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broknaero

40 Cal.
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And Black Powder for that matter. I am an experianced shooter and reloader with modern centerfire rifles and shotguns. I have an interest in Hunting with flintlocks. ! for small game and one for big game. Pennsylvania's flintlock only season.

I have some questions and I'm sure there are things I dont even know enough about to know I need to ask questions.

My hunting will be mostly traditional with patch and round ball. What size ball do I use? SaY for instance with a .32 Cal flintlock. I know I dont use a .32 Cal round ball. Theres .310, .311, and .315 balls available, I'm sure theres more. What ball would I use with a .32 cal? I also see different thickness of patches. How do they work with the different sized round balls?

Powders... Theres so many types. I understand the difference in ffg, fffg, and ffffg. What I mean is what brand? Pyrodex, Tripple Seven, or what? Pros and Cons.

I'm just getting a cheepo flintlock long gun in .32 to shoot paper, squirrels, woodchucks, and whatever with to just get used to flintlocks. I have no one close to get me into Flintlock hunting, I'm doing this on my own. What advice and suggestions do you experianced Flintlock shooters and hunters have for me?
 
What size ball do I use?
You are correct in that you use an undersize ball with the greased patch making up the difference. Exactly what size ball will depend on your barrel. You can experiment with different sizes of ball and patch thicknesses until you find the most accurrate load.

Powders... Theres so many types. I understand the difference in ffg, fffg, and ffffg. What I mean is what brand? Pyrodex, Tripple Seven, or what? Pros and Cons.

None of the above. Flintlocks need real black powder. All the above are substitute black powders and will cause all sorts of ignition problems. USE REAL BLACK POWDER.

What advice and suggestions do you experianced Flintlock shooters and hunters have for me?

Don't get an "el cheapo" flintlock. You can get a reasonably priced/quality one that will work well, but a cheap flintlock will give you more grief and frustration than you want. Ask about what you have in mind and people here will let you know if its a good one or not.
 
Im looking at a Cabelas Blue Ridge made by Pedersoli. I've looked at the custom makers and havnt seen exactly what I want so I figured this would get me started on flintlocks until I found a larger caliber .50 or .54 that I couldnt live without.

Where do you find your real black powder?
 
broknaero said:
I'm just getting a cheepo flintlock long gun in .32 to shoot paper, squirrels, woodchucks, and whatever with to just get used to flintlocks. I have no one close to get me into Flintlock hunting, I'm doing this on my own. What advice and suggestions do you experianced Flintlock shooters and hunters have for me?

Please don't get an el cheepo flintlock!!!!! I went this route and really regretted it. A cheap flintlock will have a lock that is not TUNED PROPERLY and the frizzen will not be hardened properly and you WILL have ignition problems. You may even have to bend the cock (i did) to get the flint to hit the frizzen at correct angle.

BUy right the first time and you will be much happier in the long run! Cheap flintlocks take the enjoyment of out shooting a flinter and you WILL get frustrated.

What part of PA do you live in?
 
I'm in the same (or similar situation). I've shot a percussion gun for over 10 years and just recently decided to order a "rock lock Lyman .54 cal GPR" via Mid-South Shooters supply. The ship date (hopefully!), is July 5th.

Is this considered a "cheepo" flintlock and should I forget it?
 
The Lymans are good guns. They are one of the few decent factory flinters. Midsouth should ship before July unless they are backordered?
 
The response I've gotten is that they are back ordered. I've got a Lyman Deerstalker in percussion an it's worked well, I'm just not sure about flint. I've never ever shot a flintlock before.
 
Paco, I live in the Northeast of PA.

I'm looking for a decent flint to get me started. I have dozens of centerfire, rimfire and shotguns. No Flintlocks. Just thought I would pick up a factory Flintlock in .32 to get me started and drag around. I dont mind spending as much as $2000 to $2500 for the "one" .50 or .54 I cant live without for Deer Hunting. I just didnt think Starting out custom was the best way to go. I didnt start squirrel hunting with a Cooper. Now I own several.

