T/C Patriot

[50 cal gal]

I found a T/C Patriot on the shelf at a local gun shop. It worked great for the first month I had it, then suddenly stopped shooting about half the time. I was told to boil the spring, then grease it really well. I just greased it. Should I boil the dirt out? Should I do that with all my muzzle loaders? Thanks for any help

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

I found a T/C Patriot on the shelf at a local gun shop. It worked great for the first month I had it, then suddenly stopped shooting about half the time. I was told to boil the spring, then grease it really well. I just greased it. Should I boil the dirt out? Should I do that with all my muzzle loaders? Thanks for any help

I need a little more information about "how" the gun just "stopped" working... like does the hammer stay back in the half cocked or fully cocked positions?, does the trigger not release the hammer? are there any obvious changes from the last time when you had it firing and when it started working halfway? When it doesn't fire, what happens that is different from when it does fire?

Those kinds of things would help considerably to troubleshoot the problem. It don't think it was right to just tell you to "boil the dirt out"--which is a new one on me...

BTW, welcome to the forum!!! Glad to have you here!

Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly :hatsoff:

 

[50 cal gal]

The hammer stays back. Almost like I didn't pull the trigger. The grease seemed to do the job. But, I don't want this to happen again if I can avoid it. Makes it hard to win at the meet when there isn't a boom.

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

The hammer stays back. Almost like I didn't pull the trigger. The grease seemed to do the job. But, I don't want this to happen again if I can avoid it. Makes it hard to win at the meet when there isn't a boom.

Tell me about where did you "grease" the lock parts?

I'm trying to remember, but I think the T/C Patriot has double set triggers, doesn't it?

Will the gun fire WITHOUT using the set trigger first? Will it ONLY fire if you do use the set trigger first? Does the trigger pull "feel normal" other than that the hammer does not fall? Do you either feel or hear a click from inside the gun when you pull the trigger? Do you ever pull the hammer back and it won't stay cocked?

Even without knowing the answers to the above questions, I'm just going to take an educated guess here, but it sounds to me like the double set trigger mechanism is way out of adjustment. And that could definitely cause the problem you are having with the pistol.

Sometimes the relationship of the levers and spring tension in the double set triggers gets "too far out" and then problems start happening. The adjustment screws can loosen up over time, like the recoil from shooting it for a month or so. The problem with not firing every time usually happens, and then it can get so far out of adjustment that it won't fire at all, or you won't be able to cock the hammer and have it stay back on it's own.

Either take it to a good gunsmith who really knows muzzleloaders, or to a good friend (or fellow shooter) who is familiar with this type of pistol and have them take a look. The adjustment screw may have already worked itself loose enough to have fallen out, in which case you'll need a part or maybe two, besides the adjustments. It also may be very dirty or rusted inside on critical parts--which can change the amount of adjustment without turning a screw at all.

Hope you get it resolved soon, so that you can get back into the competition.

Good Luck!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[Harley Donaldson]

Remove the lock and check the internal bridle screws. These work loose and prevent the hammer from falling.

 

[Gemoke]

I have a T.C. patroit 45 cal. and I to had trouble with the lock, send it back to T.C. they fixed it and sent it back right away. I have not had any trouble since. they have a life time guarantee, on all their products.
cut finger

 

[Rabbit]

T/C Patriots have single set triggers, can only be fired by setting triggers. My guess is the internal lock screws are loose. If so, take them out and put some locktite (blue) on them. That should do it.

 

[Bear Rider]

I had a Patriot. If it hadn't been for those REVERSED triggers, I would still have it, but I had too many other firearms with double set triggers that would fire unset if you pulled the front trigger. After launching a rifle round into the mountain that the club used as a final backstop, I sold the thing. I just felt that it was an accident looking for a place to happen. It's too bad. That was one of the more readily accurate pistols that I've had. My Lyman will shoot as accurately, but I really have to work at it.

I agree with Rabbit. I seem to recall a similar problem with mine where the screws were loose. However, that was many years ago.

 

[Deadeye]

The Patriot has reversed double set triggers(front sets, rear releases) set at the factory with no adjustment screws.

 

[50 cal gal]

First off thanks for all the advice.

I oiled the spring. It only fires after I use the set trigger. The trigger feels normal, and I don't feel a click. I couldn't hear a click, not saying there isn't one, but with ear plugs I couldn't hear one. The hammer stays cocked every time. I checked it out and all adjustment screws are tight. I cleaned on it and there wasn't rust. Hopefully it's alright. I have almost a month until the next meet and I plan to take it out before then, so I'll know. I let you know how it goes. Thanks again.

 

[sfruhwirth]

Does anyone know why they switch the order on the set triggers? It seems odd to flip flop which is the set and which is the trigger.

 

This is just my guess , but with a pistol you can probably shoot better using the rear trigger , since you would compromise your grip if you had to shoot with the front trigger . But I've never owned or shoot the Patriot pistol so I don't know for sure . It seems to me , that a single set trigger would have been the way to go :imo: .

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

To All,

Well stomp my grits and call me corn-pone... I'm glad there's enough Patriot owners for there to be some worthy advice given, other than my futile attempt. I had always sus'd that they had conventional double set trigger setup, but from what I am understanding from y'all... Are yous saying that they are single-mode and will ONLY fire double-set only? AND that you can NOT fire them in unset condition?

I certainly wasn't trying to mis-lead 50 cal gal by offering my suggestions, that were based on my knowledge of other doubles set triggers and their quirks.

My apologies to ALL! and ESPECIALLY to "50 cal gal"!

