Newbie stock refinishing question

[ryoung14]

Hi all,
I'm planning to refinish a rather rough T/C Hawken stock I bought off ebay with Tru-Oil. I've got an old unopened Birchwood Casey stock refinish kit, with Tru-oil, Filler and Stock Sheen, that must date back 20 years. Bought an extra kit after refinishing a Winchester M54 that came out nice. Is any of this stuff usable? I've heard that Tru-Oil should be fresh for best results.

The wood is rather plain. Any tips on which stain might make it look nice? I saw a Hawken on the web with a subtle reddish tone that looked good...but I don't know anything about stains.

Thanks.
Bob

 

[Swampman]

I'd use Fiebing's Med. Brown leather dye and Formby's Satin Finish Tung Oil cut 50/50 with turpentine. Your Truoil is probably bad. It doesn't hold up very well.

 

[Ohio Rusty]

I recently acquired a new .62 smoothbore made by Jackie Brown. Honestly, the stain finish sucks badly. It's splotchy and streaky. I was reading some stuff about minwax stain and they have a wood conditioner that is supposed to help even out a stain. I'll use that and I've decided to use their walnut color as I don't like the red color that Jackies' stain gave the stock. Minwax has alot of options for color. The darker walnut will make everything look much better in my opinion. I've not refinished a stock before, but to keep the sharp lines, I'll glue sand paper to a piece of wood. The will help me stop any rounding off of sharp corners. As for the rest of the sanding .... It will be just doing brain surgery and having zero experience..... No problems, Right?
Ohio Rusty

 

[Zonie]

I'd say if the Tru-Oil has not been opened, and it hasn't hardened in the bottle it should be fine.
Same goes for the other stuff in your refinishing kit.

You say: "...but I don't know anything about stains."

There are 4 basic kinds of stains. Water base, Alcohol base, Oil base and chemical acid or base stains (like aquafortis and lye).

Each has it's merits and demerits.

Water base stains can raise the grain of the wood requireing light resanding after application. It can be thinned with water allowing one to apply several light colored coats until they get the darkness/color they like.
Any water base stain color may be mixed with other colors, or you can apply several coats with each coat using a different color.
Water base stains are compatable with alcohol base stains.
These stains will require some type of oil finish to protect the wood.

Alcohol base stains are much like water base stains except they should be thinned with alcohol if you want to use the multiple application methods as mentioned for the water base stains.
Alcohol stains do not raise the grain, but usually cost quite a bit more (as does the alcohol for thinning them).
Alcohol base stains can be applied over/under water base stains.
They are available at good woodworking stores or at TOTW, MLB, and Dixie Gunworks.
They require an oil base finish to protect the wood.

Oil Base stains do not raise the woods grain but they do add oil protection to the wood. They can be mixed with other oil base stains but are IMO, difficult to thin and use as a multiple application product. There is a definite limit to how much oil the wood can absorb which limits the number of coats that can be applied.
IMO, these are pretty much a "what's in the can is what you get" product.
They are available at Hardware stores and similar places.

Chemical stains modify the wood to develop the color. There is little control over them although with aquafortis carefully applying heat will darken the treated wood. They are usually hazardous to use. They often require neutralization.
Aquafortis is difficult if not impossible to find locally. Lye can be found in the plumbing department of most hardware stores.

In my opnion, if you don't want to invest a lot of money in buying stains consider using Birchwood Casey Walnut Stain.
It isn't going to add any special colors to your stock but it does have three things going for it.
1. It is water base so you can thin it and apply a light coat. Look at the wet surface in the sunlight. If it isn't dark enough add more coats.
2. It isn't very expensive. Some of the Alcohol stains can run over $12 and the thinner is also expensive.
3. Most gun stores and Sporting goods stores carry it.

Everyone has their own likes and dislikes for stock colors. I think with a dark wood like Walnut it is easy to overdo it and end up with a black stock but some people like black.
Good luck to you and let us know how things come out.

 

[gmww]

Boy my limited experience with stock finish is the use of Laurel Montain Forge Antique stain and Tru-Oil. I couldn't be happier. I like to keep it simple and this was it for simple.

Good Luck! :v

 

[ryoung14]

Thanks, gentlemen, for the replies...and special thanks to you, Zonie, for putting that lesson on stains together. I've printed it out and will stick it in my notebook.

Probably the B-Casey walnut stain or the Antique stain gmww mentioned would be best. The simple approach is generally what works for me....heck, it's about all I can manage most of the time.

Thanks again,
Bob

 

[Black Hand]

Rusty,
Try stripping the finish off with a commercial stripper (I hear Zip-Strip works well) rather than sanding . You may need to do some finish sanding after the finish is removed, but there will be a smaller chance of rounding off the angles. Then stain to your liking and add your finish of choice.
Black Hand

 

[harryo]

Rusty,
Try stripping the finish off with a commercial stripper (I hear Zip-Strip works well) rather than sanding . You may need to do some finish sanding after the finish is removed, but there will be a smaller chance of rounding off the angles. Then stain to your liking and add your finish of choice.
Black Hand

I have used ZAR Paint & Varnish Remover to strip several T/C stocks. I like it better than Zip-Strip because it is water based and produces no noxious fumes, although you still need to wear rubber gloves and not let it contact your skin. It will start bubbling up the varnish that T/C uses almost immediately. Dab on a coat, let it sit for 5 minutes and clean it off with medium steel wool. Repeat this once more and you will have all the varnish removed. Use an old toothbrush to clean up the inletting.

