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Pennsylvania bear info for Sumtacks
- Thread starter doverdog
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RussB
45 Cal.
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Since this thread started I have been in contact with a couple of my old retired Army buddies who live around PA.
First off, they all got a good A** Chewing for keeping this to themselves. But then they said they too keep hearing and reading stories about these monsters, and have no reason to doubt any of them....They both insist they are there! but they never seem to get a shot at the big ones either. Although one of the guys has some pictures of one that dressed just over 500#, which he promised to send me. We talked a bit about me hunting there and it does not seem to be the hassle that one goes through when hunting other states as a non-resident.
I think that if I should be fortunate enough to hunt PA with my muzzleloader, I just might want one of these boys backing me up. Having shot mostly small bear, by PA's standards, I think something over the 600# mark just might take some doing.
Anyway, it's a good thread. Sure got me fired up! Hope something comes of it.
Russ
First off, they all got a good A** Chewing for keeping this to themselves. But then they said they too keep hearing and reading stories about these monsters, and have no reason to doubt any of them....They both insist they are there! but they never seem to get a shot at the big ones either. Although one of the guys has some pictures of one that dressed just over 500#, which he promised to send me. We talked a bit about me hunting there and it does not seem to be the hassle that one goes through when hunting other states as a non-resident.
I think that if I should be fortunate enough to hunt PA with my muzzleloader, I just might want one of these boys backing me up. Having shot mostly small bear, by PA's standards, I think something over the 600# mark just might take some doing.
Anyway, it's a good thread. Sure got me fired up! Hope something comes of it.
Russ
No luck with my final try at getting the picture. It seems to me I have read some posts from one of the fellows on the Forum that is a Deputy WCO somewhere in NE PA. At least I think it was on this board. Maybe he could help. Any memebers from NE PA, NY near there, or Northern NJ, would be in the media target area for this thing. A little help here!
RussB
45 Cal.
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2004
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It is the so called "documentation" of things like this that keeps us confused, and our interest high. The following is what the American Bear Association has to say about the subject, it was sent to me by one of my "buds" who, at one time, guided in Idaho. I told him about the forum and have hopes he will join. He does have considerable experience. However, he does argue the point that bigger blacks are found on the East Coast.
I was very surprised at the "average" weights. That seems very low in my limited experience....also, the "big" difference in male / female weights. I realized the male was somewhat bigger, but 33% seems the upper limits IMO.
Anyway, for those of us who love the sport, it all makes for good reading. I guess we just have to take what we want from the writers, and add our own experience to come up with our own thoughts. I still want a big black! If the rain breaks this morning I will be Grouse hunting by early afternoon with my smoothie, and who knows? I just might get a glimpse of a black. Maybe.
Russ
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Size of the Black Bear
How much does an American black bear weigh?
Adolph Murie, the famous naturalist, once said, "A bear a long distance from a scale always weighs more." The general public often misjudges the weights of black bears. While they are large, they are not the 4,000-pound beasts that some visitors to the Great Smoky Mountains National Park describe.
Weights can vary greatly depending on the age, health, and sex of the bear as well as the season and the condition of the habitat. Seasonality is a major factor
I was very surprised at the "average" weights. That seems very low in my limited experience....also, the "big" difference in male / female weights. I realized the male was somewhat bigger, but 33% seems the upper limits IMO.
Anyway, for those of us who love the sport, it all makes for good reading. I guess we just have to take what we want from the writers, and add our own experience to come up with our own thoughts. I still want a big black! If the rain breaks this morning I will be Grouse hunting by early afternoon with my smoothie, and who knows? I just might get a glimpse of a black. Maybe.
Russ
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Size of the Black Bear
How much does an American black bear weigh?
Adolph Murie, the famous naturalist, once said, "A bear a long distance from a scale always weighs more." The general public often misjudges the weights of black bears. While they are large, they are not the 4,000-pound beasts that some visitors to the Great Smoky Mountains National Park describe.
Weights can vary greatly depending on the age, health, and sex of the bear as well as the season and the condition of the habitat. Seasonality is a major factor
RussB
45 Cal.
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2004
- Messages
- 882
- Reaction score
- 13
Another such story from PA.
