The Walker will take close to 60 grains. The ROA 45 easy. With round balls conicals might be a different story.
I can and do put 40 grains of 3F in a Colt45 case for use in my conversion cylinders.
Should the powder charge be equivalent to the caliber?
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I can and do put 40 grains of 3F in a Colt45 case for use in my conversion cylinders.
Khufu
40 Cal.
I shoot a CVA derringer made from a kit, I have shot it a lot. I used to carry it when I lived in Utah to circumvent the NO FIREARMS signs that popped up in a few places since Utah law considers muzzleloaders to not be firearms. I used 20 gr of 4f powder and a .440 rb. they are intended to basically inject the ball into the target as accuracy is somewhat less that ideal much over 10 yards and you are starting to get shaky on a target smaller than a dinner plate. I'm not sure it would be all that effective in a self defense situation, but it seemed better than just a knife.
Do it make a difference in what type of projectile is used, or do you go by weight as the startin' point of load workup? Seeing info on "Ball" sizes, assuming that means a patched round ball.
Starting point for rifles, half that for pistols.
Are you planning using this derringer for anything other than novelty plinking? In my 50 cal Kentucky pistol I only shoot 25 grains 3F in it for targets. In my Ruger old army I only use 20 grains 3F. That’s what is most accurate in both of them. I think whatever powder charge you use from 15 grains to 45 grains it’s just gonna be a noise maker and make smoke. Most likely won’t be shooting for groups past five to ten steps with a derringer. In my opinion anything over 20 grains of 3F in a derringer is just wasting powder.
doubleset
50 Cal.
Not sure I could get 36 grains in my 1851 navy without a lot of exertion. 
But I know that if I did, I'd definitely notice the recoil. 
But I know that if I did, I'd definitely notice the recoil. 
Truth or fiction? The answer will depend on application.
Here in the pistol and revolver forum, fiction.
In the rifle forum, this is a very imprecise load that there is a degree of truth in the method. I have used the pour the powder over the ball for loading my King's Musket and get pretty close to 90 grains with a wide tolerance. Nothing to use for a target load.
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No , that whole "match the charge to the caliber " is nonsense
My .69 Smoothbore uses 100 gr of 1f or 2f
My .54 Harper's Ferry pistol uses about a 30 gr charge of 3f
My .69 Smoothbore uses 100 gr of 1f or 2f
My .54 Harper's Ferry pistol uses about a 30 gr charge of 3f
36 grains in my .36 is too much, and 62 grains in my .62 is too mild.
so true! 15 grs, is adequate for it. 45 grains, hold on to it. way to much! not me. good advise!
I have some original powder dippers. I don’t know the history of them but they are alleged to be from late 1700s to mid 1800s. Most of mine are English or European. What is interesting is that about 3/4 of them have something in common. The “cup” will hold one ball from the intended arm. The crest of the ball is even with the top of the cup. The cup is just wide enough for the ball to slip in to the bottom and fall out if you turn the cup. This is similar to the concept in smooth bore loading where you use the same cup for powder and shot. The powder and shot are volumetricly equal. I have more dippers than corresponding rifles or revolvers, so I can’t try them all. For example, my .454 ball fits just right in the cup intended for a pistol that size. That dipper holds 28 grains of Goex Fffg. I have one that holds a .530 ball and 56 grains of Fffg. The one that holds a .626 ball hold about 74 grains FFg. This is more than a coincidence and tells me a lot about what charge was being used in Edwardian and Victorian days. I’m not sure if this is across the board from pistols/revolvers to rifles and smoothbores.
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Lots of good info here. I have a 4" 36 cal derringer. She takes 10 grains of 3Fg. Much less and the patched ball starts to interfere with the flashhole and I start to have missfires. (The flash hole is not quite at the very back of the breech).
But nobodies mentioned that unlike smokeless powder cartridge loading, a black powder gun is at best an imprecise exercise. A full grain hardly matters one way or the other in a smoke pole. Do that in metallic loading and bad things can happen.
doubleset
50 Cal.
Well, with the typical way of loading black powder, you don't even know what your weight difference is since you load explicitly by volume. So any talk about differences in grains is a bit goofy, and the whole "grain" value is at best approximate. With smokeless -- and even if you use volumetric methods to speed reloading -- you'd better be paying close attention to the precise weight of the charge you're throwing (and be checking the accuracy of your volumetric approach frequently). The black powder gun CAN be a precise exercise (and the bench rest guys and slug gun buys make it that), but for the average target or hunting shooter it's "Close enough is good enough" as long as you achieve uniformity.
Greenjoytj
54 Cal.
Black Powder doesn’t explode it burn at a very fast rate.
Black powder burn rate is controlled by the granulation size.
The granules burn on the surface into towards their center.
Finer granulations burn through faster because the granule is small. The flame front moves from one granule to the next quickly because the granules are very close to each other, even when their not compressed.
Compression improves the efficiency that the flame can travel to the next granule.
Large courser granulation takes longer to burn through to their center, this takes more time to burn completely so the total time until total conversion to gas is longer.
This is why course granulation powder makes more MV in a long rifle barrel, the slower start from lower start pressure but the longer burn time provides a longer push on the bullet as the flame converts more and more solid powder into gas ending in higher MV for the rifle.
2 volumes of powder of equal mass weight, one is fine the other is course, the total volume of gas produced when burnt will be the same for both powders. The fine powder will convert to gas reaching peak pressure first.
The course powder will reach the same peak pressure it will just take a little more time to get to peak pressure.
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Actually, black powder does explode, but with low pressure.
But nobody would mention it because it's not part of the topic.
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
The one grain of powder per caliber is an old rule of thumb as a starting point for rifles only.
If you put 45 grains of powder in your derringer it will not likely all burn within the confines of the barrel.
A full charge is 40gr in my ROA 45.
stephenprops1
45 Cal.
I restored a 45 caliber Dikar, Spanish percussion pistol a few years ago. I shoot 15 grains of FFF in it, with a 440 or 445 patched round ball. It still shoots a little high. I tried 20 grains and had significant recoil.
