Opinions on which gun is better?

[Russ T Frizzen]

While those links all point to percussion rifles, I note that you say you want a flintlock rifle. Since you are already a bow hunter, I would expect that you are used to getting close to game before taking a shot, and you say you have someone to act as a mentor--always a valuable asset when starting out. I would avoid a small bore until I had more experience, but a .50 or .54 caliber flintlock rifle of good quality would be a fine place to start. In truth, a decent flintlock is very reliable and not so difficult to learn to use and will add a challenge to the hunt. Check Track's web-site for an idea of what is available used, and the on-line auctions usually have some nice rifles too. Try not to lose sight of the fact that this is all supposed to be fun. Enjoy.

 

[Runner]

I don't know how big and strong you are, and that needs to be figured.
I have a Traditios Deerhunter flintlock with a 26 inch barrel. If you are a small person, it would be hard to find a better starter gun short of having one built. The lock will lose prime as you slip around and it takes a small flint. All I know is it goes off fast and the game generally falls down. It is a cheap hunter type gun and the plastic sights need changing as soon as possible.
If you are a middle weight and strength type person, the Lyman Great Plains rifle is the choice on the cheap end. Beautiful guns and pretty good shooters from all reports. More complaints in the last year I think than in the ten before that combined, so look it over good.
If you want a little older style, there are several next level guns that they sell that are better choices than any you mentioned.
I have half stock rifles, but I am moving back towards gatherings dated in the flintlock long rifle days, so I now have to build a full stocked gun. I don't know if that matters or not to you, but the fullstock flintlock guns cover a longer time span than the half stock guns do.
The 32 is a pretty 22 magnum that handles pretty well. Great gun, but not for hogs and deer.
If I was starting out again, I would spend some gas to go handle all the guns I could before I decided on one store these three guns type questions. They can get other guns if you have to deal with them. While you are there, pick up that little Crockett rifle and pick a spot up high like you were trying to put a bead on a squirrel. It might follow you home also!
Welcome and I hope that helps!

 

[redwing]

Mike it has nothing to do with a fade. If you have to go for a cap gun to get the job done well enough. I have had very good luck with Rock guns going back to 1962.
We had a meat shoot on the Bear River last Nov. The first 3 winners out of 28 shooters were flinters. The reason I bring this up it rained all day long. :thumbsup:

 

[410-er]

REMEMBER........A poor man can only afford the best.

Caliber-50 or 54
Make-Thompson Center or Lyman

 

[tg]

I would suggest a caplock of the type of gun you like the best at your vendor you are buying from, you can upgrade to a nice flint later if the ML bug gets its teeth imbedded in your arrse.

 

[OutdoorsNole]

Thanks for all the advice!! I've been on other hunting and fishing forums for a long time and know not to take things to seriously or let some replies bother me. Growing up 20 minutes between two different inlets and fishing all the time, I have plenty of spinning and fly rods and reels, so the gift card won't go towards that. :blah:

Like I said, I mainly bow hunt for deer and hogs and just want to get into something different. But, I a lot of shooting will just be for fun at the range. I get bored with rifles and never go anymore really, but I can shoot my bow all day long and love it. Traditional muzzleloaders are probably gonna effect me the same as bowhunting did and make me addicted.

A lot of you guys brought up getting a caplock instead of a flintlock. I actually don't even know how a caplock works and need to do some reading obviously. I'm not too concerned with the higher difficulty or lesser dependability of a flintlock, but a lot of shooters all say that no matter what I get, I'll eventually go to flintlocks and be hooked so that is why I chose it.

I think I may have decided to use the gift card to either just get a regular inline or use it towards getting cleaning supplies and any other misc. stuff that I might need when I do get a flintlock. It looks like it just may be a little longer before I finally get to shoot one of these suckers. Just graduating from FSU and not working full-time for too long my budget isn't anywhere near allowing me to afford a $3000 gun, let alone something over $500 right now. It seems like Lyman's makes a great gun for the price and this is the gun that I'm leaning towards now.
Lyman's Great Plains Left Hand Flintlock .54
I'm left handed and meant to choose that one also.

I also would never shoot a hog with the .32, unless I felt really tempted and sure of my shot. :wink: I guess I was just thinking about the caliber and not the actual weight of the bullet and the charge behind it.

Again, thanks for the advice and thanks in advance for all the replies I'll be getting in the near future for answering some of the next few thousand questions I'm sure I'll have. Hopefully I'll be posting some pictures in the hunting section with a flintlock. :thumbsup:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Buy the LH Lyman flintlock. You will like it. You do need to understand how to get a flintlock to shoot correctly, and reliably, and you need to learn how t clean it to keep it working. But, you won't need a bible to know everything you need to know, and most of it will become " common sense to you " once you understand why your are doing what you are doing.

If you do have questions after you get your flint rifle, ask. We are here to help.

