Ramrod Ends

[Twowithone]

How do you tell the difference between 8/32s or 10/32s. My rod busted and I want to keep it wood and it has tips on both ends. The ball seater end of the rod unscrews and you can put a brass brush on this end. On the other end you can put your cleaning jags,bullet remover,scrapper, in this end.I know I put brads in it when I purchased this kit many moons ago and getting those brads out of there are going to be a chore in itself probaly wreck something doing this. Any and all recomendations would be greatly appreciated.

 

[doc623]

It would seem to me that you could measure/guage the threads of what you are putting in the ends of the rods.

As a side lite and not to change subject but to go back to the original of the RR ends; would roll/tention pins work for pinning the ends on the new RR?

 

[Twowithone]

doc623 I put pins in the original 1. Thats what Im saying Ill probaly just get new ends and a new rod and start fresh.

 

[Zonie]

A #8 thread is .164" in diameter. That's just a little larger than 5/32 of an inch.

A #10 thread is .190" in diameter. That's within a hair of 3/16 of an inch.

These diameters are measured over the tips (sharp points) of the threads.

A real simple way of measuring these would be to go to a hardware store and buy a #10-32 and a #8-32 nut. They would cost about 5 cents each.

Most of the roll pins I've seen are fairly large although if you could find one that is for a 1/16 inch hole it would work.
IMO, the big problem with using a roll pin is due to them usually being made out of steel, hardened to a spring temper. Filing these off flush with the brass tip would be more difficult than filing soft steel or brass. Filing them also wouldn't do your file any good.

I don't recommend using a large diameter cross pin thru the ramrod tip because of the amount of wood that is removed with larger sizes.

Using a 3/8 diameter tip for an example, they usually have close to a 1/16 inch thick wall. That makes the inside diameter about 1/4 of an inch.
The 1/4 inch diameter piece of wood that fits that hole in the tip must not only provide axial strength but any side load that is placed on the metal tip.

Drilling a 1/16 inch hole thru a 1/4 inch diameter piece of wood removes about 25 percent of the wood.
Upping the pin hole to 5/64 inch,( a 1/64 inch increase over a 1/16 inch hole) removes over 31 percent of the wood. That small increase in wood removal reduces the strength of the wood in an area where strength is critical.

Using a 3/32 diameter cross pin reduces the amount of wood in the area almost 40 percent.

Perhaps the easiest way to think of the 1/4 inch diameter piece of woods strength requirement is to imagine using a 3/16 diameter cross pin.
Such a pin would leave only 1/32 of an inch of wood per side that is holding the end of the wood to the main shaft. If this end of the wood should break off, what would remain to keep the cross pin from pulling out of the broken wood and leaving the metal ramrod tip somewhere down in the barrel?

 

[doc623]

I'll have to check the size of the pins available, but I see your points.

 

[doc623]

The roll pins/tension pins available are 2/32.
Would these work?
Or would you recommend just a small brass nail with epoxy?
I am one of those that like adhesives.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Don't use a roll pin. They are hardened steel and if one end is "proud" it will scratch the bejesus out of the barrel.

Nails are perfect as they are relatively soft. I even found some brass finishing nails and have hoarded them away for such uses.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Doc: Stop by some auto repair, or machine shop, and ask them to sell you some welding or brazing rod. They come in packs of a dozen, so they are fairly cheap. One rod will last you for years of making gear. I paid a friend $.25 when he he asked for a nickel, several years ago now. I still have a short piece of the rod. Its made of nickel and copper, and is fairly hard. But, its about 1/16" in diameter, or possibly smaller. I found I had the correct drill to use for it, and the metal not only peens over well, but it thickens and shortens the length of the pin as you tap on the end. I put epoxy in the hole before putting the pin in. Then I cut the pin off so leaving about 1/16" extra length to peen over both ends. I put one end of the pin on the top of my bench vise, and tapped the top of the pin with my machinist's hammer, with it ball peen end. When I flipped the stick over to work on the other side, all the epoxy had been pushed out, but the pin was firmly wedged in the hole through the shaft. I had beveled the edges of both holes to have a place for the metal to fit into. As it was, when I had peened both ends, I had to draw file off the excess metal to get the pins to be flush with the metal ferrule. I have had one of those rods now for almost 30 years and the pin has not moved.

 

[mckutzy]

a help to what paul had just said, slightly countersink very slightly, the metal rod end on both sides, it will give a bit more material to bite the rod end when u peen it over.