Thoughts on long-barreled smoothbores

[ReeveM]

Many years ago here I started advocating 1Fg powdah in my long barreled (65-cal of 54" and 75-cal of 60") smoothies and the results are nothing short of fantastic! So much so that I started using 1Fg loads in my 62-cal 48" club butt fowler.

Go long or go home! This is that 75-caliber club butt of 60” barrel in a tiger-striped stock, and yet it is incredibly light due to the custom Greg Christiansen highly tapered barrel, weighing less than 8-pounds. It handles like a dream and points extremely well. She will shoot paper cartridge roundball loads (no cloth patch, no wads, nada … ) into some really tight groups, like 3-4” groups or better from the sitting position @ 50-yards, using 100-grain 1Fg (due to the looooong barrel length). I once came in 2nd place to a rifle in a local woodswalk using her, but I broke a few of their gong/metal targets, so they kindly asked me not to bring this one back again, LOL!

Everyone who picks this one up is very surprised ... and leaves very impressed at how well it handles! But note I don't use it for wing shootin' ...

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Who made your rifle?! I’m 100% in the market for something longer than 42 inches and so far have been failing to find anything.

 

[godutch]

I know this is a older thread, but where did you find your top rifle? I am trying to make a Afghan style Jezail or Moroccan Moukala but i cant find either A. the right stock or B. the barrel length I like

My long smoothbore bbls. came form Ben Coogle back in the 90's. Ben's since retired some years back so that's a dead end sorry to say.

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

Who made your rifle?! I’m 100% in the market for something longer than 42 inches and so far have been failing to find anything.

Jackie Brown made it.

FWIW most early fowler arms were 44" or longer but years ago barrel makers kind of settled on 42" as a standard length as for lengths above that, extra shipping charges were incurred. So to me (and the experts that taught me that) the prevalence of 42" barrels in our replicas is actually an artifical occurrence ...

 

[Compressorguy]

I recently bought a used 20ga/.62 Jim Chambers smoothbore rifle that was built 20 plus years ago by someone apparently very knowledgeable. It’s only 6.8lbs and carries and points effortlessly. It has a 46” barrel and I absolutely love it. AFAIK, he still offers this kit. Originally, I admit being put off hearing how long it was but once I saw it, handled it, shot and hunted (dove) with it, it’s hands down my most favorite arm and the length is of no consequence. Everything else just looks short now, lol!

 

[Hussar64]

I recently bought a used 20ga/.62 Jim Chambers smoothbore rifle that was built 20 plus years ago by someone apparently very knowledgeable. It’s only 6.8lbs and carries and points effortlessly. It has a 46” barrel and I absolutely love it. AFAIK, he still offers this kit. Originally, I admit being put off hearing how long it was but once I saw it, handled it, shot and hunted (dove) with it, it’s hands down my most favorite arm and the length is of no consequence. Everything else just looks short now, lol!
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I have the Pennsylvania Fowler that he offers that was also put together 20+ years ago, by Chuck Edward's.
It's been a great gun! However it seems to prefer 3f; tried 2f a few weeks ago, and the results were, simply put, unacceptable.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Hudson Valley Fowling gun. 72" barrel by Coogle, 11 bore. These were made for shooting waterfowl sitting on the water. Used as a market gun and for putting lots of ducks on the table at home. This particular gun is a doglock.

 

[godutch]

Hudson Valley Fowling gun. 72" barrel by Coogle, 11 bore. These were made for shooting waterfowl sitting on the water. Used as a market gun and for putting lots of ducks on the table at home. This particular gun is a doglock.

Yikes ! Now that's a long HVF! 'Love it.

 

[Rifleman1776]

in Central Europe the jagear rifle was invented between 1600 and 1650. Some of these had long barrels but two and a half was common.

True, but really cannot be compared to needs of American hunters. In most of western Europe the winter nights are not very dark. Because of government regulation hunters are restricted to a relatively small bit of acreage from which they may hunt. And, hunting season is just that, anything is legal, deer, hogs, squirrels, birds, etc. The hunters almost exclusively used tree stands for hunting and did not lug their (very heavy) Jaegers around. American needs were/are quite different, we like to carry our guns while hunting and hiking.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Why on earth do so many of pre-1860 firearms have barrels in excess of 40 inches? I would think all that barrel length would have a negative impact on portability....especially dense woods such as I'm familiar with in the PacNorWest.

