Soft/dangerous Spanish barrels

[zodd]

Am new to muzzleloading, and because of the ridiculous gun laws in Australia am still awaiting on my "permit to acquire" to be processed and sent to me( has taken 8 weeks so far).When I receive it, I can then pick up the Traditions .50cal( that I have paid for previously)from a local gun dealer.Anyway was on another forum where they were talking about soft/ weak /dangerous Spanish barrels on certain makes of BP rifles (though I think it was predominately about inlines and loading with pyrodex pellets)Can anyone enlighten me about the validity or otherwise, of this, and does it apply to muzzleloaders and loose powder--best regards-zodd

 

[Pittsburghunter]

If you follow the loading instuctions that come with your rifle I would not worry about it at all.

A few years back an inline model had some defective barrels and some of them actually did split causing a few injuries. This was a CVA rifle before they were bought out by BPI. The rifles were recalled and replaced no other model was affected as far as I know but now we have the the iquisition of all imports by a couple of people who are mad that BPI won't bendover backwards for them.

As far as soft steel goes I see no proof of that as any testing of material and what not but some claim the fact the the barrels are extruded makes them week.

Good luck with your new rifle I am sure it will serve you well. My BPI products always have.

 

[RedFeather]

I agree. I may be wrong, but I think the Traditions guns are proofed by Spain. Never heard of a problem with their "traditional" muzzle loaders.

As to in-lines, it's hard to say if a gun is truly defective as there are those who feel that, if two 50 grain pellets are good, then four or five are even better. That's probably where the problems with the above mentioned gun were generated. I talked with a sales clerk who sold a CVA in-line to a customer and it was returned having "broken" using three pellets (150 grains). He gave him a second and told him to stick with two pellets. Guy came back with the second one broken and the clerk refused to deal with him. Said the problem was more with the shooter than the gun. Just use sommon sense in loading and you should be fine.

 

[strongarm]

Be aware of the difference in using loose powder versus using sticks of powder or pellets. READ YOUR OPERATOR INSTRUCTIONS CAREFULLY. Three pellets are not necessarily the same as 150 grains of loose powder in some guns. I have seen some guns will take THREE PELLETS OF 50 OR 120 GRAINS OF LOOSE POWDER MAX. An aquaintance severely damaged his in-line plug by shooting 150 grains of loose powder. CVA did have a recall about a year ago and I believe they have correctEed the problem. :winking:

 

[Desert Rat]

I have had a multitude of "Spanish Barreled" guns over the years from different manufacturers and found them to be good solid barrels (may of had to tinker with other parts, but the barrels were always ok). As long as you don't abuse it it will last many many years.

 

[Runner]

The soft barrel issue was started by Randy Wakeman as a way to discredit several brands of inlines in support of another brand. There never was a soft barrel issue at all. The government over there has a proof they require for a barrel to be sold as a black powder gun barrel. That proof is an old standard from roundball days. Wakeman took this low proof required by the government and tried to say that was the strength of the barrels. It never was anything but a governement requirement for sale.
None of the people involved in that scam ever produced any facts to support their deception. There was no hardness/temper/variety or any other kinds of tests. Wakeman took the government proof and started yelling that it was lower than the recommended loads that came with the guns. It is since it has absolutely nothing to do with the design, engineering, test results, or any other reality issue. In testing since, those supposed soft barrels have proven themselves to be stronger than barrels of the same wall thickness from a very popular manufacturer here in the US. Because of Wakeman's BS, Sports Authority got out of the muzzleloader sales and we lost another source.

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

Greetings!

I will also add that I have had literally dozens of these so called "cheap & soft metal" muzzleloaders over the past 30+ years. I have never had ANY problems related to barrel quality. I have ALWAYS limited my loads based on the owner's manual OR the manufacturer's recommendations. I will say that I do NOT shoot pelletized Pyrodex, but loose black powder.

I tend to stick with the old original traditional patched round ball loads and only black powder. If you do not try to exceed the capabilities or limitations of your specific muzzleloader--it should provide you with a lifetime of shooting enjoyment. (Probably will become part of your legacy by then.) I hope things keep moving along so that you get to enjoy your new rifle very soon.

Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[zodd]

Thanks for the info everyone.Am only interested in shooting in the traditional style ( and as with everything, follow manufacturer's recommendations), the inline thing escapes me ,but as they say horses for courses.I understand they were developed to extend your hunting season in the U.S ( or something like that).In Australia, dear in most places are classed as ferral and so can be hunted.I have 220 acres that have a conservation covernant with the National Parks and Wildlife service and I walk around blundering in to the buggers all the time.I suppose that the real safety warning that BP guns need is that, once fired they are highly[url] addictive.Again[/url] thanks for everyone's input, this is one very good forum-best regards zodd

 

[Swampman]

Original barrels were so soft the flats could be put on them with a draw knife. Soft is good. Hard shatters like a grenade.

 

[Pittsburghunter]

I was hoping no names were dropped but I see this kept a civil tone and the concensuse helped a fellow shooter wade through this mess.

I feel at least on this site we do not have to worry about that little spat giving the bp world a bad name.

 

[Dave_B]

Original barrels were so soft the flats could be put on them with a draw knife. Soft is good. Hard shatters like a grenade.

Makes sense to me. I have read about early gunsmiths hammering out a bulged barrel and using it again.
I have a Spanish barreled gun and I shoot RB. It wouldn't surprise me if the Spanish barrel is as strong or stronger than many of the old timer guns.
Dave

 

[Slake]

We have two 50 cals with barrels made in Spain and they are both fine shooting rifles. I love them both, have no problems at all with them and they are so accurate I amaze myself sometimes. They have always had round ball and powder so I can't attest to pellet problems or any of that. I say we meanin my son and I. If there was a problem with barrels made in Spain I wouldn't put it in my sons hands

 

[Brokenlaig]

As Swampman says, original barrels were usually made of Iron, not steel, and are considerably softer than the steel of today.

 

[rebel727]

Not to mention many of the older barrels were hand made by hammering a strip of metal or twisted wire around a mandrel. Damascus anyone?

 

[TANSTAAFL]

As Swampman says, original barrels were usually made of Iron, not steel, and are considerably softer than the steel of today.

You and Swampman are correct about the soft iron barrels of the era. But, so there is no confusion, there is a world of difference betwixt wrought iron and cast iron, with the wrought being very forgiving in hard usage.

I personally would not give a moment's worry about using Spanish barrels.

Douglas once got into problems using a harder steel for their ML barrels, some of them split wide open. With that said, I have used Douglas barrels and would so again.