Like anything else, I would like for each person reading these to draw their own conclussions. It is certainly not worth arguing over. As for myself, I am absolutely thrilled the subject came up....broadens our own thoughts, so to speak. Although the following is no more that a Journalist's view of the hunt, IMO. (somewhat long and boring) It does touch on the big 864lb bear, that has been mentioned before by Superflint, that was taken in Pike County.
So, we have at least two "documentations of sorts" of the record bear, I, for one, think his brother just might be out there too.
Russ
Long Takes Potter County Record Bear
Bejamen A. Long, 14, of Coudersport harvested bear on private property at 7:45 a.m., opening day of bear season. It weighed 725 pounds - almost certainly the largest bear ever taken in Potter County.
"I've never heard of anything that big in Potter County... not in modern history, not even close," said former Enterprise editor Paul Heimel. His mother, Barb, concurred; her father bought the Enterprise in 1921, and their family was involved in the business until 1994.
"We used to have a big bear contest, and I don't remember anything anywhere close to 700 pounds," said Heimel. "Back in my time there was one in Dubois over 700, and I remember it was the talk of the state for years"
Retired Potter County Game Warden Richard Curfman also said he believed Long's bear to be the Potter County record.
"I don't recall there ever being a bear that size taken in Potter County," he said.
Long was a driver in a nine-person hunting party conducting a hunt on farmland on Sweden Hill the opening morning of the season. The hunters decided on this location because of information given by neighbor and fellow hunter, Jed Rimel, of Coudersport. Rimel said he had spotted bear tracks two days earlier, while archery hunting.
Since there was no snow on the ground to track whether the bear was still in the area, they decided to put on a drive to push him out if he was still there.
Kenneth Ruter, another hunter and neighbor, tracks bears year round and is experienced in the behavior of bears and hunting drives. After Rimel explained where he saw the tracks, Ruter set up the positions for the members of the party using his experience to predict the behavior of the expected bear.
Other drivers included: the owner of the parcel, Stacey Ruter, his son Ryan Ruter and Long's father, Mark.
According to Long, the drivers were hiking down a wooded side hill, attempting to move any bear that may have been in the area down into a gully where watchers - Kenneth Ruter, Robert Faulstick, Wayne Foust, Jed Rimel, and Michael Wetzel, all of Coudersport - were positioned.
Long spotted a bear running towards him.
"Those bear are really smart," Long said. "We had him blocked with so many guys that he must have turned around and started running towards us." "I was the bottom pusher and I saw him running toward me," he said.
"When I drew my gun he stopped about 70 yards in front of me and just looked at me. I shot him in the front shoulder at a diagonal up through the back."
According to Long, the bear started running broadside to the drivers, through heavy brush, and Long started running to try to cut the bear off. His father and Stacey Ruter both took shots at the bear while it was running through the brush, hitting the bear in the hindquarters. This caused the bear to change its direction, and Long continued to sprint after the bear.
"I would get 30 yards away from him, stop, and shoot, and then catch up with him again," said Long.
"After a couple of shots in the rear, and about a 1/2 mile of running, he rolled down into a river and started gnawing on a log. I shot him again, in the head to put him out of his misery."
Long said he was shocked to discover the bear was so large.
The men quickly found out that it was fairly heavy when all nine of them couldn't move the animal.
"It took nine of the strongest men in Potter County to get him out of the woods," Long said.
They tied ropes to the bear and then around a log and pushed the log a few feet at a time. Twenty yards away was a field, where they drove an S-10 pickup truck down hill from the bear and rolled it into the truck.
Long's father said, "We thought it was about 500 pounds, but after we got it to the field, we upped our estimates."
After they drove the bear home and hung it from a bucket tractor, they set up another drive on North Hollow, where Rimel harvested a 168 pound bear.
"I wanted to get back out hunting and help them try to get a bear, since they helped me," said Long, "so I put my gun away and went back out."
It wasn't until hours later when they took the bear to the weigh station in Gaines that they discovered the actual live weight to be 725 pounds.
Out of the preliminary statewide harvest of 2,845 bear, only two outweighed this Potter County trophy.
Tuesday, a bear was taken in Carbon County with an estimated live weight of 739 pounds, and Wednesday a bear was taken from Pike County with an estimated live weight of 864 pounds.
