Spru possition

[nick_1]

This is completely un scientific. yesterday when loading my 1858 I placed the sprue up against the side of the cylinder wall so that it would shear off while seating. I had the best shooting session ever with that pistol hitting my steel at the same distances as my le page. of course it also may have had something to do with me shooting some paper first to get a handle on where I had been missing .... I do know that shooting well is largely mental so from now on that's how I will be positioning my sprue

 

[M. De Land]

This is completely un scientific. yesterday when loading my 1858 I placed the sprue up against the side of the cylinder wall so that it would shear off while seating. I had the best shooting session ever with that pistol hitting my steel at the same distances as my le page. of course it also may have had something to do with me shooting some paper first to get a handle on where I had been missing .... I do know that shooting well is largely mental so from now on that's how I will be positioning my sprue

Neat idea I have never considered before. One thing to keep in mind is that almost always any void found in a ball or bullet will be under the sprue so if it is present and orientated to the side than it would be in the worst possible position for unbalancing the projectile while in flight.
If unbalanced it will show up progressively as the target distance increases.

 

[Trot]

This is completely un scientific. yesterday when loading my 1858 I placed the sprue up against the side of the cylinder wall so that it would shear off while seating. I had the best shooting session ever with that pistol hitting my steel at the same distances as my le page. of course it also may have had something to do with me shooting some paper first to get a handle on where I had been missing .... I do know that shooting well is largely mental so from now on that's how I will be positioning my sprue

Thank you for this, I suggested it once and was ridiculed. https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/sprue-up-or-down.171879/page-3

 

[wiscoaster]

Not unscientific at all. If you position the sprue where it meets max air resistance (on the side, not directly fore or aft) the profile assymetry unbalances the aerodynamic pressures and causes the ball to become unstable in flight. Definitely is going to adversely affect your consistency of point-of-impact.

 

[nick_1]

The sprue gets sliced right off when I seat the ball. I watch it happen. . the unscientific part of my post is that I did this and my accuracy improved dramatically. there is no real proven fact here because I was shooting off hand and changing my sight picture as well. Keeping in mind that shooting is largely a mental game I will keep doing it this way untill my accuracy suffers. when that happens I will try something else Hitting a 5 inch steel plate at 25yrds and a 6 inch plate at 35yrds off hand with a cap and ball seems reasonable to me. Slightly better than the human silhouette at 7 yards that many of you seem to consider adequate for a hand gun.

 

[nick_1]

My thought is that if there is an air bubble under the sprue the act of swageing into the cylinder will hopefully crush and fill that void. trying to center the sprue is pointless as it won't ever be perfectly centered doing it by eye. Slicing the sprue off with the edge of the cylinder however is very repeatable because if you are loading on the bench as I do you can easily let that sprue rest on the sharp edge of the cylinder.

 

[Oldbear63]

Just to interject something very confusing into this discussion, have you seen this video on rotating objects?

The rotation of a lead ball with the asymmetry of a sprue might be much more complex than we realize!

 

[Rudyard]

Probable voids at sprue .If its up you can see its up So logicaly its the better placement . But logic dosn't always apply If your method works for you. why fix it.
Rudyard's notion

 

[M. De Land]

My thought is that if there is an air bubble under the sprue the act of swageing into the cylinder will hopefully crush and fill that void. trying to center the sprue is pointless as it won't ever be perfectly centered doing it by eye. Slicing the sprue off with the edge of the cylinder however is very repeatable because if you are loading on the bench as I do you can easily let that sprue rest on the sharp edge of the cylinder.

Another thing to keep in mind is the ball we seat is no longer a sphere when it emerges from the muzzle. It is a short cylinder with two slightly different shaped hemisphere ends. Any void off axis of rotation is going to destabilize it.
Off hand shooting accuracy advancement could very well be a good day when ones wibbles are compensating for ones wobbles.

 

[nick_1]

absolutly it was probobly just a gud day. However I still think sliceing the sprue off is marginaly a better idea than trying to place it in the center of the top of the cylinder which is pretty much impossible to do by hand.

