THOMPSON CENTER 1 IN 48 TWIST 50 CAL. FLINTER

[lonewolf5347]

I was out yesterday and found to have a little time on my hands and was wondering how much powder before Accuracy would fall off.I am shooting the t/c flinter 50 cal.using 90 grains of 3f goex and a wad before the patch,seem it is the same load RB shoots.I up the charge to 100 grains and the groupe still performed excellent .
:redthumb:

 

[Bob J]

Sounds like you've got your load :grey:

 

[roundball]

I was out yesterday and found to have a little time on my hands and was wondering how much powder before Accuracy would fall off.I am shooting the t/c flinter 50 cal.using 90 grains of 3f goex and a wad before the patch,seem it is the same load RB shoots.I up the charge to 100 grains and the groupe still performed excellent .
:redthumb:

:agree:
So far, every 1:48" I've ever shot with full power round ball loads has been outstanding...the deer in your area are in serious trouble and don't know it!
:front:

 

[bob1961]

:hmm: maybe i should see what my T/C hawkens .50 will shoot like with a heavier load....i shoot 70 grains with just a PRB...............bob

 

[Swampman]

I've never seen a 1 in 48 that would shoot anything well. My T/C Hawken has a 1 in 60 Sharon barrel on it.

 

[Rebel]

I think you will find quite a few people here that have had real good accuracy with barrels with a 1-48" twist. I know i have had a few that were tack drivers. :m2c:

 

[GregC]

I followed roundball's load advice in my .54 Renegades and found accuracy to be outstanding!

The guns shoot much better than I can / do.

 

[cayugad]

I've pushed my .50 to 100 grains and the accuracy was still good. I just did not see the need for it. 90 grains is really smoking that ball down range. I have never chronographed it, but I am sure a deer would never have a chance hit by it.

Like others, I stole Roundball's loads and they really worked good. I too was a smaller charge shooter until reading his posts.

My Lyman Trade Rifle Flinter .54 hated the 3f. I changed to 2f and loaded 100 grains and the accuracy was excellent. I guess all rifles are a mystery to themselves..

Good luck shooting there lonewolf..

 

[fatboy]

My TC Hawken was my first BP rifle back in the day (1980) I have shot a few deer with it and had always stayed within 80 to 90 range for hunting with very good results >

 

[freetrapper20]

My two T/C .54 cal. flinters are 1:48 twist. I shoot 100g 2F hunting (probably fairly close to 90g 3f)and have no problem with accuracy. Shooting off-hand avg. distances (30-70 yds)I give my in-line budies a run for their money. Maybe they're just bad shots......... :haha:

 

[Swampman]

This is amazing in 30 years of this hobby I've never seen a factory T/C Hawken or Renagade that shot worth a hoot. The twist is too fast for round balls and too slow for conicals. With a Green River barrel they will normally drive nails.

 

[roundball]

"...The twist is too fast for round balls..."

Nothing could be further from the truth...old wives tales die hard

:front:

 

[Swampman]

That's not what everyone I've ever known in the hobby says. That's not what I found with the several I've owned either. The correct twist for a .50 roundball is 1 in 66. A .50 conical is better off with a very fast twist. T/C was trying to straddle the fence but they just produced rifles that weren't good with either.

 

[roundball]

#1 - That's not what everyone I've ever known in the hobby says.

#2 - T/C was trying to straddle the fence but they just produced rifles that weren't good with either.

Well, I'm certain that you're certain you believe what you stated is true.....however;

Reference #1 - Given all the posts in this thread by fellow muzzleloading enthusiasts...unless you assume we're all lying...your item #1 is obviously not a statement you can in good conscience continue to make;

Reference #2 - And in the same vein, given all the posts in this thread, #2 is categorically not true;

The posts in this thread are not "opinions"...they are not "speculation"...they are facts from multilple people who are posting right here and right now.

So I'm sorry...and I completely understand how old wives tales get repeated incorrectly for years and years to the point that some people accept them...and you personally may have even had a bad experience that you thought was caused by 1:48" twist.

But in light of multiple people posting real facts to the contrary, to continue to make a generalization claiming that TC 1:48 twist barrels don't shoot round balls accurately is simply propagating a falsehood...indeed, now that you've read all these posts to the contrary, knowingly propagating a falsehood.

:front:

 

[chuck-ia]

I had a tc renegade with a 1-48 twist, using 80 gr. 2f and round ball, would consistantly shoot eggs off a post at 50 yards. flinch

 

[Swampman]

Just relating what I've seen and found in 30 years worth of blackpowder shooting and extensive involvement with the hobby. I love my newest T/C Hawken. I didn't even bother to buy the factory barrel. I found an unfired Sharon barrel on ebay.