Although the overall state ranking will not be available for 60-90 days, Bruce Whitman, Information Specialist for the Pennsylvania Game Commission, said, "It is certainly a very impressive trophy."
"I've seen probably eight to ten bears weighing over 700 pounds taken by hunters in the last decade," said Whitman.
Kenneth Pennypacker, a Coudersport Taxidermist, estimates the rug will measure at least eight feet long and five feet wide.
He said, "I've done a few 400 and 500 pound bear, but I've never seen 725."
The second day of hunting the group went out again and sent Long into a clear-cut, where he was tracking three bear. He was dictating the direction of the bear to the group on the outside. After a while he radioed the group saying, "Okay, they are following my tracks now."
Long's father said, "Ben must have covered 20 miles, alone, in a 60 acre clear-cut with three bear following him and no gun."
Game Commission statistics show a rise in bear population and male bear being more abundant and active.
This hunting party's experience would support that. Both bear harvested were male and the hunters tracked a total of 12 bear over the three days.
Long is an avid hunter. His aunt, Nance Long, of Jamison, PA, has hunted many times with Long and said, "a lot of people love to hunt, but some people are born to hunt. Ben was born to hunt."
Monday was Long's second day hunting for bear.
He shot a buck his first day hunting buck, and a gobbler his first day hunting turkey. Long says he hunts all year whenever he has a chance to get in the woods.
"I just like being in the woods and studying the animals and learning about them," he said.
Long said in an interview with the PA Game News that he had just gotten back from squirrel hunting, with the daily limit in the bag, already skinned, for his mom, Theresa Long, to make him a squirrel pot pie.
When approached about the bear meat she showed expressions of queasiness, and Long said, "Mom, would you like to win the lottery? For me, this is like winning the lottery."
Long credits his hunting party for his success. "Without them he would never have had this opportunity," he said.
Along with hunting Long reloads his own ammunition with his grandfather, John Turton, of Genesee, fishes, target practices, and enters trap shooting contests. He is also an honor roll student and a member of Coudersport's Wrestling team.
Like anything else, I would like for each person reading these to draw their own conclussions. It is certainly not worth arguing over. As for myself, I am absolutely thrilled the subject came up....broadens our own thoughts, so to speak. Although the following is no more that a Journalist's view of the hunt, IMO. (somewhat long and boring) It does touch on the big 864lb bear, that has been mentioned before by Superflint, that was taken in Pike County.
So, we have at least two "documentations of sorts" of the record bear, I, for one, think his brother just might be out there too.
Russ
Long Takes Potter County Record Bear
Bejamen A. Long, 14, of Coudersport harvested bear on private property at 7:45 a.m., opening day of bear season. It weighed 725 pounds - almost certainly the largest bear ever taken in Potter County.
"I've never heard of anything that big in Potter County... not in modern history, not even close," said former Enterprise editor Paul Heimel. His mother, Barb, concurred; her father bought the Enterprise in 1921, and their family was involved in the business until 1994.
"We used to have a big bear contest, and I don't remember anything anywhere close to 700 pounds," said Heimel. "Back in my time there was one in Dubois over 700, and I remember it was the talk of the state for years"
Retired Potter County Game Warden Richard Curfman also said he believed Long's bear to be the Potter County record.
"I don't recall there ever being a bear that size taken in Potter County," he said.
Long was a driver in a nine-person hunting party conducting a hunt on farmland on Sweden Hill the opening morning of the season. The hunters decided on this location because of information given by neighbor and fellow hunter, Jed Rimel, of Coudersport. Rimel said he had spotted bear tracks two days earlier, while archery hunting.
Since there was no snow on the ground to track whether the bear was still in the area, they decided to put on a drive to push him out if he was still there.
Kenneth Ruter, another hunter and neighbor, tracks bears year round and is experienced in the behavior of bears and hunting drives. After Rimel explained where he saw the tracks, Ruter set up the positions for the members of the party using his experience to predict the behavior of the expected bear.
Other drivers included: the owner of the parcel, Stacey Ruter, his son Ryan Ruter and Long's father, Mark.
