Newbie looking for suggestions and critique

[Yeti]

I've recently been bitten by the BP bug. In an effort to help myself quit smokeing I started researching and planning on building a muzzleloader for the experience, to hunt with, and for living history reenactment. With my wife's consent I am going to spend the money I save from not smoking on parts. I have my first installemnt of money available next week (aprox $400) to buy a few parts to get started with, and then buy the balance of parts in another couple months. I'm hopeing to have a completed smoothbore to go fowling with in the summer/fall. I've spent hours pouring over various suppliers website, message boards, and my local archives and library to come up with a plan. I now have a plan though I wanted to run it up a flagpole and get some feedback from folks who have experince in the hobby.

I live in Winnipeg, Manitoba and am naturally drawn to the early fur trade. Additionally, their are opportunites for liveing history reenactment for Voyageur and early settlement reenactment. I don't speak French and although a persona of a Scott or Irish HBC employee spending time drumming up trade in the interior is an easy fit for myself The English trade guns just don't capture my eye with their clunky trigger guards and simple furniture.

I am drawn to the French Fusils and am intrigued with building a functioning fine fowling piece that might meet all of my parameters.

What I have in mind at the moment is this. From Track of the Wolf purchase a Walnut Fusil stock pre-inlet for their new Jim Chambers Tulle lock and a 44" 16 guage Colerain fowler barrel. To that I would inlet myself the buttplate and trigger guard Track offers for their "type C" fusil in brass. To that I would add their double ringed fusil ramrod pipes. To complete the build I was going to contact Caywood Gunsmithing and hope to aquire one of the dragon/serpent sideplates he has been useing on his "type c" furniture on a fusil fin.

I was thinking of ordering the stock, buttplate and triggerguard next week and get busy inleting. From there I would look at buying the lock and begin inletting that. Finally I would purchase the barrel and the rest of the furniture.

I would really appreciate any feedback folks might have regarding my plan. I won't have a second chance at this purchase for a long while. As a final note, this hobby to date has been a significant factor in my being able to stay quit. For that I thank you all, and for reading through this long meandering post you also have my gratitude.

Clear skies and dry powder!

B.

 

[buzz]

I think you be on t pre inlet stocks
One the ones i have biult i did it barrel lock trigger then guard butt and timbles
On pre inletterd stocks you will still need do final fitting hopefuly
You will find it fun prodject it be hard stop a t one oth ers will chime in as im a rea greenhorn still in my biulding prodjects

 

The only thing I would say, is that I would drop it down to a 20 gauge instead of a 16.
Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with a 16 - I have one coming in the form of a Northstar West Officer's Fusil. But I also have a 20 gauge trade gun. 20 is a little easier to get accessories for and will do anything the 16 will do. If you ever decided to sell it for whatever reason a 20 might sell a little easier.

 

[DNICK]

you realy need to inlet the barrel into the stock first then you can locate the lock in the correct position and the trigger, then you can figure out what you need for length of pull and inlet the butplate

 

[Yeti]

I hadn't thought of the resale value of a 20 guage. Good point!

I was under the impression I might need to move the barrel back a touch after inletting the lock on a pre inlet stock to facilitate centering the touch hole without hitting the plug. Though that could be adjusted at the time. I hadn't considered adjusting the pull length, I'm not even sure that I would be able to know what is a good fit. I am 6'1" w/ common proportions and was thinking the default aproximate 14" would work ok. I'll have to research that some more and maybe adjust the order of installation. Thanks.

 

[jdkerstetter]

I would suggest that you order Tracks "plans" for the French Hunting Gun also. For $6.50, if nothing else, they will look good hanging over your bench.

The normal routine for building a gun is usually lock, stock and barrel first. The trigger guard is one of the last things I inlet.

The barrel is usually the first part inlet as the placement of everything else is measured off the barrel. If the precarve stock is inlet for the lock you will want to get the plate at least in to determine how far back the barrel needs to be set back for proper touch hole alignment.

Barrel or lock in first, then trigger, then you can establish your length of pull and install your buttplate.

There's a tried and true method to this madness. Have you visited Mike Brooks web-site? He has a tutorial there for building an English Trade Gun that will at least guild you.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/carolinatutorial.html

I strongly suggest you get a couple of good longrifle building books and study them before you invest or you will too quickly find that you can turn $700/800 worth of parts into a gun worth half that or less pretty quick.

Please do some more homework. Good luck. Enjoy, J.D.

 

I just reread your post and noticed the mention of the "clunky" trigger guards on English trade guns. If you are talking about some of the later English guns I agree. However, the earlier offerings from English traders bore strong resemblance to the French models.
Scroll down in this string http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/270256/
to see mine. This gun is available in kit form,in the white, and as a finished gun. It has a few nice little touches like "London" stamped on top of the barrel. I recognised a long time ago that my gun building talents produce guns worth less than the parts they were built with. I buy mine ready to go.

 

[MacRob46]

Track is a good place to buy your parts since they have a great selection and a lot of literature avaiable on building these things. If I understand you correctly, this is your first attempt at building a gun. A little warning in that regard. Pre-shaped, pre-inleted stocks can be a bit hard to work on in some respects. The inletling will not be perfect and you will have to do a lot of fitting and trying. I believe that all of Track's pre-shaped stocks have flat areas on the forearms which will make it easier to drill holes for your barrel retaining pins, etc. Just do not get the idea that this will be easy because it won't. I have built two kits using pre-inlet stocks and won't do any more. That was years ago and the quality of the pre-inlet stuff is much better now than it was, but it is still not as easy as it may seem initially. Collect all the needed tools and take your time and you should be OK. Send photos when it is finished.

 

[Birddog6]

you realy need to inlet the barrel into the stock first then you can locate the lock in the correct position and the trigger, then you can figure out what you need for length of pull and inlet the butplate

It is Precarved stock. thus you inlet the Lock 75%-95% of the way First, then you inlet the barrel to the correct position according to the vent liner placement.
In a precarved stock you cannot move the lock inlet, however you can move the barrel back, thus you do the lock First, barrel Second, Trigger inlet Third after the barrel has been pinned, then the Buttplate.

Keith Lisle

 

[Little Wattsy]

I dont know fowlers to much but having traded with several suppliers I will comment on that.. Track of the Wolf is Good. Pecatonica is Good-ER! In my opinion. You might look at this: http://www.longrifles-pr.com/fullstock.shtml or other parts/kits from them. The help/service that they offer before , during, and after is supurb!

Just an FYI...... :wink:

 

[DNICK]

thanks for the info I am assembling a chambers early Lancaster kit and their instructional video said to inlet the barrel first but I am willing to listen to someone who has done this before this is my first one. Duane

 

[tenngun]

Im just starting a nw gun, your sounds like a fun progect too. I think it was Maddona who said "so many guns to build, so little time"Though she may have been misqoted :rotf:

 

[Col. Batguano]

I think it was Maddona who said "so many guns to build, so little time"Though she may have been misquoted :rotf:

Nope. That was it. She's a moderator on the forum now.

 

[Yeti]

Thanks for the imput folks. I've put in my first order for parts and books. I'll defenitly be moving slow and researching everything I can get my hands on before takeing any irreversable actions.

I was a machinest for a decade, so the metalwork is in my wheelhouse, it's the woodworking I am going to really need to pay attention to. I'll be sure to post some pictures of my trials and tribulations.

Any suggestions of the basic, essential chisels to buy?

 

[MSW]

welcome to the forum!

if you don't already have a copy, i would recommend The Gunsmith of Grenville County, by Peter Alexander, as well as Recreating the American Longrifle (Shumway, et al). these two books will set you back some pretty serious coin, but are more than worth it if you count the money saved in parts you don't ruin. then there's the frustration you don't endure and the bad language you don't use, and the time you don't waste waiting for the replacement parts to arrive.

there are some nice chisels on Track of the Wolf's website... you need not go overboard- i bought most of my stuff o an 'as the need arises' basis, and i've found that i still use most of the tools i've purchased. beware of the "one-off" single use tool - these will eat up money like nobody's business!

Also, the secret (if you want to call it that) is to get the edged tools as sharp as you can. if you can't easily shave hair off your forearm, the tool is dull. all tools will be dull right out of the box, and anyone who tells you otherwise is wrong: i have yet to run across a tool which did not get sharper after i took it out of the wrapper and worked on it, including several straight razors. (thus endeth the tirade)

good luck with your build!

 

[jdkerstetter]

Any suggestions of the basic, essential chisels to buy?

As was just pointed out, buy 'em on an as needed basis...stay away from sets as they likely contain tools you will never use.

I will say though, if buying new, you do get what you pay for in carving tools. Don't skimp as you will just end up frustrated and chasing good money after bad.

At a minumum I would want a good set of bench chisels and an assortement of gouges in different sweeps.

Also look into sharpening systems (oil stones, water stones, diamond, etc.) and decide what is going to work best for you. MSW is on point, in that the best carving tools in the world are worthless if you can't sharpen them.

Don't forget about files, rasp and scrapers either. I find I use these more than chisels and gouges for stock shaping.

Enjoy, J.D.