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Safe to shoot roundball in a cap and ball revolver?
- Thread starter TGPN56
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There are those here much more learned than I. However, I have shot RB's w/ spurs in the past and had no problem.
No problem,, load with the sprue facing forward if possible,,
,,or just forget it has a sprue.
,,or just forget it has a sprue.
The sprue is fine as long as the ball is loaded in such a way that the extra material isn't going to be sheared off by the mouth of the chamber.
Not that shearing off the excess lead would create a safety problem. It wouldn't.
Shearing off the extra lead would take extra force on the loading lever though and the extra force needed could damage it.
Just make sure the balls are slightly larger than the chambers. The larger balls will shear off a little lead making them exactly the same size as the chamber.
This is necessary to keep the flame from the firing chamber from lighting off the powder in the adjacent chambers.
It is also necessary to keep the loaded ball in the chamber from moving forward, out of the chambers mouth, when the gun recoils.
If a ball moves out of the chamber it can lock up the action when the hammer is cocked for the next shot.
Not that shearing off the excess lead would create a safety problem. It wouldn't.
Shearing off the extra lead would take extra force on the loading lever though and the extra force needed could damage it.
Just make sure the balls are slightly larger than the chambers. The larger balls will shear off a little lead making them exactly the same size as the chamber.
This is necessary to keep the flame from the firing chamber from lighting off the powder in the adjacent chambers.
It is also necessary to keep the loaded ball in the chamber from moving forward, out of the chambers mouth, when the gun recoils.
If a ball moves out of the chamber it can lock up the action when the hammer is cocked for the next shot.
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They were designed to shoot round balls. Bullets or "conicals" as they're called were adopted later on.
Actually bullets in original Walkers were a bad idea because of the pressure increase with their use.
Walker's had a bad reputation for burst cylinders because they were made of iron not steel and was the main reason for their large size.
Actually bullets in original Walkers were a bad idea because of the pressure increase with their use.
Walker's had a bad reputation for burst cylinders because they were made of iron not steel and was the main reason for their large size.
If they roll into the chamber the balls are too small. That is a problem. Balls must to be slightly larger than the chamber. Seals the chambers and keeps balls seated against the powder.
Previous;
Current;
Either way, your cast ball is still too small.
What size mold do you have?
necchi said:
Current;
I guess you did.TGPN56 said:
Either way, your cast ball is still too small.
What size mold do you have?
rodwha
58 Cal.
Still too small.
You should be able to place them over the chamber with the sprue up/down and it not fall into the chamber.
Do you have a micrometer?
You should be able to place them over the chamber with the sprue up/down and it not fall into the chamber.
Do you have a micrometer?
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Though a micrometer is much more accurate than dial calipers for measuring the diameter of round balls, it sounds like the OP could use a good set of dial calipers to find out what size his chambers are in the Walker and also measure the ball size.
Gus
Gus
It would be interesting to know what size of casting mold you have. That would give us a chance to figure out what the balls would be used in.
As we are only talking about the balls needing to be a few thousandths of an inch larger than the chamber you might have the right sized mold but the lead alloy is causing the trouble.
Some alloys shrink more than others when they cool.
On the other hand, it's possible you have a ball mold that's made for use in a single shot gun.
Typically, a single shot gun will be loaded with a patched ball so the ball is smaller than the bore size. A .45 caliber single shot would use a .440 or .445 diameter ball.
A .44 caliber cap and ball gun on the other hand should be using a .451 to .457 diameter ball.
The thing to remember about muzzleloading guns is, the caliber or size is the size of the actual bore. With a rifled barrel, the rifling will always be larger than the bore size.
For instance, a .44 caliber 1860 Colt reproduction will have a bore size of .440 but the rifling size could be .452.
That .452 diameter is the reason the chambers in the cylinder and the ball size will be somewhere in the .450+ size.
As we are only talking about the balls needing to be a few thousandths of an inch larger than the chamber you might have the right sized mold but the lead alloy is causing the trouble.
Some alloys shrink more than others when they cool.
On the other hand, it's possible you have a ball mold that's made for use in a single shot gun.
Typically, a single shot gun will be loaded with a patched ball so the ball is smaller than the bore size. A .45 caliber single shot would use a .440 or .445 diameter ball.
A .44 caliber cap and ball gun on the other hand should be using a .451 to .457 diameter ball.
The thing to remember about muzzleloading guns is, the caliber or size is the size of the actual bore. With a rifled barrel, the rifling will always be larger than the bore size.
For instance, a .44 caliber 1860 Colt reproduction will have a bore size of .440 but the rifling size could be .452.
