The Ruger New/ Old Army

[jonathan butcher]

As someone who loves c&b revolvers I'd like someone to explain the popularity of the Ruger Old Army to me. Let me preface by saying, what I like about the reproduction c&b revolvers is their connection to the actual models which have historical significance. Though I might not be able to afford a Colt Walker, Paterson or even a shootable 1860 Army I can buy reproductions of those models.
By contrast the Ruger has no connection to anything, essentially a percussion version of the Ruger Blackhawk ( mention of an unmentionable for comparisons sake). To be fair I fully acknowledge the robust qualities of the Ruger as a handgun on its own terms.
But lacking the historical connection (which inspired my own interest in c&b revolvers) I just don't understand the ROA. And before anyone becomes irrate I'm not in any way knocking the ROA. But I would enjoy hearing from those who seek them out- why do you like the Ruger New/ Old Army ?

 

[Kansas Jake]

In some ways the Rogers &Spencer fits in the same class as the Ruger because there is limited evidence of it being available during the years after it was developed. I do like my Colts and Remingtons.

 

[jonathan butcher]

Good point, however the R&S was at least made during the Civil War. It existed and though it may have seen limited service it was used during the period.

In some ways the Rogers &Spencer fits in the same class as the Ruger because there is limited evidence of it being available during the years after it was developed. I do like my Colts and Remingtons.

 

[OldMaineWoodsman]

For me, it is just a nice looking revolver. It is rugged, reliable, and easy to take down to clean. Mine is the stainless version which IMO adds to it's versatility. Finally, I just like Ruger firearms. I like my historical replica percussion revolvers too, but if I had to actually use one for self-defense or an everyday woods sidearm, it would be the ROA hands down.

 

[TFoley]

I once noted on these pages, many moons ago, that if the cartridge had not been invented, the ROA may well have been what the percussion revolver might have ended up like in the1970s.

It's hard to say why it become such a hit in the USA, given to obvious - to me - antipathy of the original poster, although he says otherwise. He is unlikely to be alone in his opinion.

It begs the question why people buy what they perceive as either a replica, or a vague lookalike, of a familiar-looking gun at all. Just how much like a real Hawken does the any modern version look like? I've read enough here over the years I've been here to know that to many American shooters they some of them are as much like a Hawken as they are a M16.

However, we are talking about the ROA, which is not, as some note, a copy of anything, although it owes much to one particular gun whose name momentarily escapes me, and it's NOT the Remington NMA.

I guess it was such an obvious take on a generic 'old gun' but in modern format, using modern materials and a massive coil spring instead of a flat one, and looking as solid as Mt Rushmore, and it was going to appeal to people who wanted the feel of a old-style pistol, but the convenience of stainless steel - as soon as it arrived made in that material. It looked like it would last for ever, maybe longer, and certainly my own, bought on my birthday in 1986, cleans up well enough to be taken for one maybe a couple of years old. Nevertheless, it has had, MUST have had, 20,000 shots down it since that day. Maybe more.

I know that for most of you living in the US of A, the rationale behind the relatively huge sales is vague. Not so here in UK, where 99% death of our pistol shooting took place by October of 1997, by which time we had all handed in our cartridge-firing handguns, except in Northern Ireland, where they were exempted. The crazy rush to have ANY kind of a replacement big-bore handgun, even a muzzleloader like the ROA, was hard to resist, and for a while, nobody in the world outside the US bought more of them than the shooter on Mainland UK. Even today, with a good second-hand ROA STILL costing way more than almost any other BP handgun, sales are strong, and would undoubtedly be even stronger were it to come back into production. Indeed, I have waiting list of around ten or more people if and when mine comes up for grabs.

I'm sure you can see why any handgun that LOOKS like a proper handgun, as we know it, Jim, is going to take preference over an abortion, no matter how well it shoots.

