Stuck

[Clark Badgett]

If you are looking for historically correct jags try an iron worm with tow wrapped around it for cleaning.
Or you can tie a length of hemp cordage around some wet tow and push it down the barrel with your wiping stick, then pull it back out and repeat.
Either was used in lieu of jags for cleaning.

THIS IS THE WAY.

 

[Mad L]

I have a .62 cal smoothbore, and every time I clean it, EVERY TIME, I end up with patch and jag stuck! Can anyone one tell me why? I do not have this issue with any of my rifles.

Thanks

I used to have patches pull off in my Smoothbore but never had it grab the jag?
I switched to a One Size Smaller jag then the barrel (sea Musket and a pistol) and the I cut my own Cotton Flannel patches (buy it by the yard, cheaper then store bought) and I use a Button Jag and cut the patch Large so it bunches up pulling it back out - I haven't had any more problems.

However, I run first run a couple patches, Then I run a wad of tow on a worm, Then pull it all out with the patches. Usually takes me about 6 or 7 patches and the tow gets washed out and dried to be reused, one or two more patches for the final oil wipe and DONE.

Now I haven't seen if you answered if you have a Vent Liner or not?
My Smoothbores do not but my rules do: with a vent liner i always pull it. Clean the threads, use the extra large hole to scrub the breach with Q-Tips.
Always GREASE the liner before replacing, use Only fingers screwing back in (no drivers or electric 'thread strippers) and do not over tighten; torque Not Required.

Switching to Cotton Flannel and custom cutting my sizes has saved me a lot of money, I use less patches because they clean and absorb better and I stopped losing patches. Using a one size smaller jag and tossing my brass brush out I don't get things stuck anymore either...if I feel I need more 'contact' then I just run that tow down and maybe run a double thick (two stached) Cotton Flannel patch.

 

[TCMonts]

I may have missed something because after two pages I just had to skip to the end. Personally I have never used a jag in a smooth bore. Just an aproprietlly sized mop and warm soapy water, never had a problem with that. You may have other issues that you need to look in to but stuck jags and broken ramrod should not be on the list.

 

[Davey Boy]

I made several attempts making a jag for the heptagon bore 40 caliber rifle I cleaned up from being a closet queen for decades

I did not have any success with the necessary jag steps or the minimum to maximum range of diameters, I used a hollow glass tube so I could see what was happening

I have a 50 Cal rifle I have stripped down and plan to use it a lot at the range and I stuck the jag in it so bad (twice) I had to shoot it out

The bore is pitted and I have no problem with that right now

But there has got to be a better way

I like mops but they are throw away and that goes against my grain

I plan to try a bore mop for rifle with replaceable cloth (think fender washer, large diameter small hole), the cloth could be cut out and pieced through center. Stacked on a threaded screw making a stack. Could even make an end piece from felt or fabric countersunk for the screw head the face of which would clean the breech face area

Make up several for cleaning wet and some for dry. When they are used up, remove the stack and install another. Would I think, be awesome for grit or polishing the bore

Opinions?

 

[Kansas Jake]

I use a slightly undersized brass bore brush with a cleaning patch. Easy to find and use.

 

[Davey Boy]

I am still messing with a 50 Cal with rifling and this morning I had success with using 3 different types of cloth.

I was going to turn a ball instead of the typical jag shape but I had a brass jag to try first so I turned a shape like a bullet instead of a ball

I tied the cloth in place using Kevlar 0.015" thread in the narrow section just behind the bullet at the taper

It holds up to pretty aggressive drag and I think it may be worth a try to use this method with polishing compound

 

[wiscoaster]

I think your idea should work great for polishing by stroking, but if you want to polish by rotation I think it's just going to slip, isn't it? Please update us on how it works out for you.

 

[Flintandsteel]

Ok gang. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel.
These jags, patches, etc have been used with little trouble for at least the last 150 years.
Been doing this myself for the last 50 years. Never turned down a jag, never got a patch stuck. Can’t imagine our forefathers had these issues either.
Sounds to me like hard dry fouling. First pass, very wet patch, or water rinse first, then mop it out. Should be VERY little resistance.
If it’s getting stuck now, then go look for something that snags the patch.
P.S. those patches are way too dry.

 

[wiscoaster]

Ok gang. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel.
These jags, patches, etc have been used with little trouble for at least the last 150 years.
.....

I took him to mean for polishing, not for cleaning. When it comes to polishing using Scotchbrite jags don't work too well. You have to use an undersized jag and then you risk losing your piece of Scotchbrite in the bore. Plus you don't get down into the grooves quite as well. I've been using a piece of Scotchbrite stuck in a patch holder. But that has to be a pretty small piece, so I'm open to other ideas for polishing with Scotchbrite. I'll bet the turned-down jag idea above would accomodate a bigger piece and be secured in place to boot.

 

[flconch53]

These have, on occasion, given me problems.
View attachment 276608

These have worked for me, although I don't think they are HC.
View attachment 276609

If you are going pre 1840 neither are HC. Use what works

 

[waksupi]

Ok gang. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel.
These jags, patches, etc have been used with little trouble for at least the last 150 years.
Been doing this myself for the last 50 years. Never turned down a jag, never got a patch stuck. Can’t imagine our forefathers had these issues either.
Sounds to me like hard dry fouling. First pass, very wet patch, or water rinse first, then mop it out. Should be VERY little resistance.
If it’s getting stuck now, then go look for something that snags the patch.
P.S. those patches are way too dry.

