Question About Clean Out Plugs/Screws/Set Screw

[shooter50]

I just picked up a Jonathan Browning Mountain rifle off of the forum. Took it to the range and when I returned home to clean it and I was taking out the clean out screw on the "snail" it felt "sticky" and the threads on the screw are stripped. I found another set screw and installed it but there is nothing to stop the screw or nothing for it to tighten up against. When I was running an oil patch down the barrel you could see oil bubbling out around the "new set screw" I installed. What is the purpose of this screw? I really see no reason to remove it to clean the rifle beings I pull the nipple. Is it supposed to be a tight "plug" or "fit"? Or is this just a plug to fill that hole that was made during drilling the flash hole? This is the only rifle I have that has this.

 

[necchi]

Well it's not a "set screw". I mean it's not there to interfere with or hold the nipple in,
it's for cleaning.
As you said it has also been my experiance that takeing that screw out for cleaning IS NOT required. Many second hand guns have that screw completely seized in that hole and most times it's best just left there to do just that,
,act as a block too plug that hole.
No Harm, No Foul.

Some T/C's and Lymans and Cabelas and GM barrels have this same "clean out" screw and unless pulled and lubed nearly every time for cleaning it'll quickly become difficult to remove.

The "bubbling" you refer too is indication the threads have become somewhat comprimised, not completely ruined but on the way ,,
If it where my gun, I'd clean and dry the screw and hole threads well, make sure the depth of the screww will not in anyway hinder the nipple threads or leave a deep pocket behind it and set the darn thing in there with Locktite Blue and forget it. (might even use the Red Locktite stuff)

Welcome to the Forum by the way, good grab on that JB Mountian rifle. Given that it is a JBMR I sure wouldn't be trying to retapp or mess with those threads,,I'd just plug it.

 

[roundball]

When I was running an oil patch down the barrel you could see oil bubbling out around the "new set screw" I installed.

Definitely not the way it should be fitting.
T/C caplock barrels originally had that feature then they discontinued it as it wasn't necessary to remove it to get the fire channel cleaned anyway.

If I had that barrel and no need to remove and reinstall that set screw in the future, I'd remove it, thoroughly clean its threads and the threaded seat with alcohol & pipe cleaners or something...let both sets of threads get bone dry, put a drop of RED Loc-Tite in the threaded seat, then get the setscrew dripping with RED Loc-tite, run it in flush, then don't move the barrel for 24hrs.

Others mileage may vary...

 

[necchi]

roundball has me on ignore, there for the duplicate answer.
He really isn't a copy cat, :wink:

 

[shooter50]

Sounds like a plan fella's. I appreciate your advice and expertise :hatsoff:

 

[paulvallandigham]

That clean-out screw gives you better access for cleaning the flash channel in that breech, than going down through the threaded hole in the bolster for your nipple.

If you don't want to glue it permanently into the gun, use "Anti-seize" a compound you can buy in most hardware stores or auto supply stores. It will fill those threads and prevent the "bubbling". It also will prevent crud from getting into the threads where they will rust away the threads.

Be very careful what screw you place in that gun to substitute for the original clean-out screw. There are two different thread systems- one fine, and the other "standard", where you sometimes can get the same thread pitch. A fine threaded screw should not be used where the hole is tapped for a coarser screw. :hmm: :surrender: :thumbsup:


The last thing you want to happen is to fire a shot, and have a clean out screw go zinging away down the firing line at right angles to the target. :shocked2: :shocked2:

 

[shooter50]

I measured the old stripped screw at the one area on the threads was it wasn't stripped with micrometers and was getting about .160" and the new "still used" screw I replaced with measured around .162". The threads matched up perfectly. I believe that is a 8-32 screw??? Don't worry its not loose now. It fits the threads very well. Now I will say my "new" screw is "used" so I will get an actual "new" screw for it at work Monday. It just seemed silly screwing it in and there is nothing to hold it in place???

 

[paulvallandigham]

Screw it down so its flush with the surface of your bolster, but not biding the nipple, or blocking the flash channel to your powder chamber.

If you use Blue Loc-Tite, or Anti-seize on the threads the screw will not feel "Loose" to you, and will stay where you stop it. If money is tight, you can substitute a drop of lacquer( finger nail polish) or varnish on the treads to hold the screw in place. Just put it in where it needs to go, and give the compounds time to dry over night. If you use Red Loc-Tite, the stuff locks the screw in place, unless you apply heat to the bolster with a propane torch, to expand the steel around the screw and break the compound. W/o heat, you will not be able to turn out the screw with any screwdriver I know. :hmm:

 

[M. De Land]

