Thoughts on "Gauge" to select..

[md2020]

I'm going to have a shotgun barrel fitted to my Hopkins & Allen Under Hammer action-- the barrel must be at or less than 1 1/8 diameter-- The easy thing would be a 1 inch octa to round in 20 gauge..However I prefer the tapered look and I'm looking at the Colerain barrel listed here. either 16 or 20 are 1.06 at breech. I would cut away the swamped muzzle making it about 36 inches.. let me hear your argument for which gauge-- 16 would require me getting a whole new set of fixings, but a 16 would allow the use of bigger buckshot which I would be prone to use for deer and coyote in certain close thickets... The barrel will be a general purpose buck, ball and shot gun.
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/0/1/COLE-FOWL-20

 

[tenngun]

People swear by thier choice of gage. I don't think a 12 or a 10 will do any thing a 20 won't do. 25 yards is about your range for a cylinder bore, a 20 killed turkey is as dead as a 12 killed. Still a boy with a 12 will see a 12 as the best choice. What do you want, that's the only thing that counts.

 

[md2020]

Well said-- my only thought is that .330 (OO) or .332 (O) buck would fit side by side in the .660 bore in criss-crossed tiers and provide better patterns when shooting Buckshot, and "fine shot" being of little significance,so the question remains, how will it shoot a roundball any different (trajectory, powder use, etc.) over the 20 gauge I'm used to.

 

[Stumpkiller]

The 16 would also finish up lighter as it is on the same blank as the 20 and more metal reamed away.

I'm a fan of the 16, but your needs may not be mine. I like a 60 yard deer gun, for 200 to 250 lb deer, for a couple weeks a year and a grouse gun with shot for five months a year. If I was more inclined to shooting single round ball and smaller deer I'd go smaller bore.

Note that the 16 uses a 0.650" one ounce ball. It hits with authority. Buckshot is not legal for deer in my state, so it's not a consideration for me.

Mine finished out at 7 lbs even with a 42" swamped barrel and it is a delight for hunting.

 

[Tinker2]

I have a Hopkins & Allen UnderHammer action””20 gage
Nice gun, serves me well for what I use it for.

As far as what gage”¦”¦. If you think you need or just want a larger gage, do it
The good news is it is easy to do.


Good luck
William Alexander

 

[md2020]

Stumpkiller what is the weight of the .650 or .648 ball? My .595 are around 300 grains..I killed a huge 10 point last year here in South Alabama(sorry to say with 6.5 Grendel)and he weighed 150 pounds on the dot..

 

[Grenadier1758]

There are some handy information in the Charts and tables section of the Reference part of the Forum. Look for the weight of pure lead balls. Claude has most of the normal sizes there.

To speed up the process a 0.648 pure lead ball will weigh 409 grains and the 0.650 ball will weigh 412 grains.

 

[BrownBear]

One thing to remember in your pondering:

Everyone talks max shot charges, but muzzleloaders work very, very well with lighter than standard shot loads. I frequently shoot 7/8 ounces in my 12 gauge, and it patterns more smoothly than a 7/8 oz charge in either of my 20's. I shoot charges as light as 1/2 oz in the 20's with terrific patterns too.

Read between the lines, and if you go with a larger gauge, it doesn't mean you have to use heavy shot charges too, unless you want.

 

[Rifleman1776]

My only smoothbore was a Pedersoli Brown Bess I built from a kit. It was an 11 ga. and I never knew it was any better/worse than other bore sizes. It was maybe the mostest funnest gun I have ever shot. But, when I tore up my shoulders something lighter was required and I eventually ended up with a 20 ga. fowler with a 31" barrel. Very light and handy. Haven't killed anything with it yet but stories are plentiful about them taking everything from quail to buffs. The choice is yers.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I hunted with a double 12 for 20 years with shot. Never shot PRBs from it. I found the same thing, that a lighter load of shot seemed to carry better and with a tighter group than heavy charges. Seemed strange being able to bring down game at slightly longer distances with less shot. I had a sixteen double with 40 inch barrels that could touch further than that 12 ever could. And with a very small amount of shot my 24 ga trade gun, just could not match the 16's reach. The 16 was just too cumbersome to swing for quick pass shooting.

 

[TNGhost]

There are reasons they call it the "sweet" 16.

 

[19 16 6]

Well you could select 12.
Personally I go 12.
Then of course there is the twelve or 12 gauge.
More choices of components. Not too little or too much.
In the right place to load up to something stout or down to equal the subs.
The most common shot gun is 12. Twelve ist gut ja.

