Chaco24
32 Cal
How do I measure the barrel\cylinder diameter and where do I purchase the required tools?
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New to cap & ball revolvers
- Thread starter Chaco24
- Start date
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Dial caliper will do. Measure barrel at bottom of rifling to get max barrel diameter. In a perfect world it should measure 0.44 for a 44. But manufacturing of reproductions can vary some. It might measure 0.445 or 0.45. I have a Kentucky rifle in 45 that measures 0.456.
If the barrel max is 0.44 and the cylinder bore is less then the projectile is not meeting barrel max causing minimal rifling engagement, riflings are only 0.003- 0.005 high to start with, poor gas seal and can cause projectile to skip over riflings loosing its spin. A more preferred cylinder bore would be 0.449. This insures projectile enters the slightly tappered barrel entrance and swedges down to fit barrel max.
An example is my walker. The 0.435 cylinder bore was delivering a projectile that barely engaged the riflings and left a visible gap to barrel max diameter. On a lighter load revolver I would bring cylinder bore up to 0.449. Since the Walker is a heaveier load revolver I brought it up to 0.451. Now the projectile has no excuses not to fit barrel max.
rodwha
58 Cal.
To get an accurate measurement you’d need to seat a ball in a chamber, remove the nipple, and push the ball out. For the barrel you’d drive a ball through the barrel and measure the lands and grooves.
This is the barrel measurements from my 2013 NMA:
host a picture online
This is the barrel measurements from my 2013 NMA:
host a picture online
drobs
32 Cal.
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.457 diameter ball will work just fine - it will shave a larger ring of lead and will require a little more effort to load. This company sells a loading tool to give you more leverage.
https://www.badmanbullets.com/OnlineStore/proddetail.php?prod=SliX-Hand
Cheaper to just fashion yourself a cheater bar out of a piece of plastic or copper pipe.
When you finish off the box of .457, buy .454 diameter ball. Easier to load.
Pietta revolvers are set up for Remington #10 caps. They should have no problem setting off Pyrodex RS (FFg).
Regarding cleaning the new gun. I like to wipe down my new guns to get all the factory grease off of them.
I'll hit the chambers with Que-tips. If you watch Duelist's videos, he recommends putting anti-seize grease (choke grease) on the threads of the nipples. I've been putting a little bore butter on the nipple threads and find it works just fine. Either will work.
Before shooting with a new gun, I'll snap caps on each chamber / nipple. This usually clears the nipples of any factory grease.
For shooting - I use the following for all my Pietta 44's (5 of them):
30gr FFFg black powder, wonder wad or felt wad, .454 diameter ball and Remington #10 caps.
Fun thing about about black powder is you can load mild to wild. Can load as little as 10 to 15grs of powder with a wad or filler, all the way the way up to what the chamber will hold. In the case of the Pietta 1858, I can get 40gr of FFFg powder in the chamber (filled to the rim) and still press a ball on top of it.
Using wool felt wads (aka Wonder Wads) under the ball, I like to put a dab of bore butter between the wad and the ball as it puts the lube down the barrel where you want it. You can also put lube on top of the ball if you want to skip the wads. I find this to be more messy as the lube in the adjacent chambers to the one being fired spread their lube all over the outside of the gun and your hands. Either works well enough.
For cleaning the gun after shooting - water (cold, hot, room temperature) works just fine. Follow water by the gun oil of your choice. I use my garden hose to flush out the barrel and cylinder. I then use patches on the barrel and Que-tips for the chambers and hammer.
I finally found a can of Ballistol in stock at a guns hop and have been using that for my final lubrication of the gun before storage. Some folks will mix Ballistol with water in a spray bottle (Moose Milk) and use that. I mixed up a bottle to try.
Regarding measuring chambers...
Shoot the gun for awhile and see how it does on paper before concerning yourself with that.
Note these cap & ball revolvers shoot high at normal pistol range distances (21ft). I find it's best to aim at the base of the target.
