Reaction of deer being hit

[PreglerD]

Hello hunting colleges,

I want to start the muzzleloader hunting in Germany. I'm interested in some things:
1. which zone of animal body is the best target zone?
2. How will animals react when they will be hit by a round bullet?

3. which bullets and powder charges will be used for small deer as for example whitetaildeer or so?

Thank you for answeríng.

Kirrmeister

 

[dlemaster]

One thing I've noticed is when I hit a deer they always tuck their tail tightly under their rump. If the tail goes up it's miss or maybe just a graze.

Regards, Dave

 

[roundball]

Hello hunting colleges,

I want to start the muzzleloader hunting in Germany. I'm interested in some things:
1. which zone of animal body is the best target zone?
2. How will animals react when they will be hit by a round bullet?

3. which bullets and powder charges will be used for small deer as for example whitetaildeer or so?

Thank you for answeríng.

Kirrmeister

My opinion and personal experiences are:
1)
A: Heart
B: Low double lungs
C: Head/Neck vertabrae if very close & sure

2)
Direct heart shot usually drops in sight after a mad dash of 25-35 yards...low double lung 50-60 yards.

3)
Since a .50cal RB is very adequate for a whitetail at typical woods distances under 100yds, sounds like that and the .45cal would be plenty for smaller deer.

As one reference, I happen to use 90grns Goex 3F for my whitetail RB loads.

 

[crockett]

There is also the theory that a high double lung shot takes longer to develop a blood trail- could be important in thickets.
Also, many modern cartridges can do wicked things in the penetration department. I would make sure you have a fairly good target with a muzzle loader.

 

[dmills]

Best shot is a broadside/quartering away into both lungs.

Good luck and welcome to the group. Please report back on your hunting.

Here in Texas I will be hunting in mixed woods along a river and levee on ranch lands, sometimes from a fixed stand and sometimes still hunting on the ground.

 

[BrownBear]

Lots of variability from animal to animal, but some general trends. On actual heart shots, I've had them jump straight up, then take off running a short distance. Not always, but any time I see that jump I'm pretty sure it's a heart shot.

Gutt shoot one, and often as not it's going to hump up briefly, then act sickly as it starts running.

Pop one in the lungs, and they often flinch before running like crazy. When I see that flinch and run, I'm pretty sure its lungs.

No hard and fast rules, but the signs I look for. In my experience, the bigger the hole you're pushing through them, the more obvious those signs will be.

 

[Stumpkiller]

I've had deer with the heart blown open (12 gauge slug) make it over 100 yards. But then, at 35 mph speed, even factoring in the "start-up" a deer clocking 25 mph can cover 36 feet per second. That's eight seconds of movement. Aim at the lungs and shoot low and you get a heart. Aim at the heart and shoot low and you get a leg.

I find the double lung shot to be the best "dropper", second only to a fractured spine. I would never deliberately try for that one, though. Another anatomical map.

In my percussion I like a .490" round ball in a .50 cal with .020" cotton tick and Moose Snot (castor oil/beeswax/oil soap) lube. Ahead of 84 gt 2F blackpowder.

This year in my flinter I'm loading a .530" round ball in a .54 cal with 82 Gr 3F and a 0.018" Moose Snot lubed patch.

As far as reactions I've had them collapse in a heap. Rear up and then collapse. Run like mad for 100 plus yards. Run into a tree. Run in a circle and die closer than when I shot. Look up, take a step and then collapse. Run 30 yards, look back, and then collapse. Walk away stiff legged with their ears back and tail up for 30 yards, and then collapse. Worst was one that ran hunched over with arched back. Left very little blood. I circled in spirals. Repeated. Finally found the deer five hours later about 80 yards from where I shot in a thick swamp. Fat had plugged the hole and it was back in the liver. They can't all be perfect.

My average shot is about 40 yards.

 

[Bountyhunter]

I have posted this picture several times, but it is a good teacher.

This is a shot that I made from a hide that I dug under a big Cedar tree. It is with a .53 Hawken, Hornady Great Plains 390 gr bullet, 100 gr of Goex FFg, distance approximately 80 yards. I think that this shot is a good representation of proper bullet placement. The lungs were jello, and the bullet exited the other side. The buck lurched forward and skidded in on his nose in about 15 yards. This is a typical 300# white tail buck in my herd. He did have, however, a very non-typical rack.

B

 

[Rocky Johnson]

300 pound whitetail?? :winking: Rocky

 

[PreglerD]

Hello hunting colleges,

many thanks for the good and various answers. As I can see is the reaction not very different to deer which have been hit by modern nitro powder guns. Hunting with those guns I have already a lot of expirience.Problem in Germany is that you need a minimum energy ordered by law. I first will have to test which caliber, charge and bullet will bring it. But I think in .54 a round bullet an about 100grs FFg will do it. I'm looking forward for getting more information especially how you are hunting.Do you sit in the forest over ground or do you walk arround in the forrest, earching the game?