Why ?
O.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

The question, refined, was use of buckshot and also single ball, with "fine shot" being of little significance, ...,

OK so given the same amount of powder, the heavier ball will exit slower from the 16 gauge, so the flight time is a fraction of a second longer. Thus the ball will drop as gravity has that extra fraction of a second to "pull down" on the ball. BUT you get more mass at impact...a trade-off, and on paper you get a tiny bit more recoil. At your normal shooting distance for deer, you may not notice anything different, nor any change in effective harvesting deer.

Say you do notice a change in impact on a target at the range, and don't like it. You can adjust sights, OR what lots of folks do is increase the powder to get the heavier ball moving at the same muzzle velocity as the previous load in the smaller gauge. So you get some extra recoil, but you deliver more mass in the way you expect, and really smack the deer.

As for buckshot, well some folks like to use the larger sized gauge and thus the larger sized buckshot. However, buckshot I've been taught, overloads the nervous system in an exponential manner (at least according to the US Army ME that I spoke with), to cause cardiac arrest in addition to the trauma of the actual pellets. So... I'd say use smaller buckshot in larger numbers in a larger gauge, and get more of the pellets into the deer, rather than trying to hit with the same amount of buckshot pellets in your previous load, though of a larger size.

LD

 

[nwtradegun]

I have owned 28,24,16, and now a 12 ga. smoothbore. the twelve is able to do any hunting I want. from mouse to moose. bear to bison if inclined. lighter weight. just shy of 7 pounds.

 

[md2020]

Ok-- all good answers! Then what about the issue of straight octagon to round as oppose to tapered??

 

[Stumpkiller]

Three things: balance, historical replication and appearance. And since appearance is entirely personal, historical replication only matters if you're purposely copying an era or style, so lets talk balance.

The tapered puts the least amount of weight forward.

My Colerain Griffin is octagonal to round and also swamped. That gives it the balance of full tapared. Some shooters like weight forward - putting more on the left hand (if you're right handed) and some like to have the center of inertia/rotation between the hands. The former gives you better follow through for pass shooting, likely steadier hold for offhand still shooring, and the latter gives you snappier handling for flushing birds.

It also has some relevance to your sight picture. Personally, I focus on the target and the barrel is in my low peripheral vision. I shoot a bare recurve bow and use the same method of "instinctive" shooting. I know the front sight is there but do not use it for elevation, just "windage". For moving game I pull up from behind them and shoot ahead of them, anyway, so the front blade is just in open airspace.

When I shoot ball I know the base of the front sight is about where the ball will hit at 50 yards. At 60 yards my whole front blade is "above" the deer and my master eye sees barrel. That would drive a pure iron-sight shooter nuts. But for an old field archer cheating and using the gap method that's just adjusting your point-on-aim for a longer target. If I put the tip of my arrow on the target at 65 yards I'm on (though I never shoot past 25 yards at deer with my bow).

With a tapered barrel it might be more normal for what we use when iron-sighting and a rifle shooter may like it better.

My 12 gauge New Englander has a slightly tapered barrel; but it is very short - 28". It's a snappy little bunny gun. Does pretty well with a single round ball but not as well as my 42" barrel. But then I'm pointing and not aiming so the longer barrel has a better chance of being properly aligned.

 

[md2020]

Thanks Stumpkiller-- I suppose if I cut away the swamped part ('cause i envision about a 34 to 36 inche barrel), I'll have to play around with the front sight height to get the natural pointing qualities......

 

[Stumpkiller]

Nah. If you're paying attention to the front sight that's "aiming" qualities. "Pointing" is like you do with your finger and is a conditioned muscle action that doesn't need sights. You can adjust the stock and train your muscles so you concentrate on the target and the alignment happens.

Zen and the art of shooting. ;-)

Mines just a little copper blade that's silver-soldered on. Works great when I am shooting ball and it shows up well in the woods. It's still way bigger than I need, but is what it 'tis.

Actually, I think since this image was taken I have draw filed it down some.

 

[Tinker2]

Ok-- all good answers! Then what about the issue of straight octagon to round as oppose to tapered??

For whatever its worth,
My underhammer smoothbore is just tapered round barrel from Numrich gunparts corp
28 inches long. Built strictly for shooting trap.



I look forward to whatever you do
William Alexander

 

[tenngun]

Ok-- all good answers! Then what about the issue of straight octagon to round as oppose to tapered??

Straight or tapered octagon were called smooth rifles or rifle mounted fusils. A true fusil, or fowling gun will in general be lighter and planer then a smooth rifle that in general will be a bulkier and more one-of-a-kind arm. It gives you a chance to go with cheek plate patch box ingraving and a more fancy look. This is on a common guys arm. Rich boys had some very fancy fusils. Rifle or fusil in a plane Jane guy my self, but you can turn out a real show stopper of a smooth rifle.