 

[M. De Land]

absolutly it was probobly just a gud day. However I still think sliceing the sprue off is marginaly a better idea than trying to place it in the center of the top of the cylinder which is pretty much impossible to do by hand.

I too have had that same fear of imbalanced patched balls by not getting the sprue perfectly centered and so always strive for it.
The Bevel Brothers of Muzzle Blast Maqazine fame did a test of swaged balls as opposed to sprue centered and sprue base seating if I remember correctly and I think I remember them finding they could demonstrate very little difference in accuracy.
I know I cannot show any accuracy difference between swaged balls from Hornady or Speer and my own Lee, mold cast balls.
I have not tested weighed balls though that would reveal voids but even then under the sprue voids would most likely stay on axis rotation but possibly show some elevation variance at distance.
My guess is the short ranges most of our competitions are shot at may be hard pressed to reveal inaccuracy.

 

[nick_1]

I shot two cylinders through the 1858 after work yesterday. I hit 25yrd 5" steel and 35yrd 6" steel. I am sticking with my new sideways sheared off sprue position. It's the magic elixir

 

[smoothshooter]

This is completely un scientific. yesterday when loading my 1858 I placed the sprue up against the side of the cylinder wall so that it would shear off while seating. I had the best shooting session ever with that pistol hitting my steel at the same distances as my le page. of course it also may have had something to do with me shooting some paper first to get a handle on where I had been missing .... I do know that shooting well is largely mental so from now on that's how I will be positioning my sprue

I do not pay any attention to sprue location in revolvers. Most of my molds are the Lee brand which do not leave a protrusion where the lead is poured in. I also tumble them before use to make them more uniform.
Do not worry too much about surface irregularities when loading the chambers. The loading process mangles the ball to some extent anyway.
My guns are very accurate when I do my part using my methods.
I do not worry about sprue location with rifles either, and get great results.

 

[nick_1]

yes but this careful location of the sprue is my rabbits foot without which I would surely miss that critical shot

 

[Codger Craig Wilcox]

Just to interject something very confusing into this discussion, have you seen this video on rotating objects?

The rotation of a lead ball with the asymmetry of a sprue might be much more complex than we realize!

Fantastic video, and an excellent aid that assists in one's desire to take a nap! Almost guaranteed to induce sleep, and it's non-habit forming and non-addictive.

 

[CaptainVane]

The great thing about a spru is you can always blame it for inaccurate shooting.
“Shot was dead on but that dam spru caused a bad spin”.
Can also be blamed for that record fish that got away.

 

[Bad Karma]

The great thing about a spru is you can always blame it for inaccurate shooting.
“Shot was dead on but that dam spru caused a bad spin”.
Can also be blamed for that record fish that got away.

I cast jig heads and this is true. Surprising how many lunkers have gotten away when the sprue on the jig catches on something at precisely the wrong time…

 

[Smokerr]

Just to interject something very confusing into this discussion, have you seen this video on rotating objects?

Now that I have never seen before. Fascinating.

I don't think it applies to shooting in its more a one induced motion (spin) and the bullet mfgs have made a science of that. No disagreement it makes one wonder. Bullets can and do tumble though that affect was normally a consequence of a design factor that hits a trip point.

Its worth a note that our balls indeed are formed into a cylinder and what the factors are that then affect it as the cylinder is narrow in the middle and it had sounded ends.

 

[Smokerr]

I do know that shooting well is largely mental so from now on that's how I will be positioning my sprue

No disagreement confidence in what you are doing pushes to a successful outcome.

 

[M. De Land]

No disagreement confidence in what you are doing pushes to a successful outcome.

After all these years of competing I still can't seem to nail down why I can drive tacks in some matches and go ho-hum in others. Can't blame it on old age as it's been a persistent occurrence over the last 50 years. I've looked at position posture , breath control, trigger control, diet, sleep, positive attitude ,concentration and even foot wear, still no consistent cause and effect I can isolate.