The .58 muskets as hunting rifles?

[Zonie]

The Parker-Hale Royal Artillery Carbine Enfield (Musketoon) I recently bought weighs only 7 1/4 pounds. It has a 24 inch barrel with 2 barrel bands.

The .577 caliber, 566 grain Minie' balls weight is 1 3/4 ounces so the way I figure it, it's like shooting a lightweight 3 inch magnum 12 guage with a solid brass butt plate.

This bodes of bad times ahead because every time I pick it up I get the urge to shoot it some more. (After 2 weeks, my bruised shoulder is healed). ::
One of the neatest little guns I have.

 

[Rat]

My 1861 is definately NOT too heavy, long, or un-handy to carry hunting all day. This is just someting that seems to be in theory, but really when you get out all day with one they are not that heavy or unhandy, the full length rifle muskets. Certainly some model/makes are heavier than others, and the density of the wood will make a BIG difference in weight, especially on a long, full stocked rifle.

Last season, I carried my Armi-sport '61 for two weeks, all day almost every day and was pleasently suprised at how easy it was to carry.

The good news is, I found/find the full length rifle to "hang" better, and more steady, when aiming it standing, offhand. Made me feel very confident for those shots when you can't take a rest for various reasons.

Also, the long barrel gives me a lot of confidence, as the ballistics are very good, and I know the velocity of the REAL is right up there, both for trajectory, and WHOMPABILITY. !!

My Zouave does indeed seem to have a much thicker barrel, at mid length and towards the muzzle, than the '61, although the '61 seems to have a heavier breech. Probably a much steeper taper to the barrel on the '61.

Rat

 

[roundball]

WHOMPABILITY. !!

I love it...a new "energy measurement"...the RWI:

"Rat's Whompability Index"

:crackup: :: :crackup:

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

My '53 Enfield is not difficult to carry for long periods. For one thing, when no need for sudden use exists, it carries easily using its sling. I've never found length to be a problem, either. I have flint and percussion guns with even longer barrels and use them in the woods without problem. I've no information regarding the velocity that I can get with the Minie, but have no problem getting decent offhand groups at 100 yards. 70- 80 grains of ffg seems to get the Minie down range without an undue amount of holdover. As it happens, the Enfield's slow twist does handle patched ball loads with fine accuracy. I think either load will get the job done on a deer sized animal with dispatch.

 

[Luckydeuce1951]

OOps...just noticed someone posted a similar post. Guess I should read all the posts first... So I will edit mine...

I own a Navy Arms Buffalo Hunter which is a sporterized .58 Zouave. It is a great rifle and very accurate and packs a major punch. I intend on buying a Zouave rifle to go along with it.

 

[BillinOregon]

Lucky: What load and bullet do you like in your Buffalo Hunter?

 

[smoothshooter]

I realize these were in use toward the end of our era, when the sports who could afford them were buying breechloaders. But I suspect many a surplused Springfield, Enfield or Harpers Ferry got a livery stable sporter job and ended its days bringing home haunches of elk, bear, bison and protecting the farm.
That's why I think a Zouave or Enfield might make a good candidate for an elk rifle. I can't imagine an elk that could stand up to a decently placed minie within 125 yards or so.
Anyone out there hunting with a Mississippi, or an 1855, or an 1853/56/58/61 or an 1861 Springfield? Are you using them on game heavier than deer? What has been your experience? What would be your "pick of the litter" for hunting rugged terrain for elk?

I would use a ball instead of a Minnie. Higher velocity and much flatter trajectory.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

The Enfield’s Pattern of 1861 Musketoon .577” calibre makes a tremendous brushman’s arm.

 

[LawrenceA]

Shot a few pigs with my M
usketoon.
Mate of mine put a few wild horses down with a Zouve. Said the minie went all the way from the back to the from.
Toying with trying the Musketoon on camels.

 

[deadwaterduck]

Scattershot: I think the Oregon and Colorado fish and game guys had beers together when they worked out the rules. A Volunteer or Whitworth would not be legal for elk in Oregon either, as minimum caliber for elk here is .50, and the projectile cannot be more than twice bore diameter in length. So a 550-grain slug at 1300 out of a Volunteer is no-go for elk, but a .50 round ball is. I don't get it.
That's why I like the idea of a thick-skirted .58 minie like the Lyman 577611 at about 1200.

The 577611 is a real thumper. Use it in my TC Big Boar. Never recovered one on a whitetail. Busts things up pretty good entering the territory and opens the floodgates as it leaves.

 

[deadwaterduck]

$700, why that's highway robbery. Why right here in my 1974 copy of the Guns & Ammo Complete Guide To BlackPowder it lists for $150. ::

LOL !!!!! God, where has the world gone. I long for the days when I don't remember those days and I pick up an old copy and I get excited over the possibilities of what I can maybe do with my social security check.

 

[LawrenceA]

The Parker-Hale Royal Artillery Carbine Enfield (Musketoon) I recently bought weighs only 7 1/4 pounds. It has a 24 inch barrel with 2 barrel bands.

The .577 caliber, 566 grain Minie' balls weight is 1 3/4 ounces so the way I figure it, it's like shooting a lightweight 3 inch magnum 12 guage with a solid brass butt plate.

This bodes of bad times ahead because every time I pick it up I get the urge to shoot it some more. (After 2 weeks, my bruised shoulder is healed). ::
One of the neatest little guns I have.

Can't agree more!
Mwah hah hah!!!

 

[RAEDWALD]

The ‘Minnie’ was designed to work right out to 900 odd yards and all points between. For practical hunting ranges James Forsyth (free download of his book ‘The Sporting Rifle and it’sProjectiles’ at archive.org) advocated the slow twist patched round ball to allow a flat trajectory up to 100/200 yards by using a heavy charge without the ball stripping on the rifling. The usual infantry rifle musket slow twists such as the 1:78 Enfield are within his range for a 0,577“ bore and that bore is within his advised bores for game, albeit at the lower end at 24 Bore. Thus a rifle musket with a round ball is a practical hunting rifle for the ranges at which hunting actually occurs.

I heartily recommend reading his book.

 

[oldwood]

In the early 1970's , got a Harper's Ferry .58 flint for Pa. late deer season. Put an H &A tang peep sight on it. With a proper fitting .580 Lee Minie ball , and a max. powder charge of 80 gr.FFg , so as not to blow the skirt on the ball , the rifle would do 3 1/2" group at 100 meters. Only draw back was the 8" rainbow in the bullet's flight at 100 m. As far as killing power ,no problem. Once had a big doe coming down a trail facing towards me. Dropped her at 25 yards. The ball entered the front aspect of her right where the bottom of the neck enters the chest. The ball glanced off the bottom right edge of the spine , went through 17" of chops and stalled. The ball also clipped off all the small triangle shaped spinal process bones as it went. Obviously an instant kill. Missed a nice 6 point buck standing shot at 60 yds., I forgot about the 8" rainbow in the Minie's trajectory and held a little high on the buck's chest. The ball passed safely over the deer's back. (Excuse #4 It was a cold day)..............This rifle was "before range finders" , meaning now-a-days , using a modern range finder , and because of its accuracy , it would be a good killer for the larger Cervids...............oldwood

 

[dave951]

Try this profile for up to 100yds, it weighs about 460gr and is deadly accurate out of most muskets. It's called the "Trashcan"