Sharpening Equipment?

[silly goose]

Ok, folks, I've been through the search function and I'm just looking for some good starting info. Yup, I'm another one that's going to build his first rifle. I've been studying and reading for the last couple years, no hands on. Starting to acquire some tools. Right now my first dilemma is for proper sharpening equipment. So tell me, what is adequate for getting the edge required on chisels. I see some folks online going as far as 12,000 grit. Is that necessary? I know tools cost, but I never expected to pay more for sharpening than what many tools would cost. Just looking for some advice on adequate sharpening equipment is all. Thanks in advance.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

Well,

Slip stones are the way to economically keep you chisels sharp.
Just google slip stones and you will get numerous hits, I bought and use Arkansas slip stones and am very pleased with the results.

Here is a link to Brownells slip stones.
Brownells

 

[BrownBear]

I'll say this- The finer the grit you use, the more the surfaces are polished and the less they drag on wood. Take two blades that are "equally" sharp, and the one with the higher polish is going to seem lots sharper. Dunno if it's fact or not, but the edges seem to last longer with the polish, too.

Though I bought it for knives, I get the most use out of this stone for tools. It's a water stone and pretty soft, so I use one of these to true up the stone now and then.

 

[Rick G.]

I second the use of slipstones. I recently tried the flexi-cut system from Woodcrafts and it works real well. Inexpensive, as well. Sharp tools really make a difference!

 

[Rifleman1776]

I have tried many ways to sharpen. Seems some have good features but also have drawback. A bench stone can't be beat but is slow. Currently I am using a 1" belt sander/grinder with 220 grit belt and it is doing a fine job and is fast. For my lathe tools I use a Wolverine jig and 120 grit white wheel and it does great.

 

[silly goose]

Hmmmm. Rifleman, you find the 220 and less grit to be adequate then? From my research that appears to be quite course and used to remove a lot of material quickly, but leave a rough edge. I'm not arguing, just asking.

You folks who use the slip stones, do you use them alone, or to get a final edge?

Brown Bear, so far that is what I have been leaning towards. I have a medium and fine arkansas stone on its way, it just seems from research that I will need something finer to get the kind of edge I'm looking for.

Am I starting to overthink things already? My only sharpening experience is with my knifes and I have used the lansky sharpening system with those, with ok, deer gutting/butchering performance. I'm thinking I have to do better than that for hard maple.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Rifleman, you find the 220 and less grit to be adequate then? From my research that appears to be quite course and used to remove a lot of material quickly, but leave a rough edge. I'm not arguing, just asking.

Actually, that is an excellent question. I get a smooth edge. My lathe tools get a great, and smooth, edge with 120 grit. I have a wet wheel (broken) with a 440 slow rpm that is considered ultra-fine. More polishes already sharp than sharpens dull edges.
However, with bench stones we all, myself included, seem to prefer much finer grits. The Arkansas black stones have to be around 2,000 grit (just guesstimating), some of the diamond stuff is near that.
Maybe it is the moving wheel or belt that makes the difference.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

You folks who use the slip stones, do you use them alone, or to get a final edge?

Thats all I use, unless I drop a tool and chip the cutting edge it should never need more than touched up at any given time.

I admit that when I buy tools I buy the best that fits my needs, don't like to buy the same tool twice.

EDIT----
Lathe tools are a different animal all together, it uses the rotation of the material to great advantage whereas carving or inletting chisels operates on another level, to cut cleanly they should have a polished cutting edge.

 

[BrownBear]

You folks who use the slip stones, do you use them alone, or to get a final edge?

Brown Bear, so far that is what I have been leaning towards. I have a medium and fine arkansas stone on its way, it just seems from research that I will need something finer to get the kind of edge I'm looking for.

I think it depends on the "history" of the edge. If it's sharp in the first place and you get back to sharpening sooner rather than later, it doesn't take a heck of a lot of metal removal to get the edge back in shape.

Things have to be horked way out of spec and require major metal removal before I go courser than 400 grit with water stones. When things get "dull" for my tastes, I hit them at 1000 grit, then drop down to 6000 grit for a polish.

 

[BrownBear]

You folks who use the slip stones, do you use them alone, or to get a final edge?

Brown Bear, so far that is what I have been leaning towards. I have a medium and fine arkansas stone on its way, it just seems from research that I will need something finer to get the kind of edge I'm looking for.

