r.e.a.l. bullets

[rawhide]

I cast .54 380 grn. real bullets for my hakens. rifle they shoot touching groups off the bench. with .90 grns. of rs. haven't gotten any thing with these yet. any one else shoot these? and have you gotten any thing with them. how did it do.

 

[BrownBear]

I've got every one they make in 50, 54 and 58 cal. You're experience is about like mine--- they shoot. Some of my guns want a lubed felt wad under the REAL and some don't.

Haven't shot any game with mine, but I wouldn't hesitate. My tendency has been to go to a bigger caliber gun when I needed more geewhizz rather than using to a conical, but I think that's mostly an excuse to buy another muzzleloader. There's no doubt in my mind that for more penetration or longer shots, the conical is a terrific alternative in the same gun.

 

[dbutch]

Rawhide..At what distance were you shooting?...in the past they shot great at 50 and started to keyhole after that..Had to try them once ..that was my out come..shot 50 and 54 cal same results.Shot paper targets only.

 

[BrownBear]

...in the past they shot great at 50 and started to keyhole after that..

Boy that sounds weird! I wonder what's going on, because mine shoot straight and true to 100 and beyond. Makes me wonder about the twist rates in your barrels. :hmm:

I get wild spreads past 50 but no keyholing with slow twists, but with 1:48 or faster they really do group well when you strike on the right combo.

 

[dbutch]

...in the past they shot great at 50 and started to keyhole after that..

Boy that sounds weird! I wonder what's going on, because mine shoot straight and true to 100 and beyond. Makes me wonder about the twist rates in your barrels. :hmm:

I get wild spreads past 50 but no keyholing with slow twists, but with 1:48 or faster they really do group well when you strike on the right combo.

BB... These were shot from a GPH barrels 70-80 FF and FFF at 50 they shot great at 100 they were side ways..used an OxYoke wool wad under them. Not much expansion on the recovered slugs. Could be due to hard lead? Have since shied away from lead against the rifling. Like the ease of loading the round ball and patch.

 

[Blizzard of '93]

use as soft lead as you can get. I shoot them (cast mine, 250gr) in a 1-48 twist with good results 70gr 3F a felt and greased slug. good groups at 50 then begins opening but so does prb.

 

[BrownBear]

BB... These were shot from a GPH barrels 70-80 FF and FFF at 50 they shot great at 100 they were side ways..used an OxYoke wool wad under them. Not much expansion on the recovered slugs. Could be due to hard lead? Have since shied away from lead against the rifling. Like the ease of loading the round ball and patch.

I've only used "virgin" pure lead to make mine because I wanted them soft as possible for starting in the bore. I can't imagine getting them started with harder lead, but if so, that might explain the keyholing. Dunno. If your lead was harder, how did you get them started in the bore? Not being critical, rather if there was a way to do it (and they didn't keyhole), I could see situations where a harder version could be desirable for added penetration.

As for lubing, I've become real (pun intended) addicted to LEE's Liquid Alox. Double coat the REAL conicals or any other, and there's absolutely no leading.

 

[Bearbait2]

Mr. makeumsmoke,
Our experience/results with REALs parallels that of Mr. BrownBear. The softer the lead, the greater the accuracy.
Gonna have to try that Liquid Alox stuff. Think we have an old bottle of it around here, somewhere.
Best Wishes

 

[dbutch]

BB..Other than the keyholeing.hard starting and the alox left in the bore..Found it harder to clean the bore after the alox use. Be leaning more toward natural oil and lubes(olive.tallow etc.)
Would rather just swab with warm water and soap at the end of the day.
Would like to hear from those that have hunted with them and their experience with penetration etc.

 

[Bearbait2]

Mr. makeumsmoke,
Have never recovered any of the various REALs used on Moose and Caribou as they gave complete penetration, side to side chest shot.
Best Wishes

 

[DarenN]

my .50 Hawken with 1:48 twist doesn't like the 250 grain REAL bullet at all. with patched round ball i can get 1" groups at 50 yards, but with the REAL bullets i was lucky to hit the paper! i loaded 50, 60, 70, and 80 grains of Pyro RS with no noticable difference. at least i'm not out a ton of money on the mold! :wink:

yes, i did cast them of pure lead. soft enough to scratch with my thumbnail.

