soldering a breech plug question

[bpd303]

thats right..proof is in the pudding

Do you have any idea what proofing a barrel means? I can be reasonably assured that barrel would fail with a proof load.

 

[SDSmlf]

Would really like to hear your plan for proofing the breech plug and barrel welded assembly

thats right..proof is in the pudding

I like pudding, but still curious how you plan to proof this barrel, as any expert barrel maker such as yourself would do?

 

[hunter thompson]

quarter the thickness is absolutely not what you said above. You are going to do what you do regardless of advice here. If and when it blows up, if someone other than yourself is injured. You were warned and proceeded anyway. As I recall the criminal prosecutor need only prove wanton disregard of accepted safety standards..

ADVICE IS NOT tech.Theres no way this would not work,,having done closed pressured systems with higher pressures.

I like pudding, but still curious how you plan to proof this barrel, as any expert barrel maker such as yourself would do?

16 thousand pounds if it was a closed system before it ruptured...comon ,,were not talking nuclear

Do you have any idea what proofing a barrel means? I can be reasonably assured that barrel would fail with a proof load.

the barrels ive seen from track of the wolf are thin ..i have a damascus sxs thats b.p. it shoots fine..there was no proof..COMON WERE NOT TALKING NUCLEAR EXPLOSIONS..its a open system..16 t

There are many things we do to make a rifle similar to an original of one hundred fifty years and much older. We do not necessarily use hammer forged iron barrels, we use modern made steel barrels much cheaper, and stronger.
We have learned not to weld barrels, as this causes stresses to the steel at the place of welding.
If we wish to attach some piece to the side of the barrel ( like a sight, or a lug ) we silver solder.
There are well founded reasons for these actions, and we don't stray for safety and common sense.
You guys can tell me NOT to put my finger in a loaded rat trap, or look down a canon barrel that has the fuse lit...............and I take your word for it.
To argue with you is without doubt foolish.
I have made quite a number of muzzle loaders, flint and percussion, and always safety is the main concern of the making of these guns.
We never know who is going to shoot these guns in the future. We know they are rated for black powder or a synthetic black powder ( MAYBE !!!!??? )
Every year we hear and see where some idiot loaded up a muzzle loader, even with a mild load of smokeless powder and an unfortunate situation came to be.
Even though someone on the internet said it was safe to do so.
Well sir, weld up the breech plug and give it to your son or daughter, and let them shoot it. I hope all goes well.
Because that is what is going to happen sooner or later. Someone's son or daughter is going to shoot that bomb, people like you will have a bewildered look on their face, and say it should not have happened.
Take pictures, so we all can learn. BUT don't say you didn't know.

ELDS DONT BREAK IF DONE OPEN ROOT AND 100% penetration..the iranian mine the roberts crusier hit in the persion gulf not 1 weld broke.Done by confident capable welders
buts it ok to shoot crappy damascus barrels with b.p.?

 

[hunter thompson]

ADVICE IS NOT tech.Theres no way this would not work,,having done closed pressured systems with higher pressures.

16 thousand pounds if it was a closed system before it ruptured...comon ,,were not talking nuclear

the barrels ive seen from track of the wolf are thin ..i have a damascus sxs thats b.p. it shoots fine..there was no proof..COMON WERE NOT TALKING NUCLEAR EXPLOSIONS..its a open system..16 t

ELDS DONT BREAK IF DONE OPEN ROOT AND 100% penetration..the iranian mine the roberts crusier hit in the persion gulf not 1 weld broke.Done by confident capable welders
buts it ok to shoot crappy damascus barrels with b.p.?

the rusted out threads from 1800 english piece of junks ok..but a scedula 40 pipe 3/16 thick is dangerous..because its not half that thickness from a catalog company..lol

 

[Treestalker]

'The werewolf bit you, didn't it?'

 

[FishDFly]

Why continue to feed this?

As asked several times, how come this has not been locked?

 

[rich pierce]

Tell ya what: do it your way. Put in a touch hole. Load it with 200 grains of FFG and a round ball. Tie it to a 6x6 the other side of a fallen log about 3’ in diameter. Stick a firecracker fuse in it. Light that baby, jump over the log and run. Take a picture of your breech if you find it. Enough talk. You’re convinced you’re right. Now convince us with more than words.

 

[NorthFork]

I don't get this at all. We can all argue till the cows come home over the safety of 12L14 barrels vs 1137 vs 4130 vs 4140 vs 4150CMV, vs old Damascus vs 400 series stainless, but this is insane. Nothing mentioned by the OP passes muster in regards to KNOWN safety standards for firearm barrels.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

This has turned into my welding rod is longer than your welding rod....

 

[Grenadier1758]

The 2nd "Lyman Black Powder Handbook and Loading Manual" lists the pressure for a 12 gauge smoothbore using 96 grains of 2fg GOEX firing a 1 1/4 ounce load of shot as 4,300 psi. This is an impulse pressure indication. It is certainly not justification for @hunter thompson's welded up smoothbore pipe bomb.

by the way, rifle pressures in excess of 10,000 psi are also noted.

Maybe if he keeps his loading to Elephant brand powder as that load was recorded as 2,400 psi.

I too think this thread should be closed.

 

[Robby]

Y'all gonna sell tickets to the proof'n?

Robby

 

[NorthFork]

The 2nd "Lyman Black Powder Handbook and Loading Manual" lists the pressure for a 12 gauge smoothbore using 96 grains of 2fg GOEX firing a 1 1/4 ounce load of shot as 4,300 psi. This is an impulse pressure indication. It is certainly not justification for @hunter thompson's welded up smoothbore pipe bomb.

by the way, rifle pressures in excess of 10,000 psi are also noted.

Maybe if he keeps his loading to Elephant brand powder as that load was recorded as 2,400 psi.

I too think this thread should be closed.

Correct. Rifle (BP muzzleloader only) pressures under certain conditions can easily exceed 18,000 psi. Pyrodex pellets and heavy conicals can do this. This is also found in Lyman manuals.

Who cares what the pipe is rated for, how does one go about pressure testing that welded breech plug and assigning a safe rated pressure? Besides proof testing it and hoping that the proof test did not permanently weaken the homemade breech plug design so that it lets go on the 2nd or 317th shot?

 

[30coupe]

I think the OP is going to do what he wants despite conventional and sound practices. We're arguing with a possum at this point.

Sounds like a candidate for the Darwin Awards in the making. Obviously, he didn't come here for advice, but rather to enlighten us all.

 

[Zonie]

In the first post, hunter thompson entered this:

IAM building a smoothbore 3/4 schedual 40 stainless barrel and am putting a hooked breech plug into the the barrel,filling in the void with a bushing to take up the play that was tig-welded around the hooked breech threads.Now i was thinking to create a tighter fill in ..Would silver solder....not plumbers solder be strong enough?

.

He received answers from over a 95% of the respondents who said welding and silver soldering the breech plug was a bad idea with many explaining why.
Whether Mr. thompson accepts the advice is totally up to him. I hope everything goes well for him.

A few members have privately suggested that I should remove this entire thread and more than a few are asking me to close it.

I think Mr thompson has received our answers to his question and letting the thread stay open serves no purpose so, I'm going to close it.
I am not going to remove the thread though. Others, in the future, may have the same question and this thread will serve as a good source of information for them.