Punt-Gun & Gunning Punt Plans?

[satx78247]

New Friends,

I'm retiring to a nation (in 2014) where PUNT-GUNS are lawful for "tidal zone waterfowling", provided that the punt-gun is not greater than a 40MM bore, is a single shot piece, the barrel is not more than 3.5M in length and the weapon is loaded from the muzzle end.
(Under the laws of that nation, a punt-gun is considered a "smoothbore fowler" & is easily registered on a one-time purchase "shotgun license" for about 6.ooUSD.- Punt-guns of over 40MM bore are considered to be an "artillery piece" and require a separate, expensive to buy annually, "explosives license" to own/fire.)

As I cannot afford to buy an original punt-gun, I'm wondering if any of you either HAVE such plans for a "Big Gun" or know of a place where I can buy them.
In the event that I can find suitable plans, I will have a gun built OCONUS by a local craftsman.
(The last original punt-gun, that I know of being sold, went by auction to a museum for well over 15,000.ooUSD.- That is FAR more than I can afford on an Army pension.)

I would also BUY a set of plans for building a suitable "2-man, double-ended gunning punt,(preferably) with sail-plan", to mount the gun upon.

THANKS for reading this.

yours, satx

 

[spudnut]

Don't know but.... YEE HAW :thumbsup:

 

[Many Klatch]

40 MM is roughly 1-1/2 inches. I don't know of anyone making barrels that size, but there are a couple of barrel makers that are doing 4 bore barrels that are 1" in diameter. If you could live with a 1" barrel about 48" long you might want to look into getting a smoothbore "Wall Gun".

I have shot one of these monsters and it will pack a wallop. I think Bobby Hoyt is one of the barrel makers that handles this kind of work.

Many Klatch

 

I have shot one of these monsters and it will pack a wallop.
Many Klatch

Just think, back in the day they often followed up that wallop with quick shots from a couple of double barrel 8 gauges. They made folks tough in the old days.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Living near the Chesapeak Bay, I'm familiar with these gadgets.

I don't know why you would need to get it made outside CONUS, unless the end user location has laws about importation. It's not illegal to own a punt gun or to fire one in the U.S.... It's just illegal to hunt with one if it's larger than 10 bore.

The long barrels might not be necessary. I would think that a swivel gun from Dixie Gunworks could be obtained, and then finished at your destination with a 37mm hole after it is lined. If you want additional barrel length, you could simply have the steel liner extended, but I think that would not be necessary. It would also be easier to manage and move, on a pintel mount it would be more versatile as traditional punt guns must be aimed with the whole boat, AND have to shot at sitting birds or those just taking flight due to the low angle being "set".

Although the simplest way to fire one of these is by fuse, you could have it completed to caplock ignition with musket caps.

LD

 

[satx78247]

Many Klatch,

Thanks for the input.

As I'm having the barrel made OCONUS, I might as well have the bore done in 40mm.

yours, satx

 

[Coot]

The NRA National Firearms Museum in N. Virginia has a punt gun designed for one pound of shot & a 77" barrel.

The Decoy Museum in Harve de Grace, Maryland has several punt guns and related (typically one man & rowed - no sail) boats.

While I somewhat doubt that plans are available, many museums will take photos & measurements (or photos with a measure next to the object) for a fee.

 

[satx78247]

Randy Johnson,

Actually, the "cripples gun" in "the old days" was often a 6, 4 or even a 2 guage percussion gun.
(I once fired a double 4 guage. = It "got my attention".)

Fwiw, I belong to a UK "shooting forum" and several members have/hunt with 8 and/or 4 guage muzzleloading or breechloading doubles.
(One of our members has a 2 guage DOUBLE RIFLE that was custom-built in Dublin for a Russian Nobleman in the 1880, who hunted AMUN TIGERS which at @800 pounds are nearly the size of a saddle-horse. = It fires >2000 grain, hollow-base, hard-cast lead conical bullets at about 1400FPS. That "cannon" weighs about 33 pounds.)