I think it depends on the "history" of the edge. If it's sharp in the first place and as it starts to dull you get back to sharpening sooner rather than later, it doesn't take a heck of a lot of metal removal to get the edge back in shape.

Things have to be horked way out of spec and require major metal removal before I go courser than 400 grit with water stones. When things get "dull" for my tastes, I hit them at 1000 grit, then drop down to 6000 grit for a polish.

 

[MSW]

for what it's worth, the finest i go to is a 8000 grit waterstone ... i use this for sharpening my straightrazor, which is then stropped on a leather strop ... i go to about a 2000 with wet/dry sandpaper on glass for my chisels (which are also stropped, unlike the razor i use jeweler's rouge when i strop the chisels).

in any case, your woodcutting tools need to be sharp enough to shave the hair off your forearm- so you already have a good handle on a truth which took me many years to learn.

good luck with your project!

 

[jdkerstetter]

I use oil and water stones too. If I were to start over I would invest in diamond and ceramic stones. No mess, no oil, no water and they sharpen very well.

I would still use strops and polish though. Stropping as I use the carving tools maintains the edge and I have to sharpen less frequently. Your tools will let you know when to do it once you get to know them.

There's a lot of information online on sharpening....so do some bing'ing or google'ing as the research has already been done for you.

Sharpening equipment can get expensive so invest smartly. As far as the expense of tools vs. sharpening equipment goes, your tools are only as good as your sharpening system, so don't go cheap and take the time to learn how to use it. Think about it like this, guys with $2000 rifles don't go with $200 scopes.

The very best advice I have for tool maintenance is to get some of those thick rubber mats for in front of your work bench. The good ones are pricey but will pay for themselves quickly in tools and parts saved.

Oh, and don't carve in flip-flops. :shake: Enjoy, J.D.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Lathe tools are a different animal all together, it uses the rotation of the material to great advantage whereas carving or inletting chisels operates on another level, to cut cleanly they should have a polished cutting edge.

I don't know what that is supposed to mean.
A dull lathe tool cuts just as lousy as any other cutting tool on wood.

 

[TinStar]

Isn't there a website called Scary Sharp; or something like that that can be Googled up?

TinStar
Soli Deo Gloria!

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

Lathe tools are a different animal all together, it uses the rotation of the material to great advantage whereas carving or inletting chisels operates on another level, to cut cleanly they should have a polished cutting edge.

I don't know what that is supposed to mean.
A dull lathe tool cuts just as lousy as any other cutting tool on wood.

The experience I have had working with a lathe as well as carving and inletting chisels for rifles has led me to the realization that a sharp lathe tool is not necessarily the same as a sharp carving or inletting tool.

At this point a long drawn out explination is not worth the effort, suffice to say that the speed of rotation of the material on a lathe has alot to do with the smoothness of the finished product.

 

[jdkerstetter]

That's a fact. For many lathe tools a grinder will suffice for sharpening. Entirely different animals. Enjoy, J.D.

 

[jerrywh]

I wasted a lot of money buying stones. They ware out -get gouged and fall off the bench and brake. Finally I bought a couple of diamond hones and have been usng them for about 15 years. They stay flat never wear out and don't brake. I have a 600 grit 2" x 8" and a 1200 2" x 8" and a tapered round. I gave all my stones away or threw them in the garbage can. Ebay has them.

 

[longshot47]

The 'Scary sharp' system relies on very fine, progressive grit silicon carbide sandpaper, secured [water or adhesive] to a piece of dead flat glass, tile etc. Works very well.
Diamond stones, which are a little pricey, are ultimately convenient and also very effective. Tho I have practically all of the options available, nearly 100% of my hand sharpening is now accomplished on diamond.

 

[MSW]

I use a variation of that method ... if you go to finewoodworking's website, there are a series of videos... i think you have to join or sign up for a trial (one of those free two week deals) ... ah ... reGoogled it... the membership fee is about $15 bucks a year if you get the magazine ... not too bad for a real wealth of woodworking info, much of which is applicable to gunbuilding and general tinkering ...

it's probably a pretty good deal.

just a thought...

 

[stronics]

After going the complete route with machines and diamond stones I now have two stones permanently mounted on a bench. One is about 220 and the other is a black Arkansas. Kerosene dabbed on the stones with an old paintbrush.
I also use a power buffer for the polish. I do a lot of woodwork and use chisels of all sorts and it is all I need. The lathe tools do not require the polish as much though and I will use a grinder to shape them.
It took me a lifetime to figure this out.
David