According to Long, the drivers were hiking down a wooded side hill, attempting to move any bear that may have been in the area down into a gully where watchers - Kenneth Ruter, Robert Faulstick, Wayne Foust, Jed Rimel, and Michael Wetzel, all of Coudersport - were positioned.
Long spotted a bear running towards him.
"Those bear are really smart," Long said. "We had him blocked with so many guys that he must have turned around and started running towards us." "I was the bottom pusher and I saw him running toward me," he said.
"When I drew my gun he stopped about 70 yards in front of me and just looked at me. I shot him in the front shoulder at a diagonal up through the back."
According to Long, the bear started running broadside to the drivers, through heavy brush, and Long started running to try to cut the bear off. His father and Stacey Ruter both took shots at the bear while it was running through the brush, hitting the bear in the hindquarters. This caused the bear to change its direction, and Long continued to sprint after the bear.
"I would get 30 yards away from him, stop, and shoot, and then catch up with him again," said Long.
"After a couple of shots in the rear, and about a 1/2 mile of running, he rolled down into a river and started gnawing on a log. I shot him again, in the head to put him out of his misery."
Long said he was shocked to discover the bear was so large.
The men quickly found out that it was fairly heavy when all nine of them couldn't move the animal.
"It took nine of the strongest men in Potter County to get him out of the woods," Long said.
They tied ropes to the bear and then around a log and pushed the log a few feet at a time. Twenty yards away was a field, where they drove an S-10 pickup truck down hill from the bear and rolled it into the truck.
Long's father said, "We thought it was about 500 pounds, but after we got it to the field, we upped our estimates."
After they drove the bear home and hung it from a bucket tractor, they set up another drive on North Hollow, where Rimel harvested a 168 pound bear.
"I wanted to get back out hunting and help them try to get a bear, since they helped me," said Long, "so I put my gun away and went back out."
It wasn't until hours later when they took the bear to the weigh station in Gaines that they discovered the actual live weight to be 725 pounds.
Out of the preliminary statewide harvest of 2,845 bear, only two outweighed this Potter County trophy.
Tuesday, a bear was taken in Carbon County with an estimated live weight of 739 pounds, and Wednesday a bear was taken from Pike County with an estimated live weight of 864 pounds.
Although the overall state ranking will not be available for 60-90 days, Bruce Whitman, Information Specialist for the Pennsylvania Game Commission, said, "It is certainly a very impressive trophy."
"I've seen probably eight to ten bears weighing over 700 pounds taken by hunters in the last decade," said Whitman.
Kenneth Pennypacker, a Coudersport Taxidermist, estimates the rug will measure at least eight feet long and five feet wide.
He said, "I've done a few 400 and 500 pound bear, but I've never seen 725."
The second day of hunting the group went out again and sent Long into a clear-cut, where he was tracking three bear. He was dictating the direction of the bear to the group on the outside. After a while he radioed the group saying, "Okay, they are following my tracks now."
Long's father said, "Ben must have covered 20 miles, alone, in a 60 acre clear-cut with three bear following him and no gun."
Game Commission statistics show a rise in bear population and male bear being more abundant and active.
This hunting party's experience would support that. Both bear harvested were male and the hunters tracked a total of 12 bear over the three days.
Long is an avid hunter. His aunt, Nance Long, of Jamison, PA, has hunted many times with Long and said, "a lot of people love to hunt, but some people are born to hunt. Ben was born to hunt."
Monday was Long's second day hunting for bear.
He shot a buck his first day hunting buck, and a gobbler his first day hunting turkey. Long says he hunts all year whenever he has a chance to get in the woods.
"I just like being in the woods and studying the animals and learning about them," he said.
Long said in an interview with the PA Game News that he had just gotten back from squirrel hunting, with the daily limit in the bag, already skinned, for his mom, Theresa Long, to make him a squirrel pot pie.
When approached about the bear meat she showed expressions of queasiness, and Long said, "Mom, would you like to win the lottery? For me, this is like winning the lottery."
Long credits his hunting party for his success. "Without them he would never have had this opportunity," he said.
Along with hunting Long reloads his own ammunition with his grandfather, John Turton, of Genesee, fishes, target practices, and enters trap shooting contests. He is also an honor roll student and a member of Coudersport's Wrestling team.