Idealy I would like to find a .50 or .54 Full stock,40+" Swamped barrel, Wooden patch box, Some simple stock carvings, Select Maple, Double trigger long rifle that can shoot straight with a patched round ball. That I'll go as far as $2000 or so for. No point in spending a ton more on something I will only hunt with a few days a year.

If the Pedersoli is no good what do you all suggest for a Long barreled full stock in .32 caliber that I can pop some squirrels with when I feel like? This doesnt have to be fancy, just to get a guy started.
 
I have a .45 Blue Ridge flinter. I've hunted everything from squirrels to deer with it. Like having two rifles in one, just by changing the powder charge. The lock is reliable and a sure sparker. The barrel is accruate enough for match work. The Pedersoli is the best production long rifle there is. I also have a .54 Lyman GPR flint, which is a great rifle. Unfortunately, they only come in half stock and .50 or .54 cal.
 
I think you'll be right Rebel. Never shot one yet but I will enjoy the challange. Not that hunting isnt challanging enough, I've archery hunted for 16 years now, but I think its time for a little flint and fire to spice things up.

Any suggestions from you experianced guys are more than welcome. As in my first post with this. Gear, powder, .32 cal to start. Ive read most of the posts in the history here. Alot of good stuff.

Talked to my usual gunshop owner I've know since we were kids. He tried to set me up with some flintlock with a camo stock and stainless barrel with fiber optic sights. He couldnt under stand what I ment by more traditional.

Thanks
 
Howdy Brok and welcome. First question, why a .32? I would suggest a .36 if you want a small caliber. A 32 will require more cleaning between shots or less shots between cleaning (swabbing out the barrel). Also more stuff available for a 36 than a 32. The Pedersoli flintlocks are ok for production guns (they make the Cabelas as well). You will need real black powder, Goex is pretty much available while Swiss & the others can offer some more expensive options. Use 3f for your main charge. Some folks here use 3f for their priming charge as well, it will depend on your gun and how easy it will be to find real BP. Read the sticky about flintlocks and do searches on this website. Check your touch hole and make sure it's big enough, very important to that quick shot. Also make sure it's in the right place, center of the pan and level with the top of the pan, not at the bottom. Try to keep an open mind and ask why. If someone makes a suggestion, ask why. They might a good idea why or they could be just doing what someone told them without any thought as to why. Here's an example.

Get a decent touch hole pick, you can make them out of nails with a good file. After you have loaded and have stepped up to the firing line (assuming your at a range) cradle you flintlock in your left arm, muzzle down range, lock up towards the sky. Using your touch hole pick, push it in as far as it will go (if shaped correctly, it should almost go the other side of the barrel) withdraw carefully. level the gun and using either a pan charger or priming horn, place about 3 grains of priming powder in the pan, towards the outside of the pan, away from the touch hole. Close your frizzen and fire. Now using the pick creates a "hole" in your powder charge, this exposes more powder to the flash generated in your pan. By "banking" your priming powder away from the touch hole instead of in the center of the pan, this will cause your flash to go towards the touch hole. With more powder exposed to more flash, there will be some folks who will think you're shooting a percussion gun rather than a flintlock. Good luck.
 
To select the right Ball and patch combination, YOU HAVE TO MEASURE both the bore diameter( land to land) and the Groove depth or diameter. The bore diameter, in thousandths of an inch will tell you what size ball will probably work the best. Generally, you want a ball that is .010" undersized compared to the bore diameter. Patch thickness is determined by the groove depth, that is, the depth of the groove measured against the lands. Some guns have grooves cut as deep as .012-.014". Others are much more shallow. The same size patch does not work well in both guns.

Then you also have to look at the width of the lands compared to the width of the grooves. If you have wide lands, and narrow grooves, you probably have to use a thinner patch than the depth of the groove measures, simply because you can't get the cloth patch into those narrow grooves as easily, or at all! Most barrels made today have lands and grooves of equal width.

