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Rifle Shoppe "Scottish Musket" and "James II Musket"

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Tacksman45

Pilgrim
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Hello,

Can anyone show me an example of what The Rifle Shoppe's "Scottish musket" (665) or their "James II musket" (774) are supposed to look like when they are completed? If not completed, does anyone have a picture of the assembled lock for the James II musket?

Thanks!
 
To the people of Scotland, this King James is not the second but the "seventh and second" just as his grandfather (of KJV Bible fame) was James the sixth and first. King James II was killed by an exploding cannon in 1460.

I can see why the Rifle Shoppe would prefer to keep things simple.
 
To the people of Scotland, this King James is not the second but the "seventh and second" just as his grandfather (of KJV Bible fame) was James the sixth and first. King James II was killed by an exploding cannon in 1460.

I can see why the Rifle Shoppe would prefer to keep things simple.
The product number is 665
 

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I finally was able to track down a couple photos from a freind with an old catalog. I'm even more excited now about the project I wish someone made a heiron butt scottish rifle kit. I suppose I could always custom make one ?
 
I finally was able to track down a couple photos from a freind with an old catalog. I'm even more excited now about the project I wish someone made a heiron butt scottish rifle kit. I suppose I could always custom make one ?
I've been working a bit on this piece. Figuring out the lock, sear, trigger was a bit of a bear.
IMG_2023-11-08-10-22-40-184.jpg
 
I live in Edinburgh, and keep looking at the paddle butt Scots rifles that are in the Scottish National Museum. They are all snaphaunces with full stocked swamped barrels with bores of around .36. They all tend to be quite short apart from one enormous specimen which is known as the "Bredalbane Gun" which was made in 1595 and is the oldest known example of a Scottish long gun. It was being used as the footrest of a trestle table in an old house..!

http://nms.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-100-000-826-C
Nobody makes anything like them and they are very rare. The Scots were not great riflemen, preferring Broadswords and pistols to long arms. There used to be a thriving pistol making trade in several Scottish towns such as Doune and Leith, but most of the market was destroyed following the 1745 rebellion. Pistol manufacture for the Scots regiments moved to Birmingham, England which also made dress pistols. At one time steel pistols were part of Traditional Highland Dress along with a long knife or Dirk. These days only the "Black Knife" worn in the top of the sock still remains..!

Following the Dunblane massacre in 1996, most firearms have been removed from Scottish Museums.

The Rifle Shoppe Scottish musket obviously uses an early flintlock with a transverse sear, but not the authentic Snaphaunce lock used on the original long guns. I suspect that scratch built would be the only way forward.. they are pretty angular designs, and use fruit wood for stocks, but barrels would be a challenge!
 
I live in Edinburgh, and keep looking at the paddle butt Scots rifles that are in the Scottish National Museum. They are all snaphaunces with full stocked swamped barrels with bores of around .36. They all tend to be quite short apart from one enormous specimen which is known as the "Bredalbane Gun" which was made in 1595 and is the oldest known example of a Scottish long gun. It was being used as the footrest of a trestle table in an old house..!

http://nms.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-100-000-826-C
Nobody makes anything like them and they are very rare. The Scots were not great riflemen, preferring Broadswords and pistols to long arms. There used to be a thriving pistol making trade in several Scottish towns such as Doune and Leith, but most of the market was destroyed following the 1745 rebellion. Pistol manufacture for the Scots regiments moved to Birmingham, England which also made dress pistols. At one time steel pistols were part of Traditional Highland Dress along with a long knife or Dirk. These days only the "Black Knife" worn in the top of the sock still remains..!

Following the Dunblane massacre in 1996, most firearms have been removed from Scottish Museums.

