KSC said:
As a preface, I don't even own an ML yet, but will be hunting one next season. I'm pretty ballistics clever and have spent time on things between an M4/.223 up to a M82/.50.
The bullet will definitely maintian velocity longer and fly straighter- thats a given. But, the bullet would be slower out of the muzzle so it would have less velocity to start and would be impacted more by gravity. So how much straighter are talking about? Can I overcome the weight difference with a stiffer load and stretch my lethality to a longer distance with a bullet?
It is very difficult to make a ML using BP into a 200 yard gun without a range finder and a vernier sight and range settings.
The 50-54 RB will kill deer reliably to 150 yards if you can place the ball. Since most hunting is under 100 in most areas its really not a factor.
Elongated slugs in MLs often do not perform as advertised on game and may some do worse than a RB from reports I have received.
Killing power, "knock-down" power and muzzle energy are just something to talk about they have very little to do with killing power in projectiles at BP velocities, the bigger the ball the less reliable the ME figures will be when compared to HV cartridges. Example.
"Knock-down" greatly overused. VERY seldom can one knock down a deer unless a major bone is broken (then they generally get up) or the spine or brain is shocked or struck. Between myself and people I hunt with we have likely killed in excess of 300 head of deer, antelope and elk, vast array of calibers, bullet designs/weights and velocities. If I talk about knocking something down they agree with the statement above.
A HV load, probably 2500 impact velocity, may shock the brain by striking a large blood vessel leading to the head. I have seen deer knocked down with a heart shot on rare occassion and think this might have been the case. I knocked an antelope down once with 270 by striking the arteries and veins in the neck and assume this is what occurred.
I shot a MD doe with a 16 gauge ball last season. 1750 MV. Range 50 yards ball completely destroyed the top 1/2 of the heart. Deer not only did not go down she ran 55 yards. Massive blood loss, visible as she ran. But she did run, not very well but she ran off. The shot was through the deers front and the ball penetrated 29" making a 1" entrance in the hide and ball sized hole in the front of the brisket beside the windpipe. Very heavy hit.
Smaller ball? I once shot a MD buck at 140 paces with a 50rb and he went about 40 yards, lung shot. I have had similar results with lung shots with 38-40, 45-70, 44-90, 40-70, 50 & 54 RB, 54 percussion Sharps with the "issue" bullet (small B. bear ran 40+- yards), 6.5X55 and 30-06 (that I can recall off hand).
So how is the RB deficient? The answer is that it is not when used within its range. But this information will not sell advertising the shooting press.
There are a host of problems that arise in using slugs that are not generally talked about on the modern ML sites/magazines. The "naked" ones are prone for moving off the powder for example. Increased breech pressure is another.
The ML market has been flooded with various bullet designs over the past 35 odd years starting with the Maxi-ball. This started because some shooters did not want to be bothered with patching balls. A good many of them are not as good at killing game as the RB of similar diameter and none are as good as a RB of equal weight.
But if a company has a bullet to sell then the RB has to be deficient or there is no reason for the "new improved" etc product to sell. The fact that the 50-54 RB will shoot through a deer's chest side to side to at LEAST 150 yards can't be true since "the RB does not penetrate well". If it does the bullet is not needed. From the standpoint of the maker and their shills in firearms press the bullet IS needed. It MONEY. Facts be darned.
BTW this discussion has been going on since the 1830s or perhaps before. Generally the slugs have proven unsatisfactory.
Yes, the elongated slug will kill farther than the RB. But how often does the hunter actually use this range?? Seldom.
It is very easy to fall for the advertising of the bullet makers and stuff written by gun writers just remember that magazines will not alienate advertisers and many will lie outright to keep them happy.
Sorry for the rant but the utter BS fed the public concerning the RB vs the "new improved" over the past decades is one of my pet peeves.
The 5.56
and the 50BMG :grin:
I have never seen any 4 footed critters shot with the 50 BMG cartridge but it works well for other purposes. I REALLY like the M2 :bow:
The "223" has its advantages and disadvantages. Would not be my choice for deer though I have used it.
Dan
