spout size
- Thread starter bubbub
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Purchase an adjustable measure. If you're going to keep on muzzleloading, it will come in handy.
You need a measure anyway and don't load straight form the powder flask into your gun. That turns it into a possible bomb in your hand.
rafterob
62 Cal.
Same potential risk. You still need a measure.
Are ya a CF cartridge guy, Or have some available? Here's some comparison's that might help.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/247958/
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It is a very rare thing to happen but still not worth the chance and it has happened where a smoldering ember sets off the flask and now no more hand or even no more life. Good luck and glad you decided to get back into shooting. I quit for awhile also but a friend a few years ago wanting to know how to get started and that got me back into it.
Billnpatti
Cannon
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Unlike a rifle, there is no problem in loading a revolver directly from a flask. But, you need to know how much powder your flask is delivering. The easiest way to do this is to buy an adjustable powder measure. Then set it to the maximum amount of powder it will hold. Fill your flask spout and pour it into the adjustable measure. Carefully move the adjustable stem of the measure up until the powder is level with the top of the measure. Then reads the amount of powder on the stem markings of the adjustable measure. If it is throwing too much powder, you can either replace the spout with a smaller one or use a file to dress down the spout until it is throwing the amount that you want.
Joel/Calgary
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Without meaning to sound snarky, if you have a powder (or jewelry) scale, just weigh it. It's the same grains avoirdupois as any other powder is measured in, we just take advantage of an approximately-consistent density for the various makes and granulations of black powder, which very close to that of water, by the way. The volumetric markings are seldom exact as there is some variation among the various powders and more variation in measuring techniques (as-poured, poured and struck off level, tapped to settle and topped up, or settled-&-topped and struck off), but with most measures, they're often close enough for most work, excepting for a portion of measures that turn out to be only vague approximations of the weight they're marked with.bubbub said:
Regards,
Joel
Using a scale can be a very dangerous practice if using Pyrodex or 777 unless you know how to compensate for their vast difference in weight versus black powder.
I'd stick to volumetric measures. On the other hand I have 2 different pistol powder measures - one a Traditions, the other a Pedersoli and there is a large difference in the measure of each.
I did weigh powder measures from each and determined that the Pedersoli was more accurate, and now that is the only one I use.
I'd stick to volumetric measures. On the other hand I have 2 different pistol powder measures - one a Traditions, the other a Pedersoli and there is a large difference in the measure of each.
I did weigh powder measures from each and determined that the Pedersoli was more accurate, and now that is the only one I use.
Patocazador
54 Cal.
Unlike everyone else on here, I weigh my real black powder charges that are thrown from the charging tubes. They do vary from 2F to 3F but I have a tube for each. I engrave on the tube what it actually throws and use the tube that is the closest to what I want.
If I surmise correctly, someone had to originally weigh black powder to get a volume reference to begin with, therefore, it is an actual weight reference when used with genuine black powder.
When used with substitutes all bets are off.
If I surmise correctly, someone had to originally weigh black powder to get a volume reference to begin with, therefore, it is an actual weight reference when used with genuine black powder.
When used with substitutes all bets are off.
The idea of pre-weighed charges intrigued me when I started cause I reload my smokeless brass.
On my Pyrodex can, I put the ratio of Volumetric grains to weighed grains, I think it was something like 42by weight = 50 by volume (don't quote me on that). I took 5 samples doing it by volume and found they could differ by as much as a grain. Shooting 100 yards with a grain off with a milsurp can make a big difference when doing precision shooting but not yet getting that kind of accuracy out of my muzzleloader. I'm thinking my other variables are affecting my accuracy way more than trying to get 1grain accuracy out of my powder load. Maybe one day it would matter, but not for me right now. I did try pre-measuring and putting into empty film cases but the extra volume of stuff to carry and time premeasuring on the scale did not seem worth it vs. powder flask to powder measure. Maybe I'm wrong but I"m a noob to this. Just wanted to try it.
On my Pyrodex can, I put the ratio of Volumetric grains to weighed grains, I think it was something like 42by weight = 50 by volume (don't quote me on that). I took 5 samples doing it by volume and found they could differ by as much as a grain. Shooting 100 yards with a grain off with a milsurp can make a big difference when doing precision shooting but not yet getting that kind of accuracy out of my muzzleloader. I'm thinking my other variables are affecting my accuracy way more than trying to get 1grain accuracy out of my powder load. Maybe one day it would matter, but not for me right now. I did try pre-measuring and putting into empty film cases but the extra volume of stuff to carry and time premeasuring on the scale did not seem worth it vs. powder flask to powder measure. Maybe I'm wrong but I"m a noob to this. Just wanted to try it.