 

[Finnwolf]

I may be the only one but I'll stand with Swampman.
I've owned two .50 cal T/C Hawken and a .50 Renegade with factory 1 in 48" barrels and none ever shot to my satisfaction, hence the reason I have them no more. I've shot 2 or three more belonging to other folks and theirs did not shoot well. I experimented with charges from 70 to 100 grains, different patches and different balls. Never tried wads of any kind. Before I start reading this forum, I never knew anyone who was wildly enthusiastic about the T/C 48 twist for any kind of projectile. I exchanged posts with Roundball some months ago on this topic and I am still perplexed but I've decided that it's probably luck of the draw. T/C obviously does make some good barrels that other folks are lucky enough to get.
Living in PA, the law of the land (was) PRB loads, so I went first for the GPR and finally to a T/C Pennsylvania Hunter, both 66 twist. The Lyman shot pretty well when it went off but was less than reliable in the ignition dept. and cost me a deer or two. It always needed a lot of attention to keep it shooting. I admit I never did any work on the touch hole or the lock - back then I kinda felt a finished rifle should come finished. I dumped it for a good price to someone I knew after telling him about it. I don't think he kept it long either. The PA Hunter shoots well enough, is a better in the ignition dept but not great. I've learned some tricks in the past few months on this forum that I want to try to improve ignition but I have not done them yet. Beyond the accuracy, I have a complaint that really gets my dander up. My PA Hunter is good for 2 or 3 shots and then is virtually unloadable until I swab the bore. I bought this gun new and it has never known anything but the best care and cleaning. I had the same problem in a Hawken I bought used but I chalked it up to the previous owner not taking care of it. I often thought that perhaps he left it loaded for long periods or didn't clean it well enough. On both guns the load will slide down the barrel to a certain point and go no further without literally pounding it down. I actually did pound a few in rather than have to pull them. I learned to bring a wooden mallet to the range with me. It's OK for hunting but it's a lot of work at the range. For this reason I have never been a fan of T/C or Lyman and this is why I'm finally building a Lancaster with a good grade barrel.
Sorry to you T/C and Lyman fans out there - but I calls 'em likes I sees 'em.
Finnwolf

 

[jimbo15563]

I have had a TC Renegade flinter for 20 years and have never had one problem with it. I keep the touch hole, frizzen and pan cleaned and use TC flints. Other than on rainy days, I've rarely had a missfire. The 1:48 twist is versatile, allowing me to shoot both PRB and conicals well. I've filled a lot of tags in te PA primitive season. I've been tempted to trade it for a Lyman since I'm a lefty, but it works so well that I've resisted the impulse.

I've been shooting roundballs with prelubed pillow ticking patches and have had excellent results. Up to now, I've been using 80 grains of Goex FF and getting good groups. I've been afraid to push it higher because of the 1:48 twist. Based on the comments above, I'm going to try 100 grains with a Wonder Wad underneath.

As far as conicals go, short ones are no problem with the 1:48 twist. I get excellent groups with TC 275 gr. Maxi-hunters. The shorter the bullet, the less twist is needed to stabilize it. Buffalo ballets also shoot well.

Jimbo

 

[roundball]

Yes, my results are based on Pyrodex and Goex, wonderwads, good tight .018" prelubed pillow ticking, and Hornady/Speer balls...I've accumulated a number of used TC 1:48's over all the years in .45/.50/.54cals, both caplock & flintlock, and the results are the same.

I scrub them down to the bare raw metal like they left the factory, I use Shooter's Choice Black Powder Cleaning Gel to dissolve any tar buildup...then nothing but steaming hot soapy water and natural lube 1000 go in the bores after that...not a dog in the bunch...they span all the various vintages of barrels from the 70's/80's/90's up to 1995...old ones without crowns, newer ones with crowns, some with old style sights, some with new style sights, etc...I don't happen to like the QLA feature in barrels made since 1995 so I have no 1:48" barrels made after that date.

I did have one TC barrel problem...it was a brand new .50cal x 1:66" round ball Flint barrel who's POI would begin moving way off to the left as it heated up...wasn't enough rear sight adjustment to contain it...if I let it cool off it would print back to the right...TC replaced it.

Years ago I decided to switch to PRB's, and based upon hearing that 1:48" barrels were not accurate with PRB's I started out with a .50cal RB barrel, then added a .45, then a .54, etc. Years later, as I needed reasons to keep doing something new on my Saturday morning range trips, I decided to start running side by side test comparisons between my 1:66" and 1:48" TC barrels for each caliber.

Each Saturday I tested a different caliber using my same full power 1:66" hunting loads in both twists:
90grns Goex 3F
Wonderwad
.018" prelubed pillow ticking
Hornady .440/.490/.530 balls
Identical loading procedures, identical cleaning & lubing procedures, identical weather & range conditions, etc...5 shots with one, then 5 shots with the other so no one barrel would heat up excessively...they all printed in the 2"-3" range at 100yds and if someone had shuffled the targets together and handed them back to me I would have had to pause and study a little to try and pick out the 1:66" targets from the 1:48"...same results with percussion barrels.

Maybe the different experiences are matters of degree between people's expectations...for me I'm tickled to death to shoot a group smaller than 3" at 100yds using iron sights and 60 year old eyes and I call that excellent accuracy...others may scoff at that and only accept 1" groups at 100yds as being excellent...but at any rate, the above tests and weekly trips to the range year round are the basis for my statement that TC's 1:48" barrels produce excellent round ball accuracy.

In fact, I've often said if I could only have one TC Hawken barrel, it would be a .45cal X 1:48"...the 128grn Hornady balls and 255grn TC maxi-hunters just eat the bullseyes out of targets and would give a lot of small & large game versatility, economy for plinking cans on the weekends, etc.

 

[lonewolf5347]

I have to say my other flinter being a early renegade 54cal shoots the RB'S excellent,230 ball by Hornady with 90 to 100 grains of goex 3f @ a wad.
I only started with RB'S this year otherwise I found REALS conical with a wad shot excellent out of the hawkens and renegade.
I can print some nice groups at the 50 yard target(clover leaf),but my eyes are not what they use to be when it comes to the 100 yard target so softball groups for me are excellent.
I was amazed how well the RB's shoot out of a 1 in 48 twist :redthumb: