T/C Maxi Balls and Elk

[Reno]

Pure lead.

 

[McClura]

Where are you hunting Elk? I know that Colorado used to require .54. I had been hunting Elk in CO with longbow for years and finally drew a Muzzleloading tag. I read more rules and found I had to use .54. I had built a .50 flintlock longrifle with Green Mountain 42" , 1-60 twist a few years earlier. So, I ordered a .54 Green Mountain 42" barrel in 1-60 twist. installed a fit the stock made tang and practiced with .540 round balls and Hornady Great Plains bullets and made some pure lead bullets in a mold that looked like a Great Plains bullet. They were from plumbers sheet lead which is pretty close to pure leas.
After getting my load right, I took a small bull with it the third day of the hunt. Right behind the leg and he only went in a circle of 20 yds and dropped.
My buddy that had drawn a cow tag had lock failure on his TC Renegade, broken sear on practice shot after arriving. He took a medium cow with my flintlock and bullet in the shoulder and it was high enough that she just rolled over and hit the ground. I have also taken them with pure round balls since. I built a .54 Cal Bridger Hawken from parts out of Track of the Wolf for a good friend and guide in SW CO and he has taken many elk, a few bears and mule deer with it using the pure round balls I cast for him. Never lost one. I say if you can and are hunting with the .50 I would try the bullets, pure lead, with a little lube on them and go hunt with confidence. Enjoy the hunt and keep us informed.

 

[Mike in FL]

I realize black powder guns are not comparable to smokeless, but the only elk I've killed was not a pass thru shot yet the huge bull dropped in his tracks. .338 expanded bullet found against the hide on the opposite side. 40 yard broadside shot.

 

[Mike in FL]

I realize black powder guns are not comparable to smokeless, but the only elk I've killed was not a pass thru shot yet the huge bull dropped in his tracks. .338 expanded bullet found against the hide on the opposite side. 40 yard broadside shot.

Uh oh. I violated a rule there. Very sorry.

 

[64Springer]

I realize black powder guns are not comparable to smokeless, but the only elk I've killed was not a pass thru shot yet the huge bull dropped in his tracks. .338 expanded bullet found against the hide on the opposite side. 40 yard broadside shot.

How thick was the patch...LOL

 

[Bad Karma]

Longcruise has it right, so does 64Springer and SDSMlf and most of the other posters. Recommend you quit your job, order a half dozen different molds, four or five different alloys including pure lead, twenty five pounds of Swiss powder in 1.5, 2, and 3f granulations along with CCI, RWS, and Remington caps and then commence to shooting.

Or, if it was me I’d start with the 50-415I bullet, pure lead or maybe 30:1, Stihl HP modified NASA Bullshop lube and 80 grains of 2f Swiss. This is all IdahoLewis recipe for that GM barrel and it works… of course then you still have to get up and go to work tomorrow so there’s the rub.

 

[Rudy]

This is not directed at the OP but just for General Information. The standard barrel on a renegade is made to shoot TC maxi balls so there is no need to buy a special barrel unless the one with the gun is defective.

Very true just need to know how much powder to use TC says 80 to max 100 gr 90 best now you know with Black or pyrodex powder from 70s book to 95 book

 

[ETipp]

With my stock .50 New Englander, as well as the other TC's and one CVA .50 that I have had, the only charge I used with a 370 grain Maxi Ball has been 80 grains of 3F BP. All shot that load well.

My dad use to have a .50 TC Hawken and it too, shot that load very well.

Every critter I have ever killed with a 370 grain Maxi Ball has been harder lead. And not the first one has made it past a few steps.

This is a .370 grain Maxi Ball that I recovered from an elk I shot that was every bit of 125 yards+. Found it just under the hide on the off side. It is hard cast. Note the indentation on one side. It hit one rib that I know for sure.

Its one of only two that I have been able to recover. All others were pass throughs.