Have fun!
https://www.badmanbullets.com/OnlineStore/proddetail.php?prod=SliX-Hand
Cheaper to just fashion yourself a cheater bar out of a piece of plastic or copper pipe.
When you finish off the box of .457, buy .454 diameter ball. Easier to load.
Pietta revolvers are set up for Remington #10 caps. They should have no problem setting off Pyrodex RS (FFg).
Regarding cleaning the new gun. I like to wipe down my new guns to get all the factory grease off of them.
I'll hit the chambers with Que-tips. If you watch Duelist's videos, he recommends putting anti-seize grease (choke grease) on the threads of the nipples. I've been putting a little bore butter on the nipple threads and find it works just fine. Either will work.
Before shooting with a new gun, I'll snap caps on each chamber / nipple. This usually clears the nipples of any factory grease.
For shooting - I use the following for all my Pietta 44's (5 of them):
30gr FFFg black powder, wonder wad or felt wad, .454 diameter ball and Remington #10 caps.
Fun thing about about black powder is you can load mild to wild. Can load as little as 10 to 15grs of powder with a wad or filler, all the way the way up to what the chamber will hold. In the case of the Pietta 1858, I can get 40gr of FFFg powder in the chamber (filled to the rim) and still press a ball on top of it.
Using wool felt wads (aka Wonder Wads) under the ball, I like to put a dab of bore butter between the wad and the ball as it puts the lube down the barrel where you want it. You can also put lube on top of the ball if you want to skip the wads. I find this to be more messy as the lube in the adjacent chambers to the one being fired spread their lube all over the outside of the gun and your hands. Either works well enough.
For cleaning the gun after shooting - water (cold, hot, room temperature) works just fine. Follow water by the gun oil of your choice. I use my garden hose to flush out the barrel and cylinder. I then use patches on the barrel and Que-tips for the chambers and hammer.
I finally found a can of Ballistol in stock at a guns hop and have been using that for my final lubrication of the gun before storage. Some folks will mix Ballistol with water in a spray bottle (Moose Milk) and use that. I mixed up a bottle to try.
Regarding measuring chambers...
Shoot the gun for awhile and see how it does on paper before concerning yourself with that.
Note these cap & ball revolvers shoot high at normal pistol range distances (21ft). I find it's best to aim at the base of the target.
Have fun!
The manual is written for a reason, they know what they "manufacturer" and offer proper instruction for the proper care and feeding of what they manufacturer.
YouTube does not manufacturer anything but unfound untruths for the most part.
Chain fire comes from the back end of the cylinder, flame coming into the "nipples" with an improper fitting cap(s). With a proper fitting ball which shaves a lead wring when seating, it is impossible for a chain fire to occur from the front of the cylinder.
Shame folks keep spouting untruths.
Chaco24
32 Cal
I also bought one of these to make loading easierrodwha
58 Cal.
As to loading various diameters, there’s a fellow who chronographed his various loads and published them. What he noted in his NMA was that with the same powder load but an increase from .451” to .454” to .457” was that the velocity increased with the ball diameter. It’s believed that this is due to the slight increase in bearing surface, and therefor friction, of the longer driving bands and added weight. It may also been to grossly undersized chambers where the longer driving band leaves more lead to easier obturate into the grooves for a better gas deal. This was noted in his .31 cal Remington when he used a much wider ball.
http://poconoshooting.com/blackpowderballistics.html
http://poconoshooting.com/blackpowderballistics.html
8 BORE
50 Cal.
You are absolutely correct. Never had a chain fire. I put corn meal over my powder chg, then ball. Caps have to correct size and fit tight.a little vasoline over the caps AFTER THERE PUT ON THE NIPPLE may prevent a chain fire
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To be accurate you need a dial caliper or 1"mic and you need to drive an over size slug in the bore and cylinder throat. Measuring the cylinder throat can be accurately accomplished with a spit ball gauge as well.