The Rifle Shoppe Scottish musket obviously uses an early flintlock with a transverse sear, but not the authentic Snaphaunce lock used on the original long guns. I suspect that scratch built would be the only way forward.. they are pretty angular designs, and use fruit wood for stocks, but barrels would be a challenge!
Thank you for the information, I'm always trying to gather more info on scottish arms as you say there rare and very under presented in modern building. I'm an eccentric to say the least I work and live in montana year round in a great kilt or military style kilt and usually have a a dirk, and sgian achles on me. To me the shapes and designs of the Scottish firearms I've seen thus far are just beautiful in design. Do you have any recommendations on books along this subject ? It's also sad that they have thought to remove there antique arms from museums over an evil act. I suppose if the Scottish people have no use of there arms they can send them to me :)
 
I live in Edinburgh, and keep looking at the paddle butt Scots rifles that are in the Scottish National Museum. They are all snaphaunces with full stocked swamped barrels with bores of around .36. They all tend to be quite short apart from one enormous specimen which is known as the "Bredalbane Gun" which was made in 1595 and is the oldest known example of a Scottish long gun. It was being used as the footrest of a trestle table in an old house..!

http://nms.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-100-000-826-C
Nobody makes anything like them and they are very rare. The Scots were not great riflemen, preferring Broadswords and pistols to long arms. There used to be a thriving pistol making trade in several Scottish towns such as Doune and Leith, but most of the market was destroyed following the 1745 rebellion. Pistol manufacture for the Scots regiments moved to Birmingham, England which also made dress pistols. At one time steel pistols were part of Traditional Highland Dress along with a long knife or Dirk. These days only the "Black Knife" worn in the top of the sock still remains..!

Following the Dunblane massacre in 1996, most firearms have been removed from Scottish Museums.

The Rifle Shoppe Scottish musket obviously uses an early flintlock with a transverse sear, but not the authentic Snaphaunce lock used on the original long guns. I suspect that scratch built would be the only way forward.. they are pretty angular designs, and use fruit wood for stocks, but barrels would be a challenge!
 
I live in Edinburgh, and keep looking at the paddle butt Scots rifles that are in the Scottish National Museum. They are all snaphaunces with full stocked swamped barrels with bores of around .36. They all tend to be quite short apart from one enormous specimen which is known as the "Bredalbane Gun" which was made in 1595 and is the oldest known example of a Scottish long gun. It was being used as the footrest of a trestle table in an old house..!

http://nms.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-100-000-826-C
Nobody makes anything like them and they are very rare. The Scots were not great riflemen, preferring Broadswords and pistols to long arms. There used to be a thriving pistol making trade in several Scottish towns such as Doune and Leith, but most of the market was destroyed following the 1745 rebellion. Pistol manufacture for the Scots regiments moved to Birmingham, England which also made dress pistols. At one time steel pistols were part of Traditional Highland Dress along with a long knife or Dirk. These days only the "Black Knife" worn in the top of the sock still remains..!

Following the Dunblane massacre in 1996, most firearms have been removed from Scottish Museums.

The Rifle Shoppe Scottish musket obviously uses an early flintlock with a transverse sear, but not the authentic Snaphaunce lock used on the original long guns. I suspect that scratch built would be the only way forward.. they are pretty angular designs, and use fruit wood for stocks, but barrels would be a challenge!
Also the smaller caliber for most Scott's firearms I was familiar with, is it possible that these TRS scottish muskets are actually German in manufacture ? The listing suggests there were several, and if they were early scottish flintlock muskets or upgraded to said flintlock a closer look at the stock would tell the tail of an earlier type mechanism. My question is how do they know there scottish ?
 
Hi Rob,

Yes, the majority of calibres I am aware of are small, certainly not many above .5, most less. Scotland did not have many large animals apart from deer, and money was always tight!

It is difficult to tell the origin of a firearm apart from its style. The guns from which TRS patterned its reproductions were found in Germany, but supposedly belonged to Scottish mercenaries. The photo of the full stocked musket from the early catalogue certainly looks like a Scots gun as the barrel is stepped and the stock looks to be in the Scots style.. the top comb seems a bit high though, however this may have been a later development.. the use of the flintlock, even though it is of early design, would indicate a later evolution..

The TRS pistol kit is also of a later pattern, and more of the type made in Birmingham. The original fish and heart stocked pistols are truly works of art... The book you should try and find is "The Scottish Pistol" by Martin Kelvin ISBN 1-900541-15--7

This is good too:

https://www.flagstaffscottishclub.c...ottish-firearms-part-i-scottish-steel-pistols
 
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