I agree. My experience is that 42" is the max a rifle or shotty can be carried comfortably in the woods or even in the open. IMHO, super long barrels are useless novelties.

 

[SlidePicker]

A long barreled gun is handy for a tall man to load while standing up straight. A short one makes you hunker over, and it's easier to accidentally point at yourself.

 

[SlidePicker]

And for muskets, a long gun has a longer reach with a bayonet.

 

[bud in pa]

Was a step ladder included with the gun so you could load it?

 

[tenngun]

True, but really cannot be compared to needs of American hunters. In most of western Europe the winter nights are not very dark. Because of government regulation hunters are restricted to a relatively small bit of acreage from which they may hunt. And, hunting season is just that, anything is legal, deer, hogs, squirrels, birds, etc. The hunters almost exclusively used tree stands for hunting and did not lug their (very heavy) Jaegers around. American needs were/are quite different, we like to carry our guns while hunting and hiking.

Yeah but one can look at early American long rifles, that were just as beefy as jaegers and had that long barrel.
As the American rifle developed long stayed in style till early in the nineteenth century, and ‘full sized rifles’ continued to be the norm for SMR, even so they became, sometime, feather light.
Even the Ohio style light rifle was not uncommon to have long barrels

 

[SlidePicker]

Until Halloween, there is a very good exhibit on "The Long Rifle In Virginia" at the William King Museum of Art in Abingdon, Virginia. I was surprised at the large bores and heavy barrels many of them have. They're late 1700s-early 1800s, mostly early in that range.
https://www.williamkingmuseum.org/exhibit/the-long-rifle/

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Yeah but one can look at early American long rifles, that were just as beefy as jaegers and had that long barrel.
As the American rifle developed long stayed in style till early in the nineteenth century, and ‘full sized rifles’ continued to be the norm for SMR, even so they became, sometime, feather light.
Even the Ohio style light rifle was not uncommon to have long barrels

Jeagers weren't "beefy". Go handle some originals. Contemporary builders completely miss 18th century German rifle architecture. Also, many "SMR's" are exceptionally heavy. I have handled many and guns in the 11–14-pound range are not uncommon. Again, go handle some originals.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Was a step ladder included with the gun so you could load it?

Obviously, you have never loaded a long barreled gun. You set the butt on the ground, grasp the gun around 6" from the muzzle and then step away from where the buttstock is grounded until the muzzle is at the level you want to load at. I can also load a gun with a 48" barrel sitting down in a canoe.

 

[tenngun]

Jeagers weren't "beefy". Go handle some originals. Contemporary builders completely miss 18th century German rifle architecture. Also, many "SMR's" are exceptionally heavy. I have handled many and guns in the 11–14-pound range are not uncommon. Again, go handle some originals.

I think you missed what I was saying. Jeagers were thicker in stock then later American lighter rifles, and yes some SMR were a lot heavier then jeagers a century before.
Rifleman was stating Americans wanted lighter rifle then jeagers, but that doesn’t seem to match to longer barrels that became a feature of American guns. And we see some light SMR, and heavy too) and a continued use of long barrels
Certainly the Christian Springs rifle of the walking purchase fame was a beefier rifle then the feather weight Vincent. In between these two guns we see barrels getting longer. Then even short barreled rifles of westren fame could have a bit high BMI

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Most Jeagers are far lighter than any colonial american rifle. Large bored short barrels = light guns. Have you ever handled an original Jeager? The Chrisian Springs rifle was big because of the barrel diameter and the size of the buttplate.

 

[toot]

Hudson Valley Fowling gun. 72" barrel by Coogle, 11 bore. These were made for shooting waterfowl sitting on the water. Used as a market gun and for putting lots of ducks on the table at home. This particular gun is a doglock.

WOW, WOW, now that is a REAL GUN!! it will certainly burn up all of the powder in the bore / barrel!!

 

[toot]

where is your gun barer to rest it on his shoulder when firing it? my GOD that is a real beauty. thanks for sharing it.