W.D.M. "Karamoja" Bell mentioned in a letter to a friend about 1900 that a "sporting gentleman in The East African Protectorate" (today's Kenya) had & sometimes hunted with a ONE BORE muzzleloading rifle, which fired a conical bullet that evidently resembled our minies.

YES, I believe that I would agree that those lads were TOUGH!

yours, satx

 

[satx78247]

Loyalist Dave,

FYI, I used to have a "camp" on the Eastern Shore & KNEW people in the 1980s, who STILL hunted UN-lawfully with punt-guns.= I met & once had lunch with "the real-life fellow", who James A. Michenner based "Turlock the Pirate" upon in his novel CHESAPEAKE, in 1986, shortly before he passed away. - He did "quite well" selling Eastern Shore real estate!
(FYI, it's NOT "technically unlawful" to hunt with a shotgun over 10 guage - Instead it's unlawful to hunt "migratory birds" with any shotgun over 10 guage. - A person MIGHT be able "to get away with" hunting NON-migratory game with a 8/6/4/2/1 guage gun, though I suspect that the MD Rangers might "give you a hard time" for doing so.)

FWIW, I'll gave the punt-gun made "there", rather than in CONUS because:
1. It will cost me about 15% of what it would cost "here", compared to having it made "there",
2. I'm NOT sure that the US Customs folks will allow a US citizen to EXPORT "a cannon"
and
3. Shipping a punt-gun OCONUS would likely be expensive.

yours, satx

 

[satx78247]

Coot,

FYI, The Chesapeake Bay Maritime Museum in St Michaels, MD used to HAVE "gunning punt" plans for sale, for both 1 & 2 man gun-punts.
(2-man gunning punts were often sailed, rather than rowed/paddled to the "hunting area". - Generally those punts over 22 feet had a "demountable mast & sails".)

I've recently corresponded with Mr. Peter Lesher, Curator of Watercraft for the CBMM & he is currently "looking for" any copies of gun-punt plans, that the museum MAY still have.
(According to THE BALTIMORE SUN, in 2010, "- - - - - - persons unknown removed numerous documents & historical objects from the CBMM's storage facility".)

yours, satx

 

[gunmaker43]

Ed Rayl will make a 2 bore. 1-304-364-8269...His bbl. speak for themselves...

 

[Britsmoothy]

Don't know if you already found this but if not you may enjoy.....

http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/217901-making-a-gunning-punt-and-punt-gun/

Brits.

 

[satx78247]

To ALL,

On a slightly different topic, "Foreign Flagged Documented Vessels" over 20M in length MAY lawfully be armed with a "ship's gun" (read: CANNON).

The late BILL RUGER's yacht, TITANIA, had such a breechloading ship's gun.
(My "brother of the heart" once was a designing engineer for Ruger, Inc. and he said, "When The Titania visited Washington DC some years ago, the 'city fathers' tried unsuccessfully to find a statute that would allow the Metro Police to 'confiscate the gun' and/or 'arrest' Mr Ruger for violating DC 'gun-control ordinances'. After spending a great deal of time and money on that 'project', the City Attorney finally admitted that Mr. Ruger's ship's gun was LAWFUL, as long as it remained 'onboard' the yacht.")

As it will be less expensive to build a "HOUSE-boat" (as opposed to a "house-BOAT", if you know what I mean), than to buy land there, I'm considering buying a "condemned 35x12M sea-going barge", building a home on the barge and "flagging" the vessel in Panama.
(IF I do that, I can lawfully "mount a ship's gun aboard" the barge!)

NOTE: One of "my guys" (a retired E-8/95B40, USAMPR) married a young (stunningly beautiful) "local national", retired to that country, has built & is living aboard such a houseboat.
"Tom" told me that the >2,000SF houseboat cost less than 20,000.ooUSD to build.- An equivalent home, including buying "shore-side land", would cost at least 80,000.ooUSD. The annual "personal property tax" on his houseboat is

 

[satx78247]

Tom Knight; All,

I just got off the phone with Mr Rayl & he said that he CAN build me a smoothbore 1 3/8 inch bore barrel, up to 60 inches in length (in round, half octagon to round or all octagon-shaped. "Octagon to round" is an extra charge of 100.oo.) & CAN export such a barrel by US mail, believe it or not.
(He recently/successfully exported a big-bore barrel to Australia.)

Thanks for the info.

NOTE to ALL: Mr. Rayl does NOT "do" email - He doesn't have a computer.

yours, satx

 

[satx78247]

Britsmoothy,

Fyi, I'm one of a FEW North American "members in good-standing of" Pigeon Watch.- Most of the "non-UK members" are Canadians.
(We "folks across the pond" are warmly WELCOMED on http://www.pigeonwatch.co.uk = NICE FOLKS on that website!!!)

Btw, I'm "corresponding with" a PW member in Leeds, who is "looking for" a suitable mast/sail plan for a gunning punt, that is suitable to my "gun-punt project".

yours, satx

 

[satx78247]

CowboyCS; All,

NOPE. I didn't ask that question, as I'm NOT retiring overseas until Spring of next year. - He did tell me that the barrel would be about 4-500.oo, depending on "configuration".

FYI, I'd bet everything in my bank account that I can have "what I exactly want made" done "there" for

 

[Col. Batguano]

Ok quit the tease.

Which Country is this? Yemen? North Korea? Cuba? There has to be a catch somewhere.

 

[satx78247]

Col. Batguano,

NOPE. NO "catch". - Those 8 countries are:
Belize = English-speaking, CHEAP food/rent & largely "rural" or beach living.
Costa Rica = Winning the "pensionado benefits race", right now.
Ecuador = You can live a "middle class US lifestyle" for 12-14,000USD a year.
Guatemala,= I know a retired CSM, who is living like an oriental potentate on 35,000USD.(Taking a wife to Guatemala is like taking a burger & fries to a banquet.)
Indonesia = BEAUTIFUL island life for retirees BUT you cannot own land, YET.
Malaysia = "The Malaysia My Second Home" program is "coming up FAST" & Malay women are friendly/beautiful.
Panama = Will go out of their way to get you to open a business or enter a profession there & GREAT "pensionado program".
and
Philippines.= English/Spanish widely spoken.

"Close but no cigar", when it comes to "Especial Deals" for "pensionados":
Argentina,= Buenos Aires reminds my of "Philly", with MANY beautiful girls" to play with".
Cambodia,= GREAT BENEFITS, friendly to Americans, CHEAP to live well but "rather 3rd world"
Chile,
Malta,= Will issue a 2nd passport & EU-benefits after 18 months residence IF you buy a home.
Nepal,
Nicaragua,= TRYING to replace CR as "the Latin American retiree's haven" BUT I do not trust Danny Ortega.
Peru,
Sicily,
Thailand = GREAT FOOD, CHEAP to live and CHANG MAI is LOVELY.
Ukraine = Friendly people, cheap to live, GREAT/CHEAP medical care but COLD in the winter months.= BRRRRRRRR.
and
Uruguay= GREAT/CHEAP medical/dental care & quite inexpensive.

Also "recruiting" Retired GIs is, believe it or not, VIETNAM, which is "going out of their way to get RVN-vets to "come back to visit the place where you served in combat" and/or "to stay forever"!!!
(That one made me LOL.)

IF you cannot find a place that you like out of that list of TWENTY nations, you're just "too hard to please", imVho.
(CHUCKLE.)

personal: Your "screen-name" makes me SMILE.

yours, satx

 

[satx78247]

Friends,

A bit "off topic" BUT speaking of BIG GUNS: A friend in Europe emailed me that he has bought at auction a 16pound, circa 1910 CAPE GUN that has a 12.75x74Flanged barrel (probably originally a cordite load) on the left & a 8gauge on the right.
(The 12.7x74mm would be in English measure = a .50cal bullet on a 3" rimmed case. - I'd bet that it kicks like a MO mule, too.)

Erik says that it uses a 700-750grain cast bullet at about 1550FPS & I would guess 3500-4000PME, like our old-time 3" cased 110 Sharps.

yours, satx

 

[Zonie]

Let's keep our discussion on muzzleloading firearms.

After all, that is what the forum is about.