 

[springfield art]

As someone who loves c&b revolvers I'd like someone to explain the popularity of the Ruger Old Army to me. Let me preface by saying, what I like about the reproduction c&b revolvers is their connection to the actual models which have historical significance. Though I might not be able to afford a Colt Walker, Paterson or even a shootable 1860 Army I can buy reproductions of those models.
By contrast the Ruger has no connection to anything, essentially a percussion version of the Ruger Blackhawk ( mention of an unmentionable for comparisons sake). To be fair I fully acknowledge the robust qualities of the Ruger as a handgun on its own terms.
But lacking the historical connection (which inspired my own interest in c&b revolvers) I just don't understand the ROA. And before anyone becomes irrate I'm not in any way knocking the ROA. But I would enjoy hearing from those who seek them out- why do you like the Ruger New/ Old Army ?

It's whole purpose was to be an accurate shooting, dependable pistol for black powder shooters. It succeeded admirably. Just another of Bill Ruger's great ideas, no more, no less.

 

[springfield art]

I once noted on these pages, many moons ago, that if the cartridge had not been invented, the ROA may well have been what the percussion revolver might have ended up like in the1970s.

It's hard to say why it become such a hit in the USA, given to obvious - to me - antipathy of the original poster, although he says otherwise. He is unlikely to be alone in his opinion.

It begs the question why people buy what they perceive as either a replica, or a vague lookalike, of a familiar-looking gun at all. Just how much like a real Hawken does the any modern version look like? I've read enough here over the years I've been here to know that to many American shooters they some of them are as much like a Hawken as they are a M16.

However, we are talking about the ROA, which is not, as some note, a copy of anything, although it owes much to one particular gun whose name momentarily escapes me, and it's NOT the Remington NMA.

I guess it was such an obvious take on a generic 'old gun' but in modern format, using modern materials and a massive coil spring instead of a flat one, and looking as solid as Mt Rushmore, and it was going to appeal to people who wanted the feel of a old-style pistol, but the convenience of stainless steel - as soon as it arrived made in that material. It looked like it would last for ever, maybe longer, and certainly my own, bought on my birthday in 1986, cleans up well enough to be taken for one maybe a couple of years old. Nevertheless, it has had, MUST have had, 20,000 shots down it since that day. Maybe more.

I know that for most of you living in the US of A, the rationale behind the relatively huge sales is vague. Not so here in UK, where 99% death of our pistol shooting took place by October of 1997, by which time we had all handed in our cartridge-firing handguns, except in Northern Ireland, where they were exempted. The crazy rush to have ANY kind of a replacement big-bore handgun, even a muzzleloader like the ROA, was hard to resist, and for a while, nobody in the world outside the US bought more of them than the shooter on Mainland UK. Even today, with a good second-hand ROA STILL costing way more than almost any other BP handgun, sales are strong, and would undoubtedly be even stronger were it to come back into production. Indeed, I have waiting list of around ten or more people if and when mine comes up for grabs.

I'm sure you can see why any handgun that LOOKS like a proper handgun, as we know it, Jim, is going to take preference over an abortion, no matter how well it shoots.

View attachment 80495

They really took off here in the States once the covid panic set in. At auction, they often bring 600 or more US dollars. Nice to know you fellows in the UK are burning some powder!

 

[springfield art]

In some ways the Rogers &Spencer fits in the same class as the Ruger because there is limited evidence of it being available during the years after it was developed. I do like my Colts and Remingtons.

It's apparent, when you lay them side-by-side, how similar the ROA and R&S are! I have cylinders for both.

 

[jonathan butcher]

Responders, thank you for your replies! From those who have them utilitarian seems to best describe the ROA. It’s meant to be used, a lot. It’s a shooter and any esthetic similarity to CW revolvers is either secondary or unimportant- is that about right ? I guess If I were carrying a c&b sidearm in northern Grizzly bear country it would be a ROA.

 

[ZUG]

Those wanting a rugged BP revolver that will hold up to many firings and made like a tank you can't beat the Ruger Old Army. All of the modern BP pistols made in Italy have soft internal parts and will need replacing sooner or later. The machining of the Italian revolver is of dubious quality as is the quality control it is hit or miss on getting a "good" one. A person has to do his own deburring and fitting of their parts to have an acceptable working revolver - not so with the Ruger Old Army. I believe the demise of the Ruger Old Army was the cost to produce it and the demand for it.