That .452 diameter is the reason the chambers in the cylinder and the ball size will be somewhere in the .450+ size.
Rick Boylan
45 Cal.
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I've never shot anything but round ball in my cap and ball revolvers. They work great.
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Gus is right about a mic being more accurate for measuring round balls but that being said I almost never use a mic as I've gotten so used to using my calipers.
I only need my digital Starett mic for ten thousands reads as after using a caliper for so many years I can hold .0005 for outside reads (half a thousands)with my dial caliper regularly which is more than enough accuracy for most gun work.
For inside reads I use a split ball gauge and the calipers.
I only need my digital Starett mic for ten thousands reads as after using a caliper for so many years I can hold .0005 for outside reads (half a thousands)with my dial caliper regularly which is more than enough accuracy for most gun work.
For inside reads I use a split ball gauge and the calipers.
Tom Compton
54 Cal.
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IowaShooter said:
:metoo:
I've only fired about 10 cast bullets out of a Cap & Ball revolver.
I bought a used 1851 Colt Navy in .36 caliber and included with it was a brass bullet mold.
The mold is the type that is often included in a Boxed Presentation set and is, IMO, more for show than for go.
Anyway, this mold casts a single roundball and a single bullet so I decided to cast up a few bullets to see how they worked.
The bullets are heeled with the rear area @ .360 diameter X .12" and the forward body diameter being .380 diameter. The bullet is pointed with an overall length of .560".
For those who don't know, these "heeled" bullets smaller diameter at the rear use that area to serve as a guide. This centers the bullet in the chamber before it is rammed.
I found the heel fit very loosely into the chambers and the body size was quite a bit oversize for the .367 diameter chambers on my pistol.
This resulted in a easy drop in for the first 1/8" but it took a tremendous amount of force on the loading lever to ram the bullets into the chamber.
I only fired about 10 of the bullets before I called it quits.
Although the loading lever and ram survived the ordeal, I didn't think it was worth the trouble to shoot any more of these bullets.
Besides, the accuracy was pretty mediocre when compared with the .375 diameter lead balls I normally shoot in my .36's.
I bought a used 1851 Colt Navy in .36 caliber and included with it was a brass bullet mold.
The mold is the type that is often included in a Boxed Presentation set and is, IMO, more for show than for go.
Anyway, this mold casts a single roundball and a single bullet so I decided to cast up a few bullets to see how they worked.
The bullets are heeled with the rear area @ .360 diameter X .12" and the forward body diameter being .380 diameter. The bullet is pointed with an overall length of .560".
For those who don't know, these "heeled" bullets smaller diameter at the rear use that area to serve as a guide. This centers the bullet in the chamber before it is rammed.
I found the heel fit very loosely into the chambers and the body size was quite a bit oversize for the .367 diameter chambers on my pistol.
This resulted in a easy drop in for the first 1/8" but it took a tremendous amount of force on the loading lever to ram the bullets into the chamber.
I only fired about 10 of the bullets before I called it quits.
Although the loading lever and ram survived the ordeal, I didn't think it was worth the trouble to shoot any more of these bullets.
Besides, the accuracy was pretty mediocre when compared with the .375 diameter lead balls I normally shoot in my .36's.
AZbpBurner
54 Cal.
I've got several of the same brass presentation molds in .36 & also .44. I used the .36 mold as a kid, to cast the thousands of RB's used in a Colt 1861 Navy. I went on to later cast using various Lee RB molds & have several rifles & revolvers that have never seen anything but cast balls.
The Lee mold cutter leaves minimal sprue nub & loaded either up or down, doesn't much matter.
The Lee mold cutter leaves minimal sprue nub & loaded either up or down, doesn't much matter.
for a test I dry balled .451 hand cast balls in the cylinder of an 1851 Pietta .44 Navy. Sprue up, sprue down and sprue on the side. The balls were knocked out through the nipple hole with a brass punch.
In every case there was a nice wide band sealing around the ball.
I cannot speak for accuracy these guns are used shooting CAS and accuracy is not a problem.
My thought is "sprue it! stuff 'em in and let fly".
but that is just me.
WB
In every case there was a nice wide band sealing around the ball.
I cannot speak for accuracy these guns are used shooting CAS and accuracy is not a problem.
My thought is "sprue it! stuff 'em in and let fly".
but that is just me.
WB
To the op, when the ball is the right size it will as said shave a ring of lead off the ball. The rammer has a round cup in the end to fit the ball size. It takes a bit of pressure to ram home. The sprue mostly gets rounded out when rammed.