Daren.....

 

[BrownBear]

Sounds as though your rifle is one that might profit from experiments with lubed felt wads over the powder. One of my 54's was just like your 50- wouldn't keep them on the paper. Still haven't taken any game with a REAL, but I'm sure impressed with the groups with the felt wads now. As good as RBs at 50 and better at 100.

 

[DarenN]

thanks Brownbear.
i'll call my local shop and see if i can get some felt wads. it's worth a try, at least.

it may not work.
my bore, in the grooves, measures .513 and the 250g REALs measure .509. ideally, i would think that the bullet should measure .513 as well to work properly. Hmmmm; i wonder if a paper patch might help?

Daren.........

 

[dbutch]

Mr. makeumsmoke,
Have never recovered any of the various REALs used on Moose and Caribou as they gave complete penetration, side to side chest shot.
Best Wishes

Thank You WindWalker..Have shot conical's in the past Buffalo bullet etc. all lead ..and have had the same results. Never found one... always 2 holes..Thank you for sharing...Dan

 

[paulvallandigham]

Order .54 cal. felt wads, to make absolutely sure the grooves are sealed behind the R.E.A.L. bullet in the .50 cal. The Ox Yoke, Now East Main pre-lubed felt wads work quite well, but most wads are only .010" over designated bore( caliber) diameter. Use the next larger size wad for your gun. That should make shooting the bullets as accurate as shooting any RB, and in your gun, perhaps even better than a PRB without the wad.

 

[DarenN]

thanks Paul!
can you or Brownbear tell me - what is the thickness of these wads? i have some felt kicking around that's about 3/16" thick, also, some that's about 1/16" thick. thinking i could make my own, and lube them with either Alox or Stumpy's "Moose Snot". (i've got beeswax coming. free.)

:surrender: sorry for the topic drift! :surrender:

 

[BrownBear]

thanks Paul!
can you or Brownbear tell me - what is the thickness of these wads? i have some felt kicking around that's about 3/16" thick, also, some that's about 1/16" thick. thinking i could make my own, and lube them with either Alox or Stumpy's "Moose Snot". (i've got beeswax coming. free.)

:surrender: sorry for the topic drift! :surrender:

I'd guess mine are somewhere between 1/8" and 3/16", but I haven't measured them. I'd go for the thicker of yours on one condition: I'd make sure there was no synthetic fiber in the felt. Don't want that stuff melting in the bore.

As for lubes I've used pure olive oil, melted wonderlube, a deer tallow/olive oil blend and melted mink oil grease. All worked well, just so long as theym weren't "wringing wet." The olive oil was the one that worried me, but I poured some over a handful in ziploc, then squeezed out the excess. If I had to pick one for mere handling, it would be either the mink oil or the wonderlube. Get the right amount on them and they kinda firm up when cool, making them easier to handle without spreading greasy kidstuff all over the place.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Some people cut their own wads from old felt hats they pick up at the Salvation Army, or Goodwill stores. They simply use two or more of the wads together to give them enough thickness.

I agree with BrownBears comments on lubes. Any good vegetable based oil or lube will work just fine. Bill Martin dips his in Ballistoil, lets them set out and dry, and used them that way. I don't like the smell of Ballistoil, so I choose
to use any vegetable oil, or wonderlube.

The pre-cut felt wads I have seen and used are approximately 1/8" thick. I don't think you would go wrong with a 3/16" wad, PROVIDED, as BB advises, you don't have any synthetic threads or fibers in the "felt". Some weather stripping, for instance, is a combination of real WOOL, and synthetic fibers. Other weather stripping is pure Wool. Its the latter that you want to use. :hmm: :grin: :thumbsup:

 

[rawhide]

where I shoot we ranged out to 82 yards. didn't see key holes with them though. my cva st. louis. hawken is 1&48 twist. I also shot the minies with it in 400 some thing grain. shoot realy good groupes but kicks like a mule. I got 5 elk with great plains bullets in 425 grns. same thing shoots good but kicks. with the real bullet it kicks like my pa's 308 win. do you think this load would take a black bear down? say at 50-80 yards? and should I aim for the shoulder or behinde it? most bear here averge around 300-400 pounds. and shots are close.

 

[BrownBear]

Dead bear.