Patch and ball too tight?

[LONGHORN]

Hi everyone I am currently useing .495 balls in my 50 cal. I don't know the patch thickness but the assebly dose go down the berrel with out trouble.

My questions are:
Can your patch and ball be too tight for optimum accuracy?
Should I be experementing with different combonations?
Is it a bigger deal to be too tight or too loose?

Thank you

 

[J.D.]

My questions are:
Can your patch and ball be too tight for optimum accuracy?

Depends, will it go down the bore? IMHO, some of the best shooters I have seen shoot bore size, to larger than bore size balls with .015-.018 patcing. So, if it goes into the bore, it will shoot.

Should I be experementing with different combonations?

Yes, without question

Is it a bigger deal to be too tight or too loose?

Too loose means, in general, poor accuracy, blown patches, and heavy fouling.

Too tight means it won't go down the bore.

Thank you

Your welcome.

God bless

 

[nchawkeye]

Depends...Are you hunting or shooting in competition???

I've seen guys have to hammer a ball to get it started...Once started, it goes down well because you have swaged the led ball to the bore...

I'm a hunter...I want a ball that I can thumb start and ram down with my ramrod not a loading rod...With the right ball/patch combo inch and a half groups are easily attained at 50 yards...

That's good hunting accuracy...

If your crown is good and lands not too sharp then it's hard to have too tight a combination...
If not, the patch gets cut on the way in...

 

[Black Hand]

It is too tight when you can no longer get it started down the barrel. But tight seems to be better achieved (at least in a rifle) with a thicker patch and a smaller ball rather than the other way around.

 

[Birddog6]

Mic the patches & see what thickness they are. Generally on a .50 cal I would shoot a .495 ball & a .015 or .016 patch. I like them tight..... I have found in my rifles the tighter the ball/patch combo the more accurate they are for me.... Once in a while I have to use a .490 ball & .016 patch, just depends on the barrel.
:thumbsup:

But allot of things play into accuracy, not just the ball/patch tightness...... Patch thickness & materials, patch lube, powder type, Powder volume & grain size, bore conditions, relative humidity, and some more varibles.....

The first & foremost thing to do when trying to find accuracy, (and what people seem to ignore as they are ? steady ? :shake: :bull: ) is remove the human shooting error & shoot of a solid bench with sand bags as the buttplate & at the forestock where your hand would normally rest the rifle. This can save you allot of wasted time....
:thumbsup:

 

[MikeChapin]

Usually the tighter the patch/ball combination the better the accuracy. I know a lot of shooters that have to start the ball with a mallet. It goes down easily enough after that.

I prefer a little looser and start the ball with a sharp slap on the short starter. That seems to work well enough for me and I win enough matches keep me happy.

As J.D said a too loose combination can result in blown patches and will guarantee the barrel crudding up fast with a lose in accuracy.

You want the combination that will give you the best accuracy. It may not necessarily be the tightest combination of patch/powder/ball but it will be the one that gives the best accuracy.

Recently I started loading my Santa Fe with a .520 ball. For the last few years I have been using a .515 ball with a .024-.026 canvas patch. I went to it when the .520s were blowing out the .018 patches I was using. I wanted to go back to the .520 ball so started with a .022 denim patch. It shot terrible. The patches were staying intact but I was getting a 5" group at 50 yards. I went to the canvas. It took a little sharper slap to start it. The group size went down to less than an inch at 50 yards with this combination.

That is most dramatic difference I have seen with just the change of a patch but you will see some difference with different patch sizes for good or bad. You just need to experiment.

 

[Walks with fire]

Just my opinion, which comes with a healthy dose of trial and error of course; in general I believe in the tightest ball/patch that loads comfortably and doesn't deform the ball doing so is the way to go. How tight you can go with that in mind is up to you. There are a few things to consider when choosing your loads as well.

The patch should be of sufficient thickness that it can withstand the charge levels your using without patch failure. The sharpness of the lands and grooves also come into play so that your patch isn't getting cut at loading with a ball that is a little large. The patch/ball combo should seal to the bottom of the grooves or there can be some gas cutting in your barrel if it doesn't seal real well. Patch weave and softness for lack of a better word can have an affect as well.

In general I believe that a smaller ball and patching up to it is far better than a thinner patch and a larger ball though. I use a thick (maybe .020 or so) blue jean patch material and a .495 Hornady ball in my TC PA Hunter .50 with .012 grooves and 1/66 twist for outstanding accuracy. I don't believe in micing patch material; I believe in testing patch material and lubes. If the .495 didn't load nice and snug like I want it I would just find a better patch material because the .495 is the largest ball that is easy to locate.

With all that said; I found out a long time ago that what works for me and my rifle may not work for you and that the best thing to do is test stuff out for yourself. You can learn I great deal from conversing with the people on this site about what might work or what may be causing the problem but you still have to test it out anyway for the most part. There is just so much that can be learned or stumbled upon by testing and experiementing with your firearm and components. Snug works for me and I know it's better for my barrel.