 

[Runner]

The only real issue between the two types of gun are how you handle them. The flinter takes real black powder and nothing else will do. If you have access to black powder or don't mind ordering thru the mail, then the flinter is the right way go in my opinion. The caplock can be used with several of the substitute powders. My flinter is not really slower than my caplocks unless I do something wrong or fail to do what is needed to keep it ticking.
Welcomne to a new obsession.

 

[mmahlock]

Just to toss my 2 cents in here since you said you intended to shoot PRB I'd recommend you select either of the two that have 1:66 twist. Also, I'd recommend you go with the 50 cal. Most states that provide for Muzzleloading hunting of deer specify a minimum caliber and the 50 should be ok just about anywhere.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

I meant to ask before, what is your absolute, scrape-it-all-together, sell the silverware price that you can spend for a gun? In my experience, it is always best to spend more than you can afford when buying a gun, whether it is a percussion or a flintlock makes no difference. Long after you have forgotten the cost, the quality will remain. I think, for example, that it is better to buy a nice used gun for $800 than a new production gun for $600. And an in the white gun that you finish yourself is a nice way to get a traditional gun for a fair price. Just my 2 cents--but I have given it some thought--and it is the thought process I use when buying myself a new gun or a gun that is new to me.

 

Mike it has nothing to do with a fade. If you have to go for a cap gun to get the job done well enough. I have had very good luck with Rock guns going back to 1962.
We had a meat shoot on the Bear River last Nov. The first 3 winners out of 28 shooters were flinters. The reason I bring this up it rained all day long. :thumbsup:

I'll try not to take that comment as a slap. I stand by my opinion and facts. Hands down, the caplock is more dependable and less fuss than a flinter. That is why they replaced the flintlock. Flinters are fun and can be used with acceptable reliability, have just as good accuracy off the bench all else equal [my pet caplock just happens to have the best barrel for accuracy of the numerous rifles I own]. Flinters can be picky and need more maintenance. Caplocks need caps. Flinters won't shoot BP substitutes and in some areas BP is darned hard to get. I shoot only BP, but I keep my two caplocks for two reasons: to guard against BP shortages and because I like to shoot them. True, I have only been shooting flinters for 27 years, caplocks for 47 years--maybe I just need more practice? For all of those flinters that y'all can report great success with, there are an equal number that have problems. My point was that caplocks have fewer problems. Most hunters want few problems with their arms when the chance arises to get their game--that is why inlines are so popular [but too modern]. Traditional caplocks like the Hawken (perverted to flint by many due to the flint FAD)are great hunting arms and have been since the 1830s. There is nothing wrong about advising someone to get a GOOD flintlock, but few factory ones are recommended--whereas several of the factory caplocks are reliable shooters. In the Traditions line, I'd pick a caplock.

 

[Hoyt]

I know from your posts on other forums that you are a serious hunter..that's why I gave you the type of advice I did on guns and calibers...I also know money can easily be an issue when it comes to flintlocks.

However..there are a lot of variables when trying to give advice on what someone else will like best, that's why I always try to remember and say "If it were me, or I would do this or that".

In that vein I will tell you this...when I decided I wanted more of a challenge for spring gobbler[url] hunting...in[/url] other words I was hunting hard to hunt public land where gobblers are hard to come by and when I get one I want it to mean as much as possible to me...they may be too far and between to take lightly. So I decided to hunt them with a muzzle loader and chose a cap lock over an inline shotgun to do it. It lasted for 1 gobbler..never shot it since. I knew after I had killed the bird I was missing something. That ended up being a traditional flintlock. It's just what I personally like to hunt with. The gun puts me where I want to be mentally and nostalgically..the extra tinkering and fool'n with for the flints, lock and pan..etc. to make sure I have everything right, my powder dry, and in the pan, that I have a fast a loc time as I know how to get..etc. for a kill when the time comes, adds to the feeling of accomplishment and excitement and pride when all goes right. I like that kinda stuff..if I didn't I would probably just use a modern rifle or shotgun all the time.
I'm like a lot of people and end up having to buy things I want two or three times before I get it right...

 

[tg]

"There is nothing wrong about advising someone to get a GOOD flintlock, but few factory ones are recommended--whereas several of the factory caplocks are reliable shooters. In the Traditions line, I'd pick a caplock'

well said Mike, a poor flinlock is a good way to never learn how to enjoy a flintlock, I find my flinters to be on par with the caplocks( it did not happen overnight) but there are more steps involved and the caplock is a more easily mastered weapon and a technological advancement which left the flinters in the dust, sometimes we tend to over emphasize the merits of the flinter as to not scare folks away from them, but they do take the game to a new level, a level one should understand and be prepared for before making the choice over a capper particularly for a first ML.