 

[mtfishn]

I've shot a couple elk with TC maxi in .54 (not .50). I see no need to harden them for penetration. While a slightly harder slug MAY work...I don't believe it necessary. One elk got a complete pass through at 80yds another was a closer quartering shot where the slug entered behind the last rib, angled forward, behind the opposite shoulder and stopped under the hide, expanded to over one inch diameter. Neither one walked out of sight.

 

[SDSmlf]

I have yet to see any signs of leading.

Because I use wheel weights with antimony and tin.

Harder lead, 11 to 15 BHN smears much less.

And the fact that it stays put without being sticky or goopy is a great plus in my book.

Fair enough. How did you find the 45-45-10 to work with softer lead, pure or maybe 40:1? And specifically with Maxi Balls the OP asked about? How many can you load before cleaning the bore?

I had a chance to test the Lewis modified Bullshop lube and @chorizo ‘s reverse engineered lube (@chorizo provided samples of both lubes) in a 1-30 45 caliber GM barrel and saw no evidence of leading. I was shooting ‘pure’ lead (BHN 5) and a couple of different conicals in the 350 to 400 grain range. I did not try the 45-45-10 in this round of tests, as I did not have any made up, plus it has shown not to reduce let alone eliminate leading in previous tests with ‘pure’ lead or 40:1 alloy.

 

[morehops52]

I only shoot pure lead maxis and have never had a deer so more than 30 yds. but most drop in their tracks. I only recovered one maxi and it went from left hind qtr all way thru to the far side of the right shoulder. The deer was so large I had to quarter it to get it out. As said there was little mushrooming, just nose pushed back into base a bit. But it works.

 

[ETipp]

I only shoot pure lead maxis and have never had a deer so more than 30 yds. but most drop in their tracks. I only recovered one maxi and it went from left hind qtr all way thru to the far side of the right shoulder. The deer was so large I had to quarter it to get it out. As said there was little mushrooming, just nose pushed back into base a bit. But it works.

Exactly! And that's my point. As long as one gets good accuracy out of a Maxi Ball, the hardness of the lead matters not, in terms effect on game.

No matter how one tries to slice the pie, over the years I have proven that, for whatever reason, Maxi Balls are superior big game stoppers. Lead hardness matters not.

The main aspect is the lead needs to be just soft enough so when the Maxi Ball is started into the muzzle, that the sealing band is engraved to the rifling for proper sealing of the burned gasses. Other than that, the design of the Maxi Ball will do the rest.

 

[nkbj]

 

[45man]

The only thing I see that is a worry is the twist. 1 in 48 is the best for RB and maxi balls. My old TC would touch all 5 shots with both at 50 yards. I hate the modern rifles made for bullets with plastic on the butt.
As for pure lead, nothing better and it has taken over 150 deer for me. No need for tin or anything else.

 

[BS]

This is a must read for the 1-48 twist!

https://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/threads/54-cal-tc-renegade-stock-1-48-twist-accuracy-test.39457/

 

[BS]

I took the TC mold and made the top ring larger and thicker, hoping for better bite on the rifling.

Also opened the second groove up, and made the body larger.

I have not tested these yet, but also made some that are a bit harder. [Red in color]

Blue are soft , red are harder.

Eastwood power paints, shake and bake.

Sized to fit bore, painted and sized again.

 

[Whiteoak15]

I want to hear about the testing results! Thanks!

 

[ETipp]

View attachment 252132

View attachment 252132

Except for one thing. The Maxi Ball does not have to expand to put deer down real quick like. I have proven this time and time again.

Not trying to take anything away from the Maxi Hunter. It’s simply that from many years using Maxi Balls, it simply does not get any better. Not one critter has went more than a few steps.

But I digress

 

[nkbj]

Just a trip down memory lane...
Remember the rifles CVA once produced with the slightly larger than fifty bore?
I actually have one of the NEI .51 maxi molds made 'specially for them.

 

[longcruise]

Exactly! And that's my point. As long as one gets good accuracy out of a Maxi Ball, the hardness of the lead matters not, in terms effect on game.

So true.