Joel/Calgary
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There is no volumetric unit of grains avoirdupois - it is a unit of weight. We most often measure smokeless powder by volume, but we have to calibrate the measures for each powder because they differ significantly in density and drastically in burn rate and sensitivity to differences in charge weight. Black powder varieties differ much less in density from each other, and are much less sensitive to small differences in charge weight. B.P. substitutes are of different densities and, to some extent, burn characteristics but these are known (approximately - "15% less" than what specifically?), but one can calculate for the difference in density. Both for smokeless powders and for B.P and substitutes, volumetric measurement is sufficiently precise for many uses, or one may need to weigh charges for higher precision.
Different makers of B.P measures use different standards for calibration (usually a particular make and granulation, an average of certain varieties, or the density of water, and for some particular measuring technique - as-poured, poured and struck off level, tapped to settle and topped up, or settled-&-topped and struck off) but well-made measures (not all are) will all throw approximately the weight they are marked with of any variety of B.P. and measuring technique. How much a particular measurement differs from the indicated weight depends on both the differences in density of the particular powder (make, granulation, and lot) and in measurement technique from the makers calibration standard. For some shooters, a poured measure of any FFg is close enough, while for others, the difference in density and burn rate between different lots of a particular granulation from a specific maker may require different charge weights.
I'll go back to the original poster's question about what is the nominal capacity of his measure. Filling the flask with some variety of B.P. and filling he spout using his usual measuring technique, then weighing that charge will give a more reliable answer than comparing it to some other volumetric measure of unknown accuracy (may are good enough, some are not). Doing it with multiple varieties of B.P and averaging the results will give a more general answer.
Regards,
Joel
Different makers of B.P measures use different standards for calibration (usually a particular make and granulation, an average of certain varieties, or the density of water, and for some particular measuring technique - as-poured, poured and struck off level, tapped to settle and topped up, or settled-&-topped and struck off) but well-made measures (not all are) will all throw approximately the weight they are marked with of any variety of B.P. and measuring technique. How much a particular measurement differs from the indicated weight depends on both the differences in density of the particular powder (make, granulation, and lot) and in measurement technique from the makers calibration standard. For some shooters, a poured measure of any FFg is close enough, while for others, the difference in density and burn rate between different lots of a particular granulation from a specific maker may require different charge weights.
I'll go back to the original poster's question about what is the nominal capacity of his measure. Filling the flask with some variety of B.P. and filling he spout using his usual measuring technique, then weighing that charge will give a more reliable answer than comparing it to some other volumetric measure of unknown accuracy (may are good enough, some are not). Doing it with multiple varieties of B.P and averaging the results will give a more general answer.
Regards,
Joel
Usually the weight thrown by a volumetric powder measure is pretty close to what it's supposed to be if real black powder is being poured.
If Pyrodex is being poured it will weigh about 30 percent less than the volumetric powder measure says it will throw.
This isn't entirely bad. In fact, it can be considered good (if you like Pyrodex) because the shooter gets about 30 percent more shots per pound.
Because Pyrodex was made to be measured by volume (not by actual weight), a powder measure that throws 70 grains of black powder will measure out enough Pyrodex by volume, to give close to the same amount of power that the black powder would give.
Likewise, a powder measure that is set up to throw a 100 grain black powder load will throw the same volume of Pyrodex which will give close to 100 grains of black powders power but it will only actually weigh about 70 grains.
If someone is going to go strictly by the actual weight and measures out 100 actual grains (weight) of Pyrodex, that pile of powder will have the volume and power of a 130 grain black powder load.
If Pyrodex is being poured it will weigh about 30 percent less than the volumetric powder measure says it will throw.
This isn't entirely bad. In fact, it can be considered good (if you like Pyrodex) because the shooter gets about 30 percent more shots per pound.
Because Pyrodex was made to be measured by volume (not by actual weight), a powder measure that throws 70 grains of black powder will measure out enough Pyrodex by volume, to give close to the same amount of power that the black powder would give.
Likewise, a powder measure that is set up to throw a 100 grain black powder load will throw the same volume of Pyrodex which will give close to 100 grains of black powders power but it will only actually weigh about 70 grains.
If someone is going to go strictly by the actual weight and measures out 100 actual grains (weight) of Pyrodex, that pile of powder will have the volume and power of a 130 grain black powder load.
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