 

[JHarkins]

I'm new tothis forum but started over 30 years ago. tg's earlier statement is right, it's just fine to start with percussion. I'm building a flint but seing how you are new to coalburners you will have enough to get used to without learning the personality of a flint from the start. And there are several good direct replacement flintlocks made that you can exchange your lock for latter, assuming you buy a rifle who's lock is compatible.

 

[Robert Egler]

The very first gun I ever had was a .44 calibre flintlock Pennsylvania long rifle when I was 15 (or to be more precise for the people concerned with PC-ness :wink: , a gun that somewhat resembled a PA / Kentucky long rifle) that I built from a kit. I learned to shoot with that gun, and I learned a lot. Maybe because I started with a flintlock, I don't really think they are all that difficult or tricky (as long as you use real BP!) Personally, I see nothing wrong with starting muzzleloading with a flintlock, but obviously opinions vary.

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Newguy,

Notice that most of these posts start with "my first rifle".

That would indecate that these under $500 production guns were replaced by a high quality rifle.

Save up your duckets and buy a quality rifle. Cut out having to do the most of us did and buy a junker production gun first.
[url] http://www.flintlocks.com/[/url]

These are the cream of the crop. You can get less costly ones, but not better ones.

Muzzleloaders are not modern rifles where you can go to Wallmart and buy a Remmington and get a fine firearm.

The first production rifle I owned, i fired 8 times and the frizzen broke. It took the better part of a year to get it repaired.

My Chambers lock screw got bent. They sent me on 4 days later. In 2 days Im off to rondy!

 

[Runner]

A good flinter is not harder to shoot than most production caplocks. In fact, they are a lot easier to shoot than some caplocks are. The only thing I see that would stop me from starting with flint is the present situation with black. As of now, you can still mail order it in places where it can not be purchased locally. With a flinter you are tied to black. With a caplock, you can use whatever is available to you. When the Dems take over in a short time, will you be able to get black at all?

 

[Johnny Tremain]

They still sell black at gun shows. One can will last you years.

I just ordered two cans of FFFF, which should last me my life time.

If the Libs get to silly, Ill make my own

 

[Robbo]

Mike it has nothing to do with a fade. If you have to go for a cap gun to get the job done well enough. I have had very good luck with Rock guns going back to 1962.
We had a meat shoot on the Bear River last Nov. The first 3 winners out of 28 shooters were flinters. The reason I bring this up it rained all day long. :thumbsup:

I'll try not to take that comment as a slap. I stand by my opinion and facts. Hands down, the caplock is more dependable and less fuss than a flinter. That is why they replaced the flintlock. Flinters are fun and can be used with acceptable reliability, have just as good accuracy off the bench all else equal [my pet caplock just happens to have the best barrel for accuracy of the numerous rifles I own]. Flinters can be picky and need more maintenance. Caplocks need caps. Flinters won't shoot BP substitutes and in some areas BP is darned hard to get. I shoot only BP, but I keep my two caplocks for two reasons: to guard against BP shortages and because I like to shoot them. True, I have only been shooting flinters for 27 years, caplocks for 47 years--maybe I just need more practice? For all of those flinters that y'all can report great success with, there are an equal number that have problems. My point was that caplocks have fewer problems. Most hunters want few problems with their arms when the chance arises to get their game--that is why inlines are so popular [but too modern]. Traditional caplocks like the Hawken (perverted to flint by many due to the flint FAD)are great hunting arms and have been since the 1830s. There is nothing wrong about advising someone to get a GOOD flintlock, but few factory ones are recommended--whereas several of the factory caplocks are reliable shooters. In the Traditions line, I'd pick a caplock.

Agree with Mr Brooks.

Caplocks and Flinters are both heaps of fun. We all shoot them these days, I would suggest, mostly for the fun of it.

But lets get real. If percussion locks weren't more dependable and offer more to the bloke who depended on his rifle for his very life in the 19th Century, then they would never have overtaken flint. Maybe never even have been invented. Period. End of Arguement.

Best Wishes

Robbo

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Well, I'm not sure you get to decide when the "argument" is over. If you haven't taken the time to learn to properly use a flintlock and you keep finding yourself in life threatening situations, then you are probably better off with a cap gun. A person who has taken the time to become proficient with his flint lock is not likely to consider himself at a disadvantage compared to the percussion user. And the flint guns hung around long after the percussion cap became available--if indeed they ever did go away. Last time I looked, there were tons of them around even today.
I have a number of percussion long guns and handguns and I enjoy them a lot. But when I go hunting, or just want to go bumming around the woods, it is always one of my flint guns that I reach for. Weather is never a consideration only whether a rifle or fowler is appropriate. And, when I get in one of those moods when I think I have too many guns, it is the percussion guns that I think about culling---never the rock locks. Fortunately, these moods are rare and brief and never acted upon. In the end, it probably just boils down to a case of "to each his own". :thumbsup: