Seneca rifle

[Oldnamvet]

A friend of mine has a mint condition seneca that he got years ago. He said it is a .32 cal with fast twist so that it wouldn't shoot PRB well but did group will with conicals. I hadn't heard of any seneca rifles in calibers other than 36 and 45. Was this common or a special item?

 

[MikeChapin]

I haven't either. The Cherokee came in .32 and .45 and was the same size as the Seneca but didn't have a capbox or nosecap. He may have a Cherokee barrel on it. They were interchangeable.

I'm skeptical about it not shooting RB well. It sounds like he was stoking it up too much for good accuracy. Even with a fast twist a .32 RB should give decent accuracy with a load range of 20-30 grains of powder. The small calibers with a fast twist can be picky about the most accurate load but a little time a patience should be able get it driving tacks at 25 and 50 yards.

 

[gonpce]

I've got a Cherokee in .32 that shoots prb great with either 20 or 30 grains of powder. Very accurate.

 

[robert31352]

The Cherokee did have a .36 caliber because I have one. It says Cherokee 36 cal on the barrel. I am looking at it right now. They came in a kit gun back in the old days of TC Cherokee's. They also made a .32 in Seneca. Very few around. If you find one...BUY IT! I have allthree calibers in Cherokee. I am dying to get a 32 in Senica so I will have all three of those.

 

[SmokeEater2]

I wish TC (or any company) would make another run of these calibers, My huntin' buddy and I have both been looking for a .32 or .36 but the few we've stumbled across have been priced way high for the condition they were in.

 

[Anonym]

I picked up a Seneca in .36 last year and finally got around to shooting it some this year. It's a fantastic shooter! They seem to be getting extremely high on their prices and I was tempted to sell earlier this year and glad I changed my mind.

I've been looking for a .45 barrel for mine so I'd have something for the wife to use and the kids to grow into. Can't seem to find any that are worth picking up that they don't want an arm and a leg for!

On a side note, I emailed Track about Seneca/Cherokee barrels since they have some barrel stock and breech plugs in stock. They said if there was enough interest, they may start offering drop-in barrels for these rifles again. If any of you are interested, give them a shout!

 

[Oldnamvet]

I may have to think about getting another couple barrels since I did some trading and ended up with the Seneca in .32. Turns out he got his from the custom shop. The barrel is a really deep dark shiny blue and is marked as .32 cal T/C etc. but no model name is included. I haven't measured the twist yet but he said it was made mainly for shooting T/C maxi's. I hadn't seen maxi's in .32 and then he pulled out the mold that came with the gun. No name anywhere on the mold but it is a large nice .32 maxi mold, single cavity, that throws little pills of about 100 grains. Now to get some accessories for it and get out to the range. It even came with a peep sight so I won't have to strain my ancient eyes too much.

 

[gearheart]

DROOL :bow: :bow:

 

[MikeChapin]

That is definitly a Seneca. It has far better than seen on most Senecas.

Beautiful rifle!

 

[BrownBear]

Set up to shoot those maxis, I'd say you have a dream gun for guys wanting to stretch their range with smallbores. Coyotes come immediately to mind.

Good score, and yeah. I'd hang onto it. It's really unique.

 

[shdwlkr]

thompson center says that the seneca came in these calibers and twists
SENECA
32 1:30 RH
36 1:48 RH
45 1:48 RH

CHEROKEE
32 1:30 RH
36 1:48 RH
45 1:48 RH
for those of you wondering what the twist was
I have two of each in the same calibers still looking for the variants.

 

[Oldnamvet]

Not having the stuff needed to start shooting yet, I just had to fiddle around with it. I pinned the ramrod and got around to measuring the twist. It came out to 1-30 so I can only scratch my head for now as to why the previous owner said it shot maxi's like a champ but not prb. Although he has quite a collection of black powder cartridge arms, this was his only front stuffer so I wonder if he didn't know exactly how to feed it? He also mentioned that he had thought about removing the breech to see if everything was OK there. Sure glad he didn't try that. The barrel is beautiful and I'd hate to have seen it marred by a pipe wrench. I'll know in a week or so when I get all the stuff I ordered for it as to whether it will shoot round ball accurately. Now I wonder if he was just shoving the balls down the barrel without a patch?? Naw. Nobody would do that would they??

 

[Zonie]

Folks on the forum often read about twists and shooting roundballs and that for roundball shooting the slow twists usually work best but when it comes to these small caliber guns they don't realize that a 1:48 twist is considered good, "slow" roundball twist for a .32 and .36 caliber barrel.

Although a 1:30 twist is fairly fast for a .32 cal roundball it shouldn't degrade the accuracy if a fairly tight ball/patch combination is used and the powder charge is kept within reason.

"Within reason" for a .32 caliber gun is in the 20-40 grain load range in my opinion.

 

[shdwlkr]

What I find interesting is that folks don't know the level of time TC put into what twist was in what caliber. With National Champion Chad Cleland, a T/C Pro Staff Advisor, being one of those who kind of steered the company on muzzle loaders and a champion shooter in his own right I have to think there was a reason for every twist in every caliber they sold.

 

[Oldnamvet]

It would be interesting to know just how they did decide. Was there a formula based on the likely projectiles to be used or did they go based on the historical rates of twist used? I have to think the original gunsmiths using rifling had made barrels with varying amounts and tested them. Or maybe they just put in a little rifling, whatever was convenient, and if it worked, it was good and all rifles of that caliber got that ROT from then on.

 

[Oldnamvet]

Despite 40 mph gusts today I got the little rifle out. Shooting PRB with 0.015 patch 1:5 ballistol/water lube with no wiping between shots.
5 shots using 15 grains of 3f went into a 2" group at 25 yds. Keeping everything the same but using only 10 grains the 5 shot group size dropped to 1". Rain was moving in so I moved on to the maxi bullets. 5 shots using 20 grains 3f went into one ragged hole about 3/4" in size. All this was at 25 yds. The rain started blowing in then so I called it good. I think with a little tighter patch, the round ball will shoot a little better as long as I don't decide to overload on powder. Shooting nice enough with only 10 grains makes for a lot cheaper shooting than with one of my bigger bores. All in all a fun little peashooter.

 

[ebiggs1]

It sure looks like a nice gun. I am also sure it is a fun gun.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Try using 12 grains of 3Fg powder with that PRB, and try increasing the thickness of the patch. Use cast pure lead bullets, not lead shot, or "swaged" balls( if you can find them anywhere). Accuracy often improves dramatically with these small bores with only a few grains more or less of powder. I believe that you need enough powder to upset the ball to fill the grooves Consistently in order to get uniform MV, and a lower SDV. Using a filler between the main charge, and the PRB also helps to reduce the SDV.

 

[BrownBear]

All in all a fun little peashooter.

That's the spirit. You're hooked now! :thumbsup:

Sounds like that little rig is ready to hunt now. But speaking of that, later in the year if you're wearing gloves or your fingers are cold, the cost of shooting is going to go waaaaay up as you spray those little balls around you in brush while trying to load it.

Think about a loading block for your cold weather hunts. You'll be REAL happy if you have one. They're fun to make, too.

 

[Oldnamvet]

I'm thinking about making a loading block for it. I have some for my 50 and 40. Also considering doing a cone job on it. I did that for my 50 GPR and it really made things easier when loading. No effect on precision/accuracy either as far as I could tell. But then with my eyes and open sights, I might not have noticed a small change. I don't hunt much anymore but do like to just get a license so I can have an excuse to wander out in the woods with a gun of some type just to see what I can find. Wife wonders if I am a poor shot or bad hunter since I don't often bring anything home.
Forgot to mention, I do put a .32 wad down on top of the powder before loading the prb or the maxi.