I drive an over size ball in a barrel muzzle or cylinder throat then carefully center a sheet rock screw and pull it back out. Screw it most of the way through the ball and it will further expand it. Lube the bore with some gun oil first so you can pull out the expanded ball easier. Put the screw head in a vice and pull the revolver or cylinder away from the ball and screw.
Now you have a true diameter to measure.
One more tip when measuring a bore and more importantly a chamber mouth, cross measure at 90 degrees. You will occasionally find the hole is not perfectly round. This really shows up when you ream them a bit larger.
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For what it is worth, I've never measured the bore or chambers on my cap and ball revolvers. I mostly plink with them with a little target shooting. I've hunted rabbits with them in the past and accuracy for my purposes has been ok. My pistol skills are such that fine accuracy is not an issue. I've shot a few of my black powder pistols(revolvers and single shots) off of bags and they all shot much better than I can hold off hand.
mwsalter
32 Cal
Here is a photo of an original and a Pietta. My dad bought the original as a kid in the ‘30s for $2.50 which was a small fortune back then.
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I have a Pietta kit remington from the late 1970s and have shot a lot of .451s through it. It works well with .454s too. I haven't shot many .457s in it because they load a little harder and I have molds for both .451 and .454.
8 BORE
50 Cal.
A lot of the older ones shool well with.451 balls.
The ruger old army is 45. 457 correct.
8 BORE
50 Cal.
I think all ROA are .457
Chaco24
32 Cal
This is just 1 of the many videos I watched before deciding to go with the .457 round ball
8 BORE
50 Cal.
What brand of revolver was used in the video. ?
I have rammed .457 in mine. NOT easy but I wasn't concerned about the raming lever? Shot a tight group, bit better than .454
scrubby2009
Pilgrim
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Welcome to Cap and Ball shooting fun. I like the aesthetic balance of the Sheriffs Model, but have spent years with an 8" barrel in my hand, gotten pretty comfortable. Hope to see a "range report" from you soon! May I also encourage you to check out Mark Hubbs' videos, Eras Gone for the excellent correct bullet molds they offer. I've been building paper cartridges at home for a year now after three decades of fighting loose ammo. It's time consuming on the building end, but makes range time and reloads while hunting so easy.
I spent about four hours building 100 rounds, that included packaging them up in packets of 6 each. When hunting or wandering the woods, I throw a couple of these packets in my pocket along with a tin of #10 caps. I use Fiocchi caps. Got a box years ago, like 100 tins of 100 caps each. Goex FFFg, about 25-27 grains in a Hemp Wide rolling paper. No misfires in hundreds of paper cartridges now.
I spent about four hours building 100 rounds, that included packaging them up in packets of 6 each. When hunting or wandering the woods, I throw a couple of these packets in my pocket along with a tin of #10 caps. I use Fiocchi caps. Got a box years ago, like 100 tins of 100 caps each. Goex FFFg, about 25-27 grains in a Hemp Wide rolling paper. No misfires in hundreds of paper cartridges now.
rodwha
58 Cal.
I’ve always loaded .457” balls into my Pietta even when it had 0.446” chambers. It didn’t take a lot of effort to load. I’m sure it’s easier now with 0.449” chambers, but the difference was lost on me I guess.
Once I found I grabbed the wrong bag of balls and ended up with my .490” balls. After shooting up the conicals I brought I pulled out the bag of balls and tried them in my Ruger since it’s much stronger. Now those took some effort and I only loaded up the one cylinder. I wouldn’t do that again unless I really needed to. The ring those left could practically be sold as children’s rings for their fingers!
Once I found I grabbed the wrong bag of balls and ended up with my .490” balls. After shooting up the conicals I brought I pulled out the bag of balls and tried them in my Ruger since it’s much stronger. Now those took some effort and I only loaded up the one cylinder. I wouldn’t do that again unless I really needed to. The ring those left could practically be sold as children’s rings for their fingers!
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