Swiss 1.5 in smoothbore loads

[paulvallandigham]

Sorry for the confusion. I took this information off this website about Swiss powders. At the bottom of the page you will find a comparison table that indicates granule size for Swiss vs. Goex, and the relative size for both. It clearly shows the numbering systems are opposites. :idunno: :surrender: :thumbsup:

http://blackpowder.ch/powder/shooting-powder

 

[Keb]

Keb, are you talking about Swiss in general or just the 1 1/2 Fg.?
Swiss is, IMHO, great powder.
My post was about the 1 1/2 Fg., not necessarily Swiss.

I was talking about Swiss 1 1/2f.Them boys use a lot of powder to get them .45s to hit at 1000 yds.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Sorry for the confusion. I took this information off this website about Swiss powders. At the bottom of the page you will find a comparison table that indicates granule size for Swiss vs. Goex, and the relative size for both. It clearly shows the numbering systems are opposites. :idunno: :surrender: :thumbsup:

http://blackpowder.ch/powder/shooting-powder

OooooKay....they do give both.
So, wat were ye talking about???????
Nebber mind for now, my muddled brain can't take any more of this for today. Wars the jug?

 

[Mike Brooks]

Swiss 3F is closer to American 2F, and Swiss 1 1/2 powder is finer than American 3Fg powder. Its actually between 3Fg and 4F powder in size.

Uh-Oh! :shocked2: We disagree on something. Must be your evil twin who posted that. :wink:
The can of Swiss 1 1/2 Fg. that I have has granules that are quite large. They won't funnel but bridge. Very-very coarse stuff. Compared to what I am used to in other brands, to look at it, I would rate it closer to 1/2 Fg. than 1 or 1 1/2.
Now, after saying that, I suppose I'm commited to taking pictures.

Ditto, speaking from actual usage.I believe it is also the consistant grain size that gives smaller SD. Also, superior ingredients/mixture/technique/formula makes for a hotter burning powder, even though more course.

 

[Ken Rummer]

The Swiss use a number system to identify their powder size. Swiss #3 is comparable in size to Goex 2Fg. The powder I buy from Powder Inc. has a small white sticky label that shows the size in the American system. The 3Fg label on my can of Swiss indicates it is comparable to 3Fg Goex in size. It seems powder shipped to the USA is labeled with tags indicating the approximate American sizes. I believe using the white tag size information will be correct.

 

[Rifleman1776]

We have lost track of what the original question was. The discussion was really all in the same lanugae, granulation sizes in the American system. 1 1/2 Fg. Swiss is quite coarse. 3 Fg. Swiss is quite fine, it is finer than Goex 3 Fg.
Results using 1 1/2 Fg. Swiss, in the American system, are what vary with different shooters.

 

[Jason Lewis]

Thanks for that first hand experience.
I am still nonplussed at the notion of a coarser powder producing higher velocities, presumably from greater pressures.
If your measurements were by volume that would be even more astonishing. But, knowing you precision guys, I'm surmising it was by actual weight.

yep, by weight. i really think it's mostly made from better ingredients like mike said in an earlier post that makes the differance. hell, large charges of swiss 3F in long range rifles will burn out a platinum nipple very quickly.

 

[Ken Rummer]

Disagree. Goex is finer than Swiss.
US (Goex) 2Fg is .024 to .047
Swiss #3 (2FG) is .026 to .054

 

[Rifleman1776]

Disagree. Goex is finer than Swiss.
US (Goex) 2Fg is .024 to .047
Swiss #3 (2FG) is .026 to .054

Look at the pictures. The Swiss is notably finer than the Goex. What's to disagree with?
Buy some of your own and look at it. Not a debatable issue.

 

[paulvallandigham]

We may all be right, and wrong at the same time!

I learned something tonight by talking to Pete at home, where I could ask him to actually look at his Swiss 1 1/2 powder, and compare it to his Goex 2Fg powder.

Apparently, Swiss has changed its numbering system for sales in America, to try to end the confusion it has caused here. [ I wish they also corrected the website!]

NOW, Swiss 1 1/2 is between Fg and FFg Goex in granule sizing. It is coarser( meaning larger in size)than Goex FFg powder.

What makes it put more powder into that volume measure is the fact that the Swiss POLISH the granules, and in that process, make the surfaces SMOOTHER, and remove edges and corners to make the granules more ROUND.

My brothers 70 grain volume measure, using Goex powder, throws 75.2 grains of his new Swiss 1 1/2F powder. That is an increase[difference] of only 7.4% of the total volume- not much when using black powder to propel anything. The polishing of that the Swiss makers do does make the powder flow more easily thru measures, and the roundness allows the powder to compact tighter, even tho the individual granules are larger than Goex FFg.

Mike Brooks is correct about the roundness being the major factor.

Once again I get to apologize for the confusion I caused here. :surrender: :shocked2: :idunno: :hatsoff:

 

[Rifleman1776]

Once again I get to apologize for the confusion I caused here.

Firing squad at sunset. atriot:
To add to what you said (and to the confusion :stir: ) a look at the picture I posted shows the Swiss 3Fg. to be gray in color. This compared to the Swiss 1 1/2 Fg. and Goex 3Fg. , both of which are clearly very black in color. Which means??????????? :idunno:

 

[Mike Brooks]

Graphite