 

[springfield art]

Those wanting a rugged BP revolver that will hold up to many firings and made like a tank you can't beat the Ruger Old Army. All of the modern BP pistols made in Italy have soft internal parts and will need replacing sooner or later. The machining of the Italian revolver is of dubious quality as is the quality control it is hit or miss on getting a "good" one. A person has to do his own deburring and fitting of their parts to have an acceptable working revolver - not so with the Ruger Old Army. I believe the demise of the Ruger Old Army was the cost to produce it and the demand for it.

Too late to bring it back; today's costs would be prohibitive, the retail would be like a grand!

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Delete

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

The Ruger is a fine gun but it does not share parts with the currently produced Ruger single action revolvers. Parts availability might be a challenge but it will be years down the road. Still, if you do manage to break (or misplace) an internal part on a ROA it might be a slight pain.

I bought one advertised as “new in box” a few years ago and it had oversized chamber mouths. The Hornady .457” balls that I miked at exactly .457” walked in the chambers under recoil tying up the gun. I sold the gun soon after.

Now ROAs are becoming collectors items and are fetching high prices. The word is out on them and their value will only continue to grow.

I myself enjoy the Remington New Model Army design a great deal. Both Uberti and Pietta quality has never been better and the guns are accurate and reliable after a little work, cost a fraction of a ROA, parts are widely available for them, and are a connection to actual historical designs.

 

[Bad Karma]

Too late to bring it back; today's costs would be prohibitive, the retail would be like a grand!

Which is about what folks are paying for a new in the box ROA... sometimes a lot more for fixed sight models.

 

[TFoley]

Too late to bring it back; today's costs would be prohibitive, the retail would be like a grand!

Sir, you talk like this would be a lot of money. That's very odd to me, living here in UK where a second-hand ROA can easily top that. A thousand dollars for a handgun that is probably going to last three or four hundred years, bearing in mind the material of which it is made?

A bargain, I'd call it.

And I'd add that almost every day we see examples of rifles here on these pages that cost many times that amount. Many people here pay way more than that for a kit.

The day of the 50c burger is behind us, Folks, and it is my earnestly-held opinion that a ROA at $1K would fly off the shelves like a flying thing.

 

[OldMaineWoodsman]

Like many other models of firearms the cost or value increases due to it being discontinued. They have always been in demand. For certain periods, some firearms achieve that "must have" status. The prices are inflated for a time, people pay crazy prices and then they stabilize. A good example of this is what people are paying for a replica Paterson.

The pandemic and elections also play a role in this, where people were and still are buying anything and everything.

As the pandemic runs its course and we slowly get back to some type of normalcy, firearms are beginning to show up at the gun shops and outdoor stores. Ammunition is taking more time, but it is slowly beginning to appear.

People who purchased black powder firearms such as percussion revolvers because that was all they could get will soon go back to their unmentionables and will probably sell the black powder stuff off. I'm sure more than a few of those were the ROA.

My personal opinion is that the ROA will continue to be in demand and merit a high price because it is a great revolver. Factor in the after-market cylinders that increase its versatility only makes it more desirable.

 

[Sam squanch]

I had one as a kid. With a badly pitted bore, I could still shoot cloverleaf groups at 25 yards.

 

[Whitworth]

Good revolver I'm sure, just ungainly looking to my eyes. Not on my want list.

 

[jimhallam]

For what it's worth, I think that the ROA looks much like a WHITNEY "Navy" -- see Frank Sellers' excellent "American Percussion Revolvers", page 194-- look at the geometry of the loading lever.

Interesting that in the USA the fixed sight versions fetch more. In the UK they tend to be looked down upon by the purists in the "Cowboy shooting" fraternity.
The Feinwerkbau and other specialised revolvers were brought out to be sold to those who throw money to win in MLAIC Matches, but allowing these and the adjustable-sighted ROAs in the same class in ML matches puts off many with an Italian repro which cost the owner £150 out of the compensation money when the politicians took our "more moderm" (?) Target pistols and revolvers.



ATB to all ML shooters,

Jim H.

 

[Sam squanch]

A ruger old army , but in a compact 32 or 36 caliber, would be nice.