Use 220 grit sandpaper and give the stock a light sanding. If you need to remove some shallow scratches, you can use 150 grit and then follow with the 220. Just take care not to take away enough wood to change the shape of the stock, unless there is something you want to change, and don't do any sanding in any of the inletting. Finish by polishing with fine steel wool.

Stain and apply whatever new finish you like. I have used both Fornby's tung oil and Watco Danish oil and for a plain walnut stock like the T/C, these work well and look as good as you can get, IMO.

 

[navaho]

Take the stock to a stripping serv ice, the same you would use for furniture. It cost normally around 20.00. This will give you the best results, light 400 grade sand then 600. Sand in the finish by using a small amount of finish and sanding it in. This will seal the wood. You can stop here or continue to apply additional coats giving it body. Thats what I have done with my last stock and you will be suprised at how well it looks.

 

[Swampman]

A can of Formby's stripper will remove the old finish and not raise the grain for $5.00.

 

[thehorn]

Take the stock to a stripping serv ice, the same you would use for furniture. It cost normally around 20.00. This will give you the best results

I fully agree with Navajo on this one. For around $20-25 you can save on the mess and fumes not to mention the time and wind up with a clean piece of stock wood.

 

[harryo]

Take the stock to a stripping serv ice, the same you would use for furniture. It cost normally around 20.00. This will give you the best results

I fully agree with Navajo on this one. For around $20-25 you can save on the mess and fumes not to mention the time and wind up with a clean piece of stock wood.

Hmmmm. A pint of water based paint & varnish remover costs about 5 bucks, doesn't produce any fumes or even has much of a smell and doesn't raise the grain of the wood. I've stripped, sanded and refinished 2 stocks in one afternoon. I guess is depends on your disposition. I'm a hands-on kind of person who enjoys doing things like this and don't enjoy paying someone else to do what I can do myself.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Take the stock to a stripping serv ice, the same you would use for furniture. It cost normally around 20.00. This will give you the best results, light 400 grade sand then 600. Sand in the finish by using a small amount of finish and sanding it in. This will seal the wood. You can stop here or continue to apply additional coats giving it body. Thats what I have done with my last stock and you will be suprised at how well it looks.

Well, all stripping sevices must not be created equal. The places around here have HUGE vats of chemical stripper and they take your stuff and dump it in for some unknown length of time untill all of your old finish disolves. The only problem is the wood has soaked up a bunch of the chemical and has swelled up and many of the joints pop apart. Not to mention when the wood dries out it warps like crazy. I regret taking the one piece of furniture to that place, I should have taken the time and stripped it myself.
This is not something I'd subject a gunstock to. Other stripper joints may be different, but I'd never use a service like that again. :shake:
I've stripped and refinished a couple stocks with ZIP STRIP , It did a good job. It was a little messy, but alot of the stuff I do is a little messsy..... :haha:

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Ah come on Mike, You dont use oven cleaner on those milsurps? :rotf: :rotf:

I have found Dad's Easy Spray to be the best stripper I have ever used. Wrapping in tin foil intensifies the process and makes for a more uniform strip.

 

[scott k]

I did that oven cleaner trick once and it turned the wood almost black. It did get most of the cosmolean out. It was a 303 No. 1 M 111. Boy that thing was dripping with cosmo :rotf: :shake: :cursing:
Lehigh....

 

[paulvallandigham]

Newbie: The stock finish should be okay, but make sure you mix it with a stick before using it. Same with the other two compounds. If this was left out to freeze, or left in the heat it might be spoiled, but if it looks clear, I would not hesitate to use it.(Clear being a relative term, The finish I am used to seeing is an orangish color.)If you have a doubt, try it on a scrap piece of wood before you go to work on that stock. You will need to remove the factory finish, and then use scrapers, or, steel wool, to knock down the raised nap, or whiskers after you wet the stock. Use the stock filler to fill those pores before you stain the stock. Then, after the stock has had a couple of days to dry, apply the finish. Just a drop on your fingertips, and then rub it out as far as it will stretch. You can clean up with any alcohol based cleaner, or some of the better commercial " hand " cleaners. The secret to getting a good finish is to apply several thin coats, and rub the stock with a tack rag, or coarse cloth between coats. You don't want any drips. Hang the stock someplace where it won't get lint on the finish, and where it will be warm. A light bulb in a wooden crate, with a dampened cloth to screen the front, and a coat hanger to hold the stock upright will do the job for a single project. I would leave my car out of the attached garage and hang my stocks from the door channel with a coat hanger. The garage was heated, and dry, and as long as no one was walking in and out of the garage for any reason, I didn't get dust particles in my finish.