swamped barrels, What purpose did they serve

[howdydoit]

So, a swamped barrel has been thrown around the forum lately and im just wandering what was the purpose in the 18th century?

Where all rifles made with a swamped barrel or were there some straight barrels aswell?

It seems to me the swamped would have been very hard to make as apposssed to a straight, since the barrels were hammer forged and welded.

Just wondering.

Howdy

 

[tg]

Generaly speaking barrels were swampd before 1800 and likley taperedof very slightlyswampde ater wards, the swamped barrel balanced the long barrels very well, I had a c weight early lancaster in .50 cal and it was a dream to out to shouler and follow with an easy sight picture same thing goes for smoothbores the tapering from tang to transition ring offeres a nice handling gun, I have heard folks at 'Vous shoot a 42" straight barrel of a smallish bore it has heavy straight barrel and they were quite uunpleased with the handleing, heavy barrels can be good for hold on targets if they are not to heavy and out of balance, that's about all I got, others will chime in soon, the halfstock like the Hawken Bros were likely tappered to remove weightfrom the buisness end of the gun, todays builders with small crews usually offer the straight barrels and standard lock choice amoung other items, it is up to the buyer to research and press the vendor into offering the correct parts to make a correct gun.

 

[J.D.]

Tg is right on. Swamped barrels reduce wieght forward, making a gun hold and balance much, much better than a straight barrel of the same bore dia., length, and flat-to-flat diameter, at the breech.

A friend has a rifle made by a local maker that is actually pretty well done. However, it has a straight 44 inch, 45 cal barrel that takes a healthy man to shoot off hand. That same gun, with a swamped barrel, would be a joy to hold and shoot, off hand.

 

[blacksmithman64]

I'm not a gunbuilder but I have read in numerous places that all barrels were swamped till about 1800. tg is right about handling, since I got my C weight colerain .50 42" barrel, my T/C's just sit gathering dust. Hey for a lousy $100 extra go with a swamped barrel, you won't regret it!

 

[Swampman]

Non-Swamped barrels are usually machine made. Nearly all handmade barrels were swamped even in the 19th c. Most Hawken barrels were tapered from breech to muzzle.

 

[MikeC]

Swamped barrels IMHO make for a more pleasant rifle to walk around the woods with hunting, that being said I believe a properly balanced rifle with a straight barrel makes for a more stable rifle to shoot offhand due to the extra weight up front.

 

[MSW]

what the Wolf said... you'll really appreciate the feel of a swamped barrel. The balance point of a swamped barrel is way toward the breech, whereas the balance point of a straight barrel is (of course) the center of the length. When you move the BP back, it gives the whole rifle a wonderful feel to it. Once you've used a swamped barrel, you will most likely be spoiled and not want to shoot anything else.

Worth the extra money? You bet!! (just one guy's opinion.)

 

[dodgecity]

IMHO the swamped barrel gives the classic elegance of lines and handling and balance characteristics of the early long rifle. I have both straight and swamped barrel rifles, but any future purchases will be of the swamped variety.

 

[Coot]

As mentioned by previous posters, a long swamped barrel has a better balance than a straight barrel.

Straight or tapered barrels are easier to make by machine but if working by hand, the barrel is generally finished by filing. Just as in hand sanding a board, a slight curve is easier to make than a straight line. The normal tendency is to bear down harder at mid stroke (when the surface being worked is directly beneath you and it is easy to use body weight to increase pressure (intentionally or otherwise :wink: )) and lighten up at the ends. Thus in a hand made rifle barrel, you get the benefit of both better balance for the user and easier production for the maker.

 

[bingo1952]

DITTO. You beat me to it. I was going to offer pretty much the same observation.

 

[Swampman]

The swamp is hammered in.

 

[bingo1952]

The same thing holds true for forging as well as filing. Straight are much harder to obtain than curved without the use of machine tools. It can be done but is much more labor intensive.

 

[nw_hunter]

I agree! I can shoot off hand better with a heavy barrel.

At the end of a long session, the lighter swamped barrel might be welcomed. :grin:

 

[billd]

Todays barrels are all made from round stock. The flats are milled after the hole is drilled. By using the hole between centers you are assured of the hole being in the middle of the barrel at both ends. Remember Douglas barrels and the runout they had? They were made from octogon stock.


Any profile can be milled, swamped, tapered or straight. Some use a tracer attachment on milling machines, some have CNC equipment that rotates the barrel and mills any contour you program into it.

I was in Getz's shop several years ago and he had a tracer. Regardless of how it's drilled and milled, they all then go thru a straightening process.

As far as I know, no one uses the hammer forge method for muzzleloader barrels. I'm sure some blacksmith out there is making them, but I couldn't afford one.

For my money, if it's a full stock, use a swamped barrel. A half stock, tapered. Straight are too heavy unless is a short gun.

 

[roundball]

Noticed a thread where someone is building a straight, 1" x 42" x .32cal rifle...seems like that would be extremely heavy

 

[Zonie]

It's just my opinion but a Swamped barrel provides the strength where it is needed and saves material where it is not needed.

Iron wasn't cheap in the early days so a gunsmith wanted to use as little as possible when making a barrel.

The breech area must be thick to withstand the high pressures in that area and the muzzle needed to be thick to provide the strength to withstand the pressures at the muzzle.

In the central part of the barrel, the bore is strengthened on either side of any given point by the material adjacent to it. That is to say if the ball is 20 inches down the bore from the breech the iron ahead of and behind the ball all work together to withstand the internal pressure.

This is not the case at the muzzle.
There is no material forward of the muzzle so that area must withstand the pressures by itself.
A thicker wall in this area will serve this purpose quite well.
This, I believe explains why the swamped barrels originally had the flair at the muzzle.

Another related reason for the flared muzzle is the process of making the barrel.
As we know, these were forge welded along their lengths and it was (is) common with this method to heat the barrels muzzle to a welding heat and to forcefully drive the muzzle into the anvil there by "upsetting" or compressing this material and improving on the weld in this area.

Did the gunbuilders of those days know about engineering principles? Doubtful but, they came from a long line of craftsman who passed down "lessons learned" to the younger apprentices.
I'm sure that after having some non-flared barrels muzzles rupture they learned that some extra strength was needed in that area.

 

[Many Klatch]

Swamped barrels take off weight. A tapered barrel would take off more weight but the front sight would be 2 inches tall. The barrels were flared back out at the muzzle so the sights could be a reasonable size.

Many Klatch

 

[tg]

I saw one like that at a 'vous a few years back, it was a pain just to hold ituo for a quick "how do it fit" trial, after hefting the "lost its way" chunk gun I saw why they had a very low price on it, it was a southern Mt style nice and trim and sleek with a railroad iron running down the middle of it this one had a 1" barrel,it would have been a good deal to buy the gun and put a different barrel in it.I almost did but was working on another gun deal at the time.

 

[Protrucker]

Noticed a thread where someone is building a straight, 1" x 42" x .32cal rifle...seems like that would be extremely heavy

I would think that that one would be strictly for target use as a bench gun......or maybe it is for the governor of California! :haha:

 

[ryoung14]

Long swamped barrel vs. shorter straight barrel. If the straight barrel was short enough to put the balance point at the same location, would there be a difference in handling?