I have found I have needed to turn jags for custom barrels, as they tend to be tighter than commercially made barrels.

 

[Ditt44]

To run Scotch Brite, I use wire brushes typically for cartridge rifles from .17 up to .30, depending on the ML caliber. The pad will compress a bit as will the brush depending on the brush make-up...brass vs steel and design, spikes or coiled/screw-like. Sizes generally run:
.17 for .32
.22 for .36
.27 for .45
.30 for .50

I cut the pad as long as the brush and as wide as to fully/near-as-possible wrap the brush. The wire holds on to the pad very well and it is super easy to clean or polish with it. You can stroke or twist without worry of loosing the pad depending on what rod you are using.

 

[wiscoaster]

To run Scotch Brite, I use wire brushes typically for cartridge rifles from .17 up to .30, depending on the ML caliber. The pad will compress a bit as will the brush depending on the brush make-up...brass vs steel and design, spikes or coiled/screw-like. Sizes generally run:
.17 for .32
.22 for .36
.27 for .45
.30 for .50

I cut the pad as long as the brush and as wide as to fully/near-as-possible wrap the brush. The wire holds on to the pad very well and it is super easy to clean or polish with it. You can stroke or twist without worry of loosing the pad depending on what rod you are using.

GREAT idea!! That's how I'm going to do it next time.

 

[Davey Boy]

Ok gang. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel.
These jags, patches, etc have been used with little trouble for at least the last 150 years.
Been doing this myself for the last 50 years. Never turned down a jag, never got a patch stuck. Can’t imagine our forefathers had these issues either.
Sounds to me like hard dry fouling. First pass, very wet patch, or water rinse first, then mop it out. Should be VERY little resistance.
If it’s getting stuck now, then go look for something that snags the patch.
P.S. those patches are way too dry.

Flintandsteel ,

I think you have identified the root cause.

I completely agree that the jag method that holds the patch has worked very well historically

This barrel has had a lot of neglect.

I didn't want to pull the barrel plug as I do not have a tool to do so (but I can make one if it comes to that)

This morning I have been using pillow ticking soaked in Ballistol

I got out some fine grit and added to wet patches and swabbed repeatedly changing patches as they wore down

Now I am using pillow ticking and Ballistol to see if the patches will begin to come clean

It's certainly easier to put a patch in, swab, remove (wet patch)

I had to take a break as it is still pretty humid, and I have the shop door open for maneuvering room

I couldn't bear to do this without a range rod with barrel bushing

 

[TCMonts]

JMO trow away the jag and get a few 20g bore mops.

 

[Davey Boy]

I finished cleaning and the bore is pretty rough

I still want to see how it performs at the range

That should be soon

 

[skwerleater]

Chuck that jag in a drill and sand several thousandths off. It will work better

 

[flconch53]

Chuck that jag in a drill and sand several thousandths off. It will work better

You would be surprised (but maybe after this t h read not) how many newbies think the jags I make are too small. I have them bring their gun over if possible and run a patch down the barrel.

 

[Rob M.]

Lots of good advice and suggestions on here ...Ive had Jags get stuck many times ...few different reasons . That real short jag pictured here a few times , what a pain ! LOL ... I have it in the shop on my shop/ range " cleaning rod " ....its handle sticks out a foot from.my muzzle , I made that hickory rod plenty long for any stuck.problems !! I like the jags that are extended , the longer the better , and keep one in the shootin bag , so I have lots of hickory to hold onto in the field or at the range ifn I get any tight loads or anything stuck . Ive had a couple jags ive had to put up against the fine grinding wheel and turn it against the spinning grinding wheel ... Fixed them right up ....but dont go too far . It dont take much . Ive had some bad ones ive had to take to my shop , unbreech the barrel and beat that jag out ! No fun . Sometimes ...the end of the ramrod in a vice and jerk the gun away from the vice , LOL .
. No fun but got er done .... Jags can be a pain but once you get her fitted to the gun or just happen to find one that works with that gun ...your good to go ....usually , LOL ...sometimes a change in.material can cause a fuss ! Ive had the patch kinda double up or some such , and it would just keep gettin stuck when your tryin to pull it out , then ya gotta push it back down , it foes down easy enough , then you try and pull out ....and it catches again ! Sometimes further up , sometimes its further down ! LOL ...what a pain . I really like polishing the bore of my trade guns . Helps a lot . Helps the cleaning process and the loading process . Much smoother and quicker .When I'm.polishing them its in the shop and I just use an overly long hickory rod with one end split to put the steel wool in ...then use a drill .... Works good ....

 

[SDSmlf]

I am still messing with a 50 Cal with rifling and this morning I had success with using 3 different types of cloth.

I was going to turn a ball instead of the typical jag shape but I had a brass jag to try first so I turned a shape like a bullet instead of a ball

I tied the cloth in place using Kevlar 0.015" thread in the narrow section just behind the bullet at the taper

It holds up to pretty aggressive drag and I think it may be worth a try to use this method with polishing compound

You may want to consider not turning the entire jag out of a single piece of brass. Learned a long time ago that a brass threaded extension is waiting to break off and create an entirely new challenge. Thread a hole in that brass jag (instead of a threaded extension) and use a steel threaded insert. I’ve found a set screw staked in place along with a bit of Loctite if you want works well. A small box of 100 set screws will not cost you much compared to the grief when that brass threaded extension breaks off at the most inopportune time.