Today was my first time out with my 58 remi .44 Pietta. I found that using approx 25gr of FFFg with wonder wad and .454 ball, the ball was seated quite abit below the cylinder opening. I was concerned about leaving air space so I pushed them down as far as the lever would go. Is this over compressing the load? Can I seat just below the top of the cylinder with this load and not have to worry about air space? I guess I don't have a good feel for the amount of pressure required, since it does take some force to shave the lead ring off the ball. I am looking for an accuracy load.
Seating the ball question
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tnlonghunter
40 Cal.
On mine, it doesn't take too much extra pressure to seat the ball. I use 25 gr. 3F w/ felt wad and .454 rb and once the ring is shaved off the ball, the rest goes pretty easily. I can get 4 shots touching at 15 yards off the bench with that load. I don't use any extra filler.
I'm no engineer but I would rather have that ball and wad seated firmly against the charge. If there is a gap in between it could cause a overpressure and at worst blow out your cylinder causing injuries to you or those by you. It could also bend the frame and be a disaster. If you are concerned about seating the ball so far back add a bit more powder (Don't exceed recommended charges) or increase the FG amount as the larger grains are a bit more coarse and will fill those tubes up by volume. Thickness of patch also makes a difference. 25gr seems a bit light but the loads will ultimately be left to you. This is only my opinion for what it's worth and there are a lot of folks here with a lot more experience than me who might give some insight. Hope it helps!
You should always load your revolver with the ball seated against the powder or against a felt wad or filler like corn meal placed on top of the powder charge.
Many revolver shooters feel that having the ball/bullet seated just below the mouth of the chamber makes a more accurate shot but if you do choose to do this add just enough filler (or wads) to assure compression of the gunpowder.
As a general rule of thumb if you use corn meal or Cream of Wheat, after loading the powder charge, add the filler until it is about 1/4 to 5/16 of an inch below the chamber mouth. Then ram the ball into the chamber until it is just below the face of the cylinder.
I think that Celt5494 meant to say "thickness of the wad" instead of "thickness of the patches" as patches aren't used in a cap and ball revolver (unless they are being used as a cheap way of making a wad).
Many revolver shooters feel that having the ball/bullet seated just below the mouth of the chamber makes a more accurate shot but if you do choose to do this add just enough filler (or wads) to assure compression of the gunpowder.
As a general rule of thumb if you use corn meal or Cream of Wheat, after loading the powder charge, add the filler until it is about 1/4 to 5/16 of an inch below the chamber mouth. Then ram the ball into the chamber until it is just below the face of the cylinder.
I think that Celt5494 meant to say "thickness of the wad" instead of "thickness of the patches" as patches aren't used in a cap and ball revolver (unless they are being used as a cheap way of making a wad).
Toomuch_36
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As has been pointed out here the first' and most important, is to make sure the ball is seated.
I have tried both filler and/or extra wads to space the ball to the end of the cylinder as well as useing only one wad over powder and have noticed no difference in accuracy.
My best load is (20gr./3F-1 dry lubed felt wad-.457RB) for both of my '58 Rems.
Toomuch
...........
Shoot Flint
I have tried both filler and/or extra wads to space the ball to the end of the cylinder as well as useing only one wad over powder and have noticed no difference in accuracy.
My best load is (20gr./3F-1 dry lubed felt wad-.457RB) for both of my '58 Rems.
Toomuch
...........
Shoot Flint
I would rather use more powder to fill up the space if any. I usally run 30 grains in the .44, and seating a ring cut lead ball always works.
I would not like to add to the loading procedure. Now if powder is scarce then that's another matter.
I would not like to add to the loading procedure. Now if powder is scarce then that's another matter.
Dave Rosenthal
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Every gun is different! Find out by experimentation what works better for you.
My load, good out to 50 yards: 27 grains of 3Fg Goex, a pre-lubed wonder wad (that I rub a little more lube on this time of the year to keep the fouling nice and soft), and a .454 Hornady ball. I seat it completely down by using a custom built loading stand. This allows me to get superior repeatability in the loading process which in turn provides me with a lower standard deviation in velocity (sdv). That's mumbo-jumbo for the groups are really tight together!
Some shooters can't notice the difference, others have told me that my load is the best they have tried thus far. I like to deal with uniformity when it comes to black powder loading & shooting. By doing everything the same, I eliminate variables which can cause erratic behavior (flyers). Seating balls to the same uniform depth is one of those variables. Uniform "compaction" of the charge means that the balls are given a fighting chance of winding-up in the same place on the target if I do my job!
Dave
NRA Black Powder Pistol Sharpshooter
My load, good out to 50 yards: 27 grains of 3Fg Goex, a pre-lubed wonder wad (that I rub a little more lube on this time of the year to keep the fouling nice and soft), and a .454 Hornady ball. I seat it completely down by using a custom built loading stand. This allows me to get superior repeatability in the loading process which in turn provides me with a lower standard deviation in velocity (sdv). That's mumbo-jumbo for the groups are really tight together!
Some shooters can't notice the difference, others have told me that my load is the best they have tried thus far. I like to deal with uniformity when it comes to black powder loading & shooting. By doing everything the same, I eliminate variables which can cause erratic behavior (flyers). Seating balls to the same uniform depth is one of those variables. Uniform "compaction" of the charge means that the balls are given a fighting chance of winding-up in the same place on the target if I do my job!
Dave
NRA Black Powder Pistol Sharpshooter
token tory
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I have a Uberti made pistol so there may be tiny differences in dimensions. Anyway!
Being one of the new guys here I followed '50's advice & used a 27gr load, a felt wad & then seated the ball by hand pressure, using the provided lever on the pistol. I think the wad is a good starter's component for a couple of reasons, one of which may no longer be needed by the more experienced shooters.
I like to recreate, as much as is practical, the experience of a cap & ball revolver, so I don't (this may change :hmm: ) use a reloading stand. Because of this I have the need for an extra hand when loading. The wads relieve me of this as long as I remember to use the following loading sequence:
Measure your powder into some kind of measure (I like a range pickup .357 Magnum pistol case, but .45ACP works well.) Just remember to clean dirt & so on from the insides of the case or even keep a good spare handy
Now dump that one charge into a chamber & press the wad over the charge right away.
This allows you to put the pistol down, or even holster it, without loose powder spilling everywhere.:thumbsup:
Now repeat the powder/wad sequence till all 5 (or 6) are charged with powder & wad.
Next I point the barrel vertical, or very close to it, place a ball in the mouth of a chamber with a little firm finger pressure & then rotate it under the ram & seat the whole shenanigan. I find that using my left hand to hold the pistol grip & the right hand (my strong hand) to seat is both easier, & I "feel" the seating better. Originally I tried the left hand to seat, but I found it clumsy & lacking in feel, YMMV though.
Finally I cap the nipples with the muzzle pointing down range.
What the wad does for me is to pad out a little extra space in the chambers so that I feel comfortable that the ball is fully seated on the charge with about 1/4" remaining at the front of the chamber in front of the ball. This does not seem to have a bad effect on accuracy as I've been able to get all 6 in one big raggedy hole when firing with my wrists supported.
That group is a little :rotf: bigger when I switch to one handed standing!
Being one of the new guys here I followed '50's advice & used a 27gr load, a felt wad & then seated the ball by hand pressure, using the provided lever on the pistol. I think the wad is a good starter's component for a couple of reasons, one of which may no longer be needed by the more experienced shooters.
I like to recreate, as much as is practical, the experience of a cap & ball revolver, so I don't (this may change :hmm: ) use a reloading stand. Because of this I have the need for an extra hand when loading. The wads relieve me of this as long as I remember to use the following loading sequence:
Measure your powder into some kind of measure (I like a range pickup .357 Magnum pistol case, but .45ACP works well.) Just remember to clean dirt & so on from the insides of the case or even keep a good spare handy
Now dump that one charge into a chamber & press the wad over the charge right away.
This allows you to put the pistol down, or even holster it, without loose powder spilling everywhere.:thumbsup:
Now repeat the powder/wad sequence till all 5 (or 6) are charged with powder & wad.
Next I point the barrel vertical, or very close to it, place a ball in the mouth of a chamber with a little firm finger pressure & then rotate it under the ram & seat the whole shenanigan. I find that using my left hand to hold the pistol grip & the right hand (my strong hand) to seat is both easier, & I "feel" the seating better. Originally I tried the left hand to seat, but I found it clumsy & lacking in feel, YMMV though.
Finally I cap the nipples with the muzzle pointing down range.
What the wad does for me is to pad out a little extra space in the chambers so that I feel comfortable that the ball is fully seated on the charge with about 1/4" remaining at the front of the chamber in front of the ball. This does not seem to have a bad effect on accuracy as I've been able to get all 6 in one big raggedy hole when firing with my wrists supported.
That group is a little :rotf: bigger when I switch to one handed standing!
Dave Rosenthal
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Sounds like you're doing everything correctly, except the part of holstering with only a wad holding the powder into the chambers. Sometimes the wads will temporarily tilt sideways as they're pushed into the chambers or some powder may leak from around a small gap as the wads "uncompress". Other than that I think that you're fine.
Most gunfighters of the old west didn't have to shoot 13 shots in a league setting at each of two different targets at both 25 and 50 yards, for a 26-round count, all the while maintaining consistency in the entire process. That's what our league has to do when we fire the NRA Qualification Matches for pistols. Those loading stands help to keep all of the muzzles pointed up in a safe direction, without the need to point the hand gun at yourself or others, when being loaded behind a common firing line, and expedite the clock time necessary to complete said match. When a dozen folks are handling firearms simultaneously at a common firing line, safety is the primary concern, so the stands really help with that!
Of course if you're by yourself and you want the "feel" of exactly what it was like to have to deal with reloading, possibly under fire, there's nothing like doing it all by oneself. :thumbsup:
Enjoy yourself and make smoke as often as the blizzards will let you! :haha:
Dave
Most gunfighters of the old west didn't have to shoot 13 shots in a league setting at each of two different targets at both 25 and 50 yards, for a 26-round count, all the while maintaining consistency in the entire process. That's what our league has to do when we fire the NRA Qualification Matches for pistols. Those loading stands help to keep all of the muzzles pointed up in a safe direction, without the need to point the hand gun at yourself or others, when being loaded behind a common firing line, and expedite the clock time necessary to complete said match. When a dozen folks are handling firearms simultaneously at a common firing line, safety is the primary concern, so the stands really help with that!
Of course if you're by yourself and you want the "feel" of exactly what it was like to have to deal with reloading, possibly under fire, there's nothing like doing it all by oneself. :thumbsup:
Enjoy yourself and make smoke as often as the blizzards will let you! :haha:
Dave
token tory
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Holstering may be a touch extended for dramatic license.
I have yet o find a holster with the required length.
:redface:
I have yet o find a holster with the required length.
:redface:
Dave Rosenthal
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Check the Cabela's online catalog for holsters. They come in many styles, including full flap, strong-side, cross-draw, etc. Not expensive and do the job.
madcratebuilder
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smokin .50 said:
+1
Using a loading stand that has a way to set rammer depth really helps if your shooting for groups. Being consistent in your loading, either by hand or stand, makes for smaller groups.
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