I would use a scope mounting screw of the appropriate thread as these are hardened alloy steel and strong enough to handle the pressure if the threads are still good in the snail. I sweated mine in permanently with soft solder and have used the same technique to bush firing pin holes in breach block faces for HP rifles that need small diameter firing pins.
Red loc-tite should work just as well and is easier to do.
Often the the metal thickness is tapered in the snail and will make more threads on the bottom of the clean out hole than on the top side.
You can thread the scope screw in until it bottoms out against the screw flange,mark it to length and then remove and mount in a screw vise. Cut the length to the threaded terminus of the longest part of the thread in the snail and then angle the end of the screw with a file to the top of the snail hole threads which are often shorter.
This provides an ramp angle for the flash to make the turn at the bottom against the angle of the plug screw end. It also helps clear the bottom of the nipple and the angle directs the back thrust, when the main charge lights, against that same angle, wedging the screw in the clean out hole as well as loading the threads making it less likely to blow out.MD

 

[shooter50]

I was able to work on the original screw and I am able to screw it in but it is maybe holding by about half of the threads. The screw driver slot on the top looks a little rough/worn out (looked like that before). I would like to use the original just because it matches the snail better than the blued socket head set screw I have in there now. I use red loc-tite at work and am familiar with it's holding ability. If I pick up some blue loc-tite would I be able to remove the screw if ever needed even though I doubt I ever will? And would it seal it off and keep it in place? I just want it plugged and forgotten at this point.

 

[roundball]

I use red loc-tite at work and am familiar with it's holding ability.

If I pick up some blue loc-tite would I be able to remove the screw if ever needed even though I doubt I ever will? And would it seal it off and keep it in place?

I just want it plugged and forgotten at this point.

IMO, blue Loc-Tite is really only sort of an anti-vibration sort of thread locker...but RED has real holding powder.

If it was me, I'd use red and forget about it...and in addition, given your recent description of the thread condition I'd also use a new screw.
You can get a small tube of Birchwood Casey's Perma-Blue from any place like Walmart, Dick's, etc...simple to use and works perfectly.

 

[necchi]

You can atill remove the screw if red is used, it just needs heat applied.
Another vote for the new set screw. At this point it's about saftey and full function.
It's not an area that folks looking at/admiring the rifle really focus their attention.
If someone does notice, it's because they have knowledge of Trad BP guns and a short explaination would be completely understood.
You'll see it more than anyone else,,, :wink:

 

[Ken Rummer]

The problem I have found with the cleanout screw is that if it is longer than required some of the thread can hang out in the space inside the snail and become coated with black powder residue. When the screw is removed the residue gets crunched up inside the threads and wears away both ID and OD threads. This is permanent damage to the threads inside the snail.

If you get a longer new screw, about 3/4 to 1", screw it into the snail and try to wiggle it, you will get a feel for how much damage there is to the snail threads. A lot of wiggle means the permanent plug will probably be necessary. Little or no wiggle would indicate installing a short screw, not hanging out into the snail space, will restore the cleanout feature.

IMO, a properly sized screw, lubed every time it is removed, will never wear out either thread.

I prefer the cleanout feature because it lets me dry out the breech better during cleaning.

 

[bchannell]

I recently had a shooting pal who took the cleanout screw out of his Crockett, which is on the opposite side of the barrel from the nipple, (unlike T/C), which puts the hole right at the top edge of the stock and right in your face. He forgot to reinstall it, and next range session he shot it. First shot seemed like a huge hang fire, second shot, the same. The third shot was enough to make him quit. When he came home and told me what happened, I found the screw on the floor of his garage. It took a hunk out of the stock about 3/4" X 1/2" and blackened the whole inside of the stock, but no real damage. Good thing it wasn't a .54 cal.

Moral of the story, Don't routinely take that screw out. It's not necessary for cleaning and you just might forget to put it back in. At least T/C did some thinking and put it out of the way of the shooter, but on a Crockett, it's in your face.

The fact that the screw is loose would bother me. I'd be thinking of redrilling it to 10-28 and putting a new screw in, certainly if it is leaking as you say.

 

[ryoung14]

IMO, a properly sized screw, lubed every time it is removed, will never wear out either thread.

I prefer the cleanout feature because it lets me dry out the breech better during cleaning.

Same here. If mine are working, I keep them working. If I get one that's seized, no big deal.

Also, a socket head screw is your best bet if you intend to remove it for cleaning. The slotted heads break off too easily, even when the threads aren't seized.

 

[ebiggs1]

You can get 'slotted' set screws from Brownell's.
Use the red Loctite and forget it.

 

[Rat Trapper]

Half of my TC rifles have to clean out screws and the doesn't. On the ones that have them, I got some new screws from TC that accept an allen wrench. When I clean those rifles I always take the screw out and put breech plug grease on it before it goes back in. If it is on a rifle, I like to keep it operable.

 

[M. De Land]

One does not really need the clean out screw feature anyway to clean the inside of a snail.
Nipple removal and a pipe cleaner will do the same. MD