Black Hand has mentioned before that deer leather that was used for Shot Pouches in the period, was not tanned "as softly" as it was for other items.)

Gus

 

[PM]

Thats a great desing with a few new to me features. I like how you attached the top flap, it looks like it could take some rain without soaking into the leather. I also like how you have the flap over the inner pocket. That could help keep me from reaching in the wrong side of my bag fishing through the just-in-case stuff to get what I need. I might sew one in my bag.

 

[Artificer]

Your stitching is getting cleaner. Good job.

It has struck me that this is an "almost reversible" pouch. Never seen or heard of this design, though you used elements of Wallace Gusler's original Virginia Shot Pouch; so please let us know how it works out after you have used it for a while.

Gus

 

[silly goose]

I'm no expert, having only made a few for myself, but I like what I'm seeing. Great way to get through the winter, ain't it. Good job.

 

[Silky921]

Practical and not too fancy. Looks good from my end.

Feel free to share more pictures.

 

[Pete44ru]

I guess it is too late for me, because I kept trying to figure out if I was looking at one pouch or two pouches. Took me a bit to figure out it was only one pouch.

When I studied/compared all the pics, I saw a single bag with double patches - one pouch has an antler button, the other appears to have no closure device.

I like it.

Methinks it's innovative, and shows workmanship that doesn't smack of commercial production, or that of what a costly professional would turn out for their patrons.

I hope you post some pics after the strap/etc is finished - will you sew on a patch knife sheath, or a short starter loop ?

In any event - :hatsoff:

 

[Brokennock]

Thanks. I'm trying to use as much inspiration from the few originals I've seen pictures of, yet still address my needs as I find them. Thus, the flap closure over the inner pocket. with the divided bag I first made based on Gussler's original Virginia pouch I find my self trying to return items to the front pouch and getting hung up on the rear one, the bag is very small and tight, great for hunting, not so much for repeat shots on the range.

Pete44, some pics should show the strap and button attachment of it. Nothing fancy, and no short starter or patch knife sheath as I don't use either. At some point I'll take some pics of?with a sheath I made for a belt knife that is designed to hang from the strap behind the bag.

Silky, Another topic of another, much simpler, bag is forthcoming.

Thanks for the responses, compliments, and help.

Gus and B.B. I'm not ignoring your posts, I'm still digesting them, thanks, appreciate the help.

 

[omarick1948]

Nice work on your first leather bag. Oh No! Now I did it. Someone will correct me that it is a hide bag and not a leather bag.

I do think that the turtle and cross stamping's give it a bit of a Tandy's decoration effect.!

 

[necchi]

Oh for cryin out loud.
no-body can tell folks how to make it better?

 

[Brokennock]

So how do I, "Roll/curve the cut of material in your lower corners so you don't have all that extra material there,,"? Just trying to clarify your constructive critique.

 

[necchi]

Ok, what's with those bottom corners?
did you cut them at an angle like that?
do you intend for them to be presented like that?
is it "maybe" difficult to make them present like a corner because there is too much material there to push out and still look, ok,?

Ya know I can coddle like everyone else,, and you can pretend that you don't see what I refer too,,

I also said that if you slowed down in your rush to crate another bag,, you could probably make the cut's and stitching look a little more coordinated to each other.
The guy that "year's ago" in "primitive" setting's doing "the best he could",, wouldn't have to be in a hurry to take a photo to post for others approval.

Somebody here told you to stretch the leather before you cut it with a rotary cutter? Right?
Yeah, sure, stretch the leather before cutting,, not as you cut it.
It's not all about "If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen".
What I'm shocked about here isn't "took many cook's spoil the broth".
What's actually happening here is too many Chef's in the Restaurant and they all have their own menu.
Kudo's to ya friend, your doing all right,, slow down,, straighten things up.