North Star West's Early English gun

[modoc]

Anyone have any personal experience with the North Star West Early English Trade gun? Good or bad. Looking at a 20 ga. with 36" barrel. Thanks

 

[Black Hand]

I have one that I built from a kit and was my very first build. What would you like to know??

 

[Russianblood]

North Star West has a very good reputation as a builder of period trade guns.

 

[rabjr]

I ordered this very same gun (kit) two weeks ago from Matt at North Star. Should have it soon. If ya haven't called and talked to Matt yet, you should, he's a nice guy and will answer any questions you have about the gun. Will help you in anyway he can too. :thumbsup:

 

[Wes/Tex]

AA the guns made by North Star Enterprises, and later North Star West, have been good products. In fact, when Bob Rathbun & Bill Wescombe owned the company, they sent me a full set of blue prints in 1 to 1 scale. They are a very interesting set of drawings. The only thing I can't put my finger on is what exactly the Early English Trade Gun really is. I can't find those exact group of parts in any historic books or articles. The guns are great, but I don't know how PC the one gun is.

 

[Desert Rat]

I have the officers gun and it is my absolute favorite. I had a problem with the sear and even after having the gun for about eight years they still replaced the part at no cost and then tuned the lock on top of it. Can't say enough about the service and quality.

 

[Mike Brooks]

AA the guns made by North Star Enterprises, and later North Star West, have been good products. In fact, when Bob Rathbun & Bill Wescombe owned the company, they sent me a full set of blue prints in 1 to 1 scale. They are a very interesting set of drawings. The only thing I can't put my finger on is what exactly the Early English Trade Gun really is. I can't find those exact group of parts in any historic books or articles. The guns are great, but I don't know how PC the one gun is.

Does this gun have the standard english styled buttplate? I've looked at their pictures and could never tell.

 

[rabjr]

I just received my North Star West Early English kit. All the parts are here and well made. Kit comes with full size plans and helpful hint sheets. I ordered a single band barrel with all the markings stamped into it, looks nice. Not sure if I can make it look like the pictures hehe but I think I can make a servicable gun for deer season. Matt did a great job on the lock, looks like the trigger pull will be to my liking as it is smooth and breaks with little effort. :thumbsup:

The butt plate Mike....

 

[[email protected]]

I like both the original North Star products and the North Star West products. You will have to understand, however, that I am very prejudiced. I worked for Curly before he died and helped with research and development of the Early English and Officers model. I still build pistols for Matt Denison at NSW. There was a response to your inquiry about the correctness of the Early English. Most questions will be answered in Ted Hamiltons book "Colonial Frontier Guns." It is what both Ted and Charlie Hanson referred to as the "Type G" trade gun. there were many subtle variations before becoming as standardized as it ever would be. Mine is made with one of Curlys old barrels with Matts components. A 30 incher, light and the most fun gun I have. Enjoy.

 

[Mike Brooks]

That isn't a Type G. Looks more like the O'Conner gun.

 

[rabjr]

Sure does look like it has the O'Conner gun DNA in it to me.

 

[[email protected]]

The original prototype, which I built and still have pictures of, was indeed built based on the O'connor gun made by Richard Wilson. We also studied the Museum of the Great Plains gun, which has the earlier "flat serpent" side plate as does NSW's EE gun. The Great Plains gun has the smaller trigger guard, and is made of brass. All were variations of what Hamilton and Hanson catagorize as the type "G" pattern. Even common trade guns, while following a pattern of guidelines differed from maker to maker. The differences, although subtle, are distinctive enough to identify the manufacturer with out signatures. The same differences hold true for guns manufacured in Britain, North America and Belgium. For real fun, look in Hamilton's book at the "Chiefs Grade Indian gun" that was in Curly's collection. I've held this gun in my hands. speculation is that it was made in India and was their interpretation of an "indian" gun, decorated in East Indian fashion. As long as a trade gun fits into the respective "pattern", there is, to quote Curly " no incorrect trade gun. So have fun with your trade gun, whichever version or variation you have.

 

[rabjr]

Thanks for the info Dick. :thumbsup:

 

[rabjr]

Gotta say, this is quite an enjoyable project so far. It's going together nicely, I did have a slight hickup but it was easially fixed. Apperantly I ended up work hardening the tang when bending it, making it impossible to drill through. The fix was simple, I boxed it up and sent it to Roy. :grin: He fixed me right up and the tang is back and on the gun again. Thanks again Roy. :bow:

 

[rabjr]

My concerns about the flyless lock have been unfounded. After pinning the trigger I ended up with very nice crisp 2 1/4 lb trigger pull which is sweeet! :thumbsup:

 

[schnapser]

My first post, and I wanted to ask about people's thoughts on early english trade guns, it seems from reading the Colonial Frontier Guns books that most of the examples of guns before what we know as the NW trade gun was developed were made with brass furniture, trigger guard, pipes, and buttplate. It looks like the picture of the kit posted had iron plate and trigger guard. In other's opinions is this PC, or an either or issue.

Dick you mentioned the trade guns needing to fit into a respective pattern, I would be curious to hear what the main points of a trade gun would be if you don't mind sharing.

I would be curious how these kits go together. I have never made a muzzleloading kit but have looked at this same kit and some of the french smoothy kits by TOTW and have been dying to give one a try.

 

[rabjr]

schnapser,

To be clear, I don't rondy I am strickly a hunter so the whole "PC" thing really means little to me. Having said that, I wouldn't mind if it was, just not gonna out of my way to be. When I called to order Matt gives you several options. I chose Iron furniture because I prefer it over brass.

As far as building the kit, it's going together just fine. I have all parts fitted and shaping the wood now. I found the kit extremely easy for my skill level which, ain't much. :v

 

[schnapser]

Thanks for the note Mike and certainly wasn't casting any judgement either way, just clarification for my own purposes. I reread my post and saw it read a little funky and certainly didn't mean anything by it.

Good luck with the project, I would love to see pics when it is completed. Hope it is a game getter! Chris

 

[rabjr]

schnapser,

No problem here, just wanted to point out why you see the kit in the picture as it is, I ordered it this way. :v

 

[tg]

I thought the O'Connor gun was later than guns that would be considered type G guns? and that a type G would be less likely to have the Ftrench influenced stock architecture?