 

[shmrck1]

This is a typical 300# white tail buck in my herd. He did have, however, a very non-typical rack.

BH,
I'm with Rocky here: Non-typical rack,maybe!
Non-typical weight, absolutely. (See non-muzzleloading post on 36pt buck) Dressed out at maybe 200lbs. :hmm:
snake-eyes :v

 

[shmrck1]

How will animals react when they will be hit by a round bullet?Kirrmeister

Personally, I have made the same shot
on two different bucks(heart/lung) and one
went 10 yards and another 300. The only difference
that I could see was the R/B was about 1" lower on
the heart of the 300 yarder.
snake-eyes :hmm:

 

[roundball]

"Typical 300 pound" whitetail??

What country do you live in?

 

[Plains99]

Depends on conditions. Most of my hunting in Kansas is still hunting along the edges of narrow forested travel lanes... staying out of the woods because of the noise. With snow cover I'll wade right through. In more forested areas I'll use a ground blind set up near travel lanes. I worry about sound and scent more than anything. I've had so many deer look right at me and not recognize the danger that I am convinced that they need sound or scent to initiate a flight response. I'd rather be caught by a deer on open wheat fields with sound and scent in my favor than try to work through a noisey forest floor environment to get up on them.

 

[Bountyhunter]

These are Kansas deer, they live and feed in the bottoms, and feed on alfalfa, milo, corn, soybeans and wheat. They are also blessed with some good genetics, as we are taking nice big racks and big bodied bucks out of there. 300# is live weight. In the big bucks contests that we compete in, carcass weights--hanging carcass, skinned, gutted, closely trimmed--are running just shy of 200#. You Kansas guys know this well. It is not unusual to pull the hide off of one of these bucks in the September ML season and get an inch and a half of backfat saddle on them. Of course, this gets used up pretty quickly as the rut comes on in November. This buck is a September buck, and would probably lose 30# by the December season. These big bodied bucks taken in December will be almost devoid of fat and still weigh 250-275. They will rail at about 175.

Does are not as large, naturally, and it is not considered ethical where I hunt to shoot yearlings or fork horns. We do not shoot anything with less than 4 points to a side--4x4. Spikes seem to die sometime in the summer, as we sometimes find their bones when we are hunting. Spikes are genetically inferior and are not permitted to remain in the herds long enough to breed. So we are usually shooting 3-4 year old animals who have had time enough to develop. Also, I hunt on five thousand acres that only myself and one other hunter are permitted to hunt on, so we do not shoot out our genetics. Our game wardens say, that if given the opportunity of making a choice of having two deer in front of you, which to shoot, the spike or the big buck, kill the big buck and then kill the spike. Take the big buck home and leave the spike for the coyotes.

That is the reason I do not shoot these NM deer. They are small bodied, because the poachers have shot out the genetics, and they eat scrub oak, sage, mesquite beans, and juniper berries, and they stink so bad when you dress them that the dog wont even eat the scraps. The grain fed deer have almost no game odor and require no spice or covering onions or garlic for cooking.

Sorry, some of you guys get the little ones.

Bill

 

[Stumpkiller]

"Typical 300 pound" whitetail??

What country do you live in?

:haha:

You should come up and see some of the NY/PA deer. Last year we had a hoax(?) deer from Clarion River PA that went 412 lbs. :haha: (Not the same deer in the two pictures - the live deer was passed to me as having been taken semi-locally in a trail camera!)

Best I ever did at a check-station stop was 220# field dressed, and that was a doe! Our local big buck contests hit 300# field dressed occasionally.

 

[roundball]

I swear, steroids are showing up everywhere...now they're in deer feed !!
:rotf:

 

[Bountyhunter]

I was waitin at the truck dealership a while back to get my truck serviced and was reading some of the old magazines there. They had a bunch of old Field and Stream magazines probably two or three years old, and one of them had an article about the timing of the rut around the United States, and also an article about body size across the country. There is a wide variation from South to North, in both the timing of the rut, and body size. The biggest ones seem to be in the prairie provinces of Canada, with the size decreasing south and east.

 

[rebel727]

There's some 300 lb deer in Ms. Mostly in the northern counties where there's a lot of soybeans.

 

[Old Ironsights]

I swear, steroids are showing up everywhere...now they're in deer feed !!
:rotf:

You obviously haven't been reading the ingredients on the commercial "Grow Big Racks" deer supplements out there.

Might as well be steroids.