AND Chalk one up on the dum-dum board for this ol' hillbilly! :redface:

T/C Patriots are so rare in this area, that I've never even seen one--other than in my old T/C catalogs and literature. Even Tradtions Trappers are very uncommon around here. I don't know why certain type of muzzleloading pistols (and rifle) get popularised in certain areas, but outside of those areas they are practically impossible to find.

Again, please forgive my ignorance... I'm going to copy this topic down to the local drive for reference now, as I sure wouldn't have found this out anywhere else.

Thanks for this "new" (to me) information.

Regards,
WV_Hillbilly :sorry:

 

[Bear Rider]

To All,

Well stomp my grits and call me corn-pone... I'm glad there's enough Patriot owners for there to be some worthy advice given, other than my futile attempt. I had always sus'd that they had conventional double set trigger setup, but from what I am understanding from y'all... Are yous saying that they are single-mode and will ONLY fire double-set only? AND that you can NOT fire them in unset condition?

It's worse than that. The functions of the triggers are reversed. The FRONT trigger sets the trigger mechanism and the REAR trigger fires the gun.

If you go directly from firing the Patriot to firing another gun with conventional double set triggers, you could be setting the stage for an accidental discharge.

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

To All,

Are yous saying that they are single-mode and will ONLY fire double-set only? AND that you can NOT fire them in unset condition?

It's worse than that. The functions of the triggers are reversed. The FRONT trigger sets the trigger mechanism and the REAR trigger fires the gun.

If you go directly from firing the Patriot to firing another gun with conventional double set triggers, you could be setting the stage for an accidental discharge.

My goodness YES, you're absolutely right. T/C has made a couple of minor stinkers in their time, but this has to count as dumping a major load onto the consumer. I wonder if that's why the Patriot is no longer produced? Aside from the fact that they are too expensive if I ever would come across one of these to buy... I don't think I even want one at all now, or EVER! I'll stick with a Tradtions Trapper, if I want a conventional double set target pistol.

But my Lyman Plains Pistol is such a sweet single trigger gun that I don't know if I could beat it with ANY other single shot pistol. It just fits me perfectly and I like the big hole in the barrel. It doesn't have adj. sights, which hinders it's use as a target pistol, but it sure can keep up in the accuracy department. AND like I said, mine is a .54 cal, instead of a .45 or .50 like those other two guns are.
As usual I digress, and I'm getting off topic too.

Let me ask this one (which is related topically) though...

HOW MANY others think that the "bass-ackwards" double trigger setup on the T/C Patriot is potentially a hazard?

Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[roundball]

HOW MANY others think that the "bass-ackwards" double trigger setup on the T/C Patriot is potentially a hazard?

I do...I actually bought a new unfired .45cal Patriot from an estate sale back in the mid-90's...when I received it I read up on it, played with it in the den for a little while and got thinking about that very thing...how the triggers were backwards from all the TC Hawkens that I shoot regularly and decided not to keep it...wiped it down, sold it on auction a couple weeks later without ever taking it out of the house.

It's a well made, good looking pistol...just wish it was available with a single adjustable trigger...and if was also available in Flint, well, I'd probably get two!
::

 

[Bear Rider]

But my Lyman Plains Pistol is such a sweet single trigger gun that I don't know if I could beat it with ANY other single shot pistol. It just fits me perfectly and I like the big hole in the barrel. It doesn't have adj. sights, which hinders it's use as a target pistol, but it sure can keep up in the accuracy department.

I have the same gun. The lack of adjustable sights isn't all that much of a hindrance. Just work up a consistent load, then adjust the sights for it.

The Lyman will shoot as accurately as the Patriot, but you have to work harder at it in terms of consistency. The Patriot just seemed more forgiving of minor changes.

For instance, I once decided to be cheap and use some muslin left over from a shirt to swab the barrel between shots. All of a sudden, I couldn't keep it on the cardboard backer at 50 yards, much less in the black. I scratched my head, pulled out my target .22 to see if it was me -- NOPE! I scratched my head some more, had some lunch, then remembered that I had changed cleaning patch material. My first five shots after switching back to my regular cleaning routine were all in the black.

The difference appears to be in the lands and grooves. IIRC, the Patriot's were more numerous and much deeper.

I did notice one other advantage to the Lyman .54. On a bright day, you can visually inspect the full length of the barrel including the breech to see how good a job of cleaning that you are doing. ::

 

[50 cal gal]

I certainly wasn't trying to mis-lead 50 cal gal by offering my suggestions, that were based on my knowledge of other doubles set triggers and their quirks.

My apologies to ALL! and ESPECIALLY to "50 cal gal"!


Please don't apologize to me. You were trying to help me out. Thanks. I am so new to this whole black powder world that I didn't know I was being led astray. So, please keep giving me advice. I need all the help I can get.

 

[redwing]

Hey Deadeye I have 2 of the TC Patriots both have adjustment screws. They work well. When will you
be up this way?

Redwing :thumbsup:

 

[unspellable]

I bought a trapper second hand but apparently unfired. Some yo-yo had ground off the top of the trigger so it would fire only in set mode. Whuffo?

The Patriot lock is designed from the get go to fire only in set mode. It does have an adjustment screw. This brings me to my problem. The trigger pull is way too light and I view it as hazardous. the screw appears to have no effect on the trigger pull, It think it's there for some other reason such as backlash. What do I do to increase the trigger pull?

I mean the trigger is light. I can lay the gun on the table, put my hands in my pockets, think "bang!" and the trigger trips. On the other hand it's not totaly screwed up, banging on the pistol doesn't trip it.