Range report: Enfield rifle

[Misplaced Rebel]

At the end of the day. I saw one guy who clearly hadn't cleaned his gun since he first shot it. Maybe water down the bore. Once. With one patch. The rifling was completely gone. In fact, it was a three-band Enfield, similar to the one discussed here.
Some reenactors think that all live firing is dangerous when using a reenacting gun. I've been to two reenactments, live firing my gun in the days before and firing blanks in the battle/drill. I've not shot anyone yet with an errant skirt. The good thing is that a large portion of the guys in my unit are hunters, and take care of their muskets (they use them for deer season) much better than other reenactors.
A note though- for competitions in the ACWSA and NSSA, we don't shoot at ranges beyond 100 yards. Then again, in the ACWSA, we shoot hanging clay pigeons and metal tiles freehand. The powder charges and rounds for longer range work are much different. Personally, I wouldn't take it any higher than the maximum I was told- 80grs. 2f.

Cheers,
_Chris

 

[Zonie]

I suspect you might have meant to type ".002" instead of ".02" when you were describing the resizing of your minie's?

.002 (two thousandths) under bore size would be a nice slip fit (in a clean barrel) while .020 (twenty thousandths) would fall down the crusty-est barrel from its own weight.

.002 undersized minies would easily expand into the rifling when they are fired while .020 undersized minies would never seal the bore.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Chris: Did you mean to say you size the minie balls about .002", rather than .02"???? The later seems to be a lot of "slop" between the ball and the bore.

The thickness of the skirt on these hollow base bullets seems to be very important for getting good accuracy. I would think you would only want to use those cast bullets that have the thicker skirts for this kind of shooting.

 

[Misplaced Rebel]

Yeah, sorry, I meant .002. I must have screwed that up when I edited the post. Thanks for catching that!
I do suspect one thing- certain bullets definitely are not for target work- RCBS Hodgdon bullets, for example. These skirts require a large charge (relatively speaking) in order to get their skirt to expand- 50 grs. plus. Not conducive to hitting anything but a deer/ paper target- freehand- at 50 or 100 yards. Bullets like the Rapine WC don't need much, say about 30-45grs. The standard Civil War minies seem to like 40grs+. The thickness needed all depends on the gun. Though, the thinner you get, the more likely you are to leave lead fragments behind, or worse, an entire skirt.

Cheers,
-Chris

 

[ResearchPress]

I do suspect one thing- certain bullets definitely are not for target work- RCBS Hodgdon bullets, for example.

I get good results from my RCBS and use it for 50m to 800 yards.

Long range shooting with the Enfield seems to be a peculiarly British sport. For some reason most nations seem shoot their military rifles at short range. Competition at Wimbledon and by the British Volunteers of the 19th century was generally out to 600 yards with the P/53.

David

 

[Misplaced Rebel]

Good lord, that's a long way to launch that chunk of lead...
I suppose, with a higher powder charge the RCBS bullets would tighten up considerably! For my purposes, though...
Really, the thing about the ACWSA is we're simulating fire at typical musket engagement ranges in a battle or skirmish line (for the ACW). The long range shooting is more representative of sharpshooter action (come to think of it, there are some competitions around here like that- for guys who own Whitworth rifles or Kerrs, or those dratted yankee 30lb target rifles!).

...And I just realized I hijacked this thread. :redface: Sorry,Paul!

-Chris

 

[ResearchPress]

See this thread on Enfield shooting in the Civil War: http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/225184/

David

 

[Misplaced Rebel]

Thanks! That's some real interesting stuff!
I have a quick question on the Kerr, since it came up in passing-
What the heck is "Ratchet Rifling"? I heard it referenced several times in proximity to Kerr rifles as to the manner of their bores. What does it look like and what are the benefits?

Thanks,
-Chris

 

[ResearchPress]

Rather than being square cut lands and grooves, on ratchet rifling one side of the land rises at an angle up to a square cut face, from where the next land commences with its angled face, etc. I hope that makes some sense. Another means of trying to control fouling I think.

Many forms of rifling were tried in the early 1860s particularly with long range rifles. Much changed after Metford demonstrated that rifling need not be deep cut.

David

 

[TFoley]

Rather than being square cut lands and grooves, on ratchet rifling one side of the land rises at an angle up to a square cut face, from where the next land commences with its angled face, etc. I hope that makes some sense. Another means of trying to control fouling I think.

Many forms of rifling were tried in the early 1860s particularly with long range rifles. Much changed after Metford demonstrated that rifling need not be deep cut.

David

Yup - think of the saw-tooth roof of an industrial building - now imagine it wrapped inside a barrel.

tac
Supporter of the Cape Meares Lighthouse Restoration Fund

 

[PaulN/KS]

That ratchet rifling sounds like it is in the shape of the Acme threads on a vise screw...

Wonder how they cut that shape into the barrel? :hmm:

 

[Zonie]

More like the threads called "Buttress threads".

Buttress threads have a loaded face that is almost perpinducular to the axis of the screw with a 45 degree flank backing up the face.
They are used for heavy load applications where the load is always coming from one direction.

Those of you who have a cap & ball pistol will have a good idea of what these ratchet rifling looks like by looking at the ratchet on the back of the cylinder.

Of course, the flank or angular portion of the rifling has a much gentler slope which is rounded to create the bore of the gun.

 

[Jason Lewis]

as an extension of this thread, if one was looking for an enfield repro which would you recomend. i'm looking for a shooter, i'm not a reenactor.

 

[poordevil]

According to the Dixie Gun Works cat. the Euroarms are the same as the made in Italy parker-hale which have progressive rifling in the 2 band rifle and musketoon.

I have the 1970's English Parker-Hale musketoon and it is beyond outstanding. If I were to get another Enfield, I would get the Euroarms brand.

P

 

[PaulN/KS]

"Buttress threads"...I'll have to remember that one. :hmm:
Thanks Zonie
:hatsoff:

 

[Jason Lewis]

According to the Dixie Gun Works cat. the Euroarms are the same as the made in Italy parker-hale which have progressive rifling in the 2 band rifle and musketoon.

I have the 1970's English Parker-Hale musketoon and it is beyond outstanding. If I were to get another Enfield, I would get the Euroarms brand.

P

that's good to know, i have the euroarms whitworth and it's a good shooter.