I also recommend that you look at a .36 cal. rifle for small bore hunting, and shooting. These guns are very accurate and can be fired at short ranges with as little as 20 grains of 3Fg powder for squirrels and rabbits. Use about 30 grains for shooting out to 50 yds, for coyotes, fox, and ground hogs. The ball is so light in weight, I don't like to see it used to hunt anything out at 100 yds, because it just doesn't have much energy left at that range. They are accurate at 100 yds, and for paper shooting, use about 40 grains to maintain your same POA as you use at 25 and 50yds with the lower charges. Havin said that, I know of many reports of coyote and other varmints being killed at 100 yds with a neck or head shot using the .36 cal ball. A torso hit will kill them, but slowly, and that is just not what I personally think a hunter should be doing. Others disagree. There argument that a varmint is a varmint, and it doesn't matter if they die slowly or fast.

So, use a caliper( you can buy a dial caliper for as little as $20.00 from some of the suppliers), and take the caliber on the gun barrel with a grain of salt. They will be close, but rarely are you going to find a production gun where the bore is the exact diameter for that caliber. Even a few thousandths can alter the performance of the rifle with standard components. And, measure those balls you buy, or CAST, because they may also vary a few thousandths, requiring a change in thickness of patching for best accuracy.

It will take you about a year to adjust to a flintlock going off so close to your face, if you have been shooting percussion, or modern cartridge guns. There are numerous drills and systems to practice to learn how to ignore the flash, and concentrate on your front sight. Check Muzzleloading Accuracy topic on this forum for some of the ideas. If you find yourself frustrated by a " flinch " let us know and we can help you through it. All flintlock shooters go through this to some extent. Once you master it, you wonder why it ever was a problem.

Get Dutch Schoultz's Black powder rifle accuracy system to use in working up your load in the gun.
[url] http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/[/url]

As to guns, If you have any skills at all, I would think it would be worth your while to talk to the guys at TVM about acquiring one of their ' kits ", where they have done much of the work for you. For $700-$800 you can buy a semi-custom rifle that fits you, has good parts( lock and barrel) and will be in shooting condition with only some finishing work on your part.

I am having a .36 gun worked up for me with a 37 " barrel. I didn't want a longer barrel because this will be a small game only gun, and I don't even intend to use it on coyote, unless attacked!! :rotf: It is a flintlock, but I have been shooting a flintlock rifle in .50 caliber for more than 25 years. I bought the parts for this gun many years ago, but medical problems kept me from even beginning to work on it. The bore is being lapped, so that the land diameter at the muzzle end will be a few .0001" smaller in diameter than the bore diameter back at the breech. The muzzle will be coned, so I don't have to use a short starter to seat a ball. I want to make this as simple a gun to carry and use as possible, so I can use a belt pouch to carry everything I need to load and shoot the gun in the field. I am making a flat horn that i can carry in my back pocket with FFFg powder to both load the barrel and prime the pan with. At 20-30 grains per shot, frankly, a salt shaker would probably hold enough powder for a day's squirrel or rabbit hunting! I intend to go light, to give my back and legs a break. Old age, and all the war wounds one acquires during a life of doing stupid things makes one think of these things at my age.
 
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Well thanks for the advice guys. About the TVM kits I've looked at them. I'm seriously considering one for a winter project. Right now I have several "centerfire" projects to finish up. I've been hunting, shooting, reloading, and playing with wildcats for years. Just never got into the BP thing. What I'm reading on here is that I've been missing out. I've been playing with small caliber centerfires for years .14 to .20 cal. I think the .32 -.36 caliber flintlocks will be alot of fun.

Flintlocks seem like they would fit my hunting styles. I like as simple and challenging as I can go. I imagine it would be alot more enjoyable and personaly rewarding stalking within 50 yards of a woodchuck to get off 1 shot with a flintlock than to pop him at 300 yards with a .17MachIV. Ive archery hunted for small game the last 2 years. Rimfires and shotguns have lost alot of the challange for me. 1 shot with a flintlock would be a blast.

Thanks for the advice guys, I think I just found another expensive hobby to dive into.
 
you won't regret a TVM. I just got mine on saturday. It's a .36 southern rifle with a 42" long hammock barrel. I love it, and Matt and Toni are great to deal with
[url] http://www.avsia.com/tvm/south.htm[/url]

Josh
 
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I like the late Lancaster super premium maple, Wooden patch box, swamped 42" barrel, .50 or .54 caliber, and maybe some simple inlays. That would make a great deer rifle for me.
 

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