sling swivels on Bess

[walter estabrook]

New to forum. Long time CW re-enactor,shooter, but novice on Besses. Recently got what seems to be old Jap.Bess in good shape at a price couldn`t resist.(yard sale!) There are no sling swivels & no hole in trigger guard bow or stock. Were any madew/out swivels? All pix I`ve seen have them. Think mine is long land pattern. Track of the wolf has - I can add ,if correct. Any other recommended sources?

 

[spudnut]

How much did you get it for? I want to hear a big sigh go out all over :haha:
It should have swivels,All besses do I think. I had a Japanese bess many years ago and I think i had to add the swivels.You might be able to get them through Dixie gun works still.

 

[nkvd]

Hello

DGW has parts for this model!


"you said jap" :rotf:

Rob

 

[Steve Blancard]

Many of them came without swivels, some did. Not sure why. Mine came from Dixie and did not have them. I added them. Had to carefully drill the triggerguard for the lower swivel. For the upper swivel, drive out the retaining pin and drill it for the swivel screw. The lug under the barrel is large enough to allow the pin hole to be opened up.

Unless you have an oddball model, they are of the short land pattern. Basically pattern 1762 with 1768 updates. These are very good quality muskets - consider yourself fortunate to get one at a good price.

 

[wallgunner]

It might have been a kit gun originally. I put one together years ago, and had to put the swivels on. I agree, they are Short Land Pattern copies. Good guns, and sounds like a great find.

 

[walter estabrook]

$300.00 @ yard sale-very nice cond, lock sparks! Also got Ind Bayonet. Saw earlier post re: parts for Jap. Besses;luckily best buddy is gunsmith & can make, if necessary.

 

[torn moc]

WOW! That's a Great Price !!! you done GOOD !
How about some pics?

 

[walter estabrook]

I`d have to get my daughter to post pix- don`t know how yet(embarrasing!) I did find 4/16/10 post by colmoultrie who got a miroku- mine is identical except has more patina( but then again so do I. some one treated it with "benign neglect", just enough to look good.I find I have a .710 mould-didn`t even know i had-damned if I can remember where it came from.Going to fire up the pot & make some.Thanks for info on swivels-ordering today. BTW, I appreciate the cordial welcome to forum. I`ve posted on others & have been almost ignored.Guess flinters are just more friendly. I`m sure you folks can answer another question. Soldiers were issued paper ctgs? Did they ram paper & all down bore so ball wouldn`t roll out? Did they use some of same powder to prime pan first or have finer stuff for pan? I`m used to nekkid minie balls which stayed in bore after ramming. Also, thres a pix of nice looking leather ctg box-who sells good ones? :wink:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Normally, the ends of the paper are torn or bitten off, some powder is poured into the pan, UNLESS, the TH is large enough to pass powder from the bore into the pan. If the latter, then the frizzen is closed, and all the powder is poured down the barrel. The paper is pushed into the muzzle, and followed by the ball or bullet, still wrapped in the paper. The paper becomes wadding between the powder and ball, while the paper around the ball or bullet helps to seal gases.

This was never intended to be a "perfect" system. Smoothbore muskets like the Brown Bess were not aimed, nor expected to have accuracy. They were fired by rows of soldiers standing shoulder to shoulder, facing enemy soldiers at about 50 yds. also standing shoulder to shoulder. The Bayonets on the guns were the primary "killing" machine of the gun, Not the ball or bullet. The shooters pointed their guns at the rows of enemy soldiers and fired in volleys with their fellow soldiers. Then they stood to take the enemy's similar fire.

Soldiers did not have dog tags, or name tags, and were not considered important enough to worry about taking care of them if they were wounded. Medical services were primitive at best. Surviving a battle wound was largely a matter of luck. Only officers, who were derived from the upper classes of people in a kingdom, were considered important enough to know their names, and families by the Generals. The rest were expendable, in the fullest meaning of the word. Volleys were usually followed with bayonet charges, and the field was "won" by the side that didn't lose courage when faced with several bayonets coming at them. The side that had the most men standing when the other side broke and ran was considered to have "won".

FYI, there are much better ways to load a Brown Bess if you are seeking to shoot the gun accurately out to 50 yds. If you use a hollow based " Minie" ball, you should get a sizing die that will size it to within .001-.002" of the bore diameter. Lube the bare ball, so that the grease will help hold the bullet in place on the powder charge. Such a "tight" fitting bullet will upset enough to seal gases behind it, and you will get much more consistent groups shooting it. :thumbsup:

 

[colmoultrie]

Hi - Yes, you did better than I did - about 1/2 the $$$

I still think I got a good deal, but yours is even better! :hatsoff:

I had mine out shooting a little over a week ago, and with a patched .715 ball over 70 gr. of FFg, I had all shots onto an 11"x11" target offhand at 25 yards. That's a "light" load, but it'll do as a start to punch paper. Your musket may like a lighter or heavier charge; try it and see.

The biggest problem with mine is the trigger pull, which is horrendus. Paul Vallandingham sent me some info on lightening the trigger pull, but I haven't had a chance to start yet. He is very knowledgable, as are many others on this forum, and generally friendly folks.

Occasionally some of the experts on here will disagree, and then they can fight out old arguments, and it sometimes feels like you're caught in the middle, but if that happens, sit back and learn, and very often there are things to be gathered from numerous people on all sides of the argument.

I got sling swivels, a 1st model buttplate, and a rounded sideplate from Ackermann arms. Unfortunately, neither the sideplate nor the buttplate will fit right for my musket's inletting without a good deal of filling and refitting, but that's hardly Ackermann's fault, as he simply furnished stock pieces without seeing the musket. The sling swivels look good, and perhaps I'll put them on tomorrow, if I get a chance.