Too many Does?

[TexasMLer]

I went hunting this weekend and saw more Does than I usually see, which is A LOT! As I pulled into the gate on our property, a group of 8 or so does ran off. When I started off down the trail toward the location that I wanted to hunt, I scared off another large group of does. I was coverd with does the entire time. It was fun to see them and I got a few good pictures of them, but I would still like to see more bucks. I didn't see any bucks at all this weekend. I usually see at least one button or a spike and I sometimes see a buck with a good rack.

There seems to be a big push by the Parks and Wildlife Dept. to decrease the doe population here in my area, and until this year, I didn't believe that it was necessary.
It just doesn't feel right to me to kill does at the rate that the TPWD are recommending this year. It seems to me that the more does an area has, the more fawns will be born, which in turn should produce more bucks. Am I way off on this one? What are your thoughts?

By the way, I would much rather have a doe in the freezer than a buck. It is just rather difficult to change my thinking after being taught the opposite philosophy all my life by my dad/grandfather/great-grandfather and, ironically, by the TPWD (It was illegal all of my life to take a doe without a permit until recently.).

 

[leadball]

If possible, I prefer to take a doe over a buck. The first thing all hunters are is conservationists. Think about this, one doe has 2 fawns lets say, one of those fawns is a doe, she has 2 and the same year her mother has two more. That goes on and on. One buck can mate with several does(lucky guy :. We have a doe only season in Wisc. and i participate and even took one this year. During our regular season we can take either sex and i plan on taking a doe. so yes, for the sake of healthy deer populations, take a doe. its a win win. You get great venison and the herd gets one less breeder overpopulating. We can get some very harsh winters and too many deer held over from the fall can be devastating to the herd. :m2c:

 

[Bob J]

I hunted on a 9,800 acre lease in east central Fla. growing up that did not allow the harvesting of does. Saw HERDS of does, not many bucks. Then we joined a 4,000 acre lease that had wildlife MANAGEMENT; we were allowed 1 trophy buck (4 point or bigger), 2 spikes, and 3 does per yr. MUCH BETTER buck-to-doe ratio.

Today I belong to The Quality Whitetail Management Association and read their publication. The recurring theme is that you need to harvest does AND LET YOUNG BUCKS WALK to grow a population of bucks with decent racks. If you want big bucks in an area, hunt does and big bucks. :m2c:

 

[Keith]

All though a buck can breed many does it isn't neccesarily a good thing to count on. What I mean is if the buck doe ratio is way off favoring too many does the bucks get run ragged. I want to say off the top of my head a natural ratio is one buck to three or four does, don't quote me I might be off by quite a bit. Someplaces have buck doe ratios of 1:15 or 20. The bucks expend a lot of energy trying to breed all those does. In a place with harsh winters they can enter winter in such poor shape they don't make it. Not much of a problem in Texas I know. Fewer bucks also shallows the gene pool, because fewer different individuals are breeding.

 

[mornard]

TexasMLer...

I din't understand it until a biologist exlained it to me this way. The land can carry only so many deer. The more does, the less room for bucks re: food supply, etc. The answer is to shoot as many does as you can, and leave the small bucks to grow. This is why MN and WI - both great deer states, are letting you shoot 5 does in most areas.

 

Leaving does will not nessecarily increase the buck population to a great amount. I read a study years ago in which the researchers found that when feed is abundant and of high quality, deer will give birth to a higher percentage of doe fawns. When feed is short or of poor quality, the birth rate swings in favor of buck fawns. Kind of natures way of regulating population increase rates based on feed supplies. I've never shot females with the exception of bears. A little harder to tell from a distance. So, if you shoot a doe, when you cook it do you get bread :: :hmm: :hmm: I wonder...

 

[pharmvet]

We established a deer management program in one area of our county. We have approx 40-50 landowners and approx. 16000 acres under the same "general" mgt plan. As some have already stated, the general gist of our program is to shoot does and big bucks. We let the little bucks walk. I have been hunting the same 340 acres for 15 years and can see a "definate" improvement since we implemented the program 5 years ago. In the last 4 years we have taken the best 4 bucks killed on the place in the past 15 years. We average taking 1 or 2 bucks and about 4 doe each year. I grew up in a county and a family that did not tolerate doe killing. Since then times have changed and Mgt. theories have changed. It was hard to get used to killing does and some of the old timers around here still cant get used to it. I have finally gotten out of the "macho" mind set that says you have to kill a buck. We try to take our doe with archery / muzzleloader just for sport, but if we cant we will pull out the old .270 and get the job done. We also record dressed wts, lactation rates, antler measures and collect jaw bones from all deer killed. This has been eye opening to me. If I have come away from this thing with one good lesson it is this. "Every big deer we killed - with no exceptions, has been at least 3 years old. What this tells us is that there is really no secret in getting big bucks, they simply have to get some age on them, and if they are killed as 1,or 2 year old 4,6 or 8 pts, they will never be what your are looking for. Oh well, better quit now. I just get passionate about this stuff.

 

[Huntinfool]

I've never shot females with the exception of bears. A little harder to tell from a distance. So, if you shoot a doe, when you cook it do you get bread :: :hmm: :hmm: I wonder...

Down in these parts a lot of bucks get killed before their time. The average hunter will shoot the first antlered deer he sees usually a spike or a forkhorn.

Here lately they've made the season more liberal by allowing anterless deer to be taken during the 2 week traditional bucks only firearms season. It's a different game down in these parts Cody.

I try to take a few doe for my meat supply and only larger bucks but the next guy might shoot the little bucks as well.

Someplaces there are 20 to 25 doe for every buck so they do need thinned down.

Chuck

 

[Slamfire]

If there are too many doe for the mature bucks to breed, then the other bucks will. Even the ones that ought to be culled, like the 7 1/2 year old forky taken in my county this year. Imagine those genes in your heard. :imo:

 

[TexasMLer]

Good points all.

I do agree now that taking does is important for a good buck-to-doe ratio. I have no choice but to agree, because everything I hear about the matter, and everything I read backs-up what you guys have said. I have no data to counter the point.

It still feels weird, though. Oh well, I'm sure a freezer full of tender doe meat will help me get over it. :haha:

Thanks for helping me with this one.

 

[KyFlintlock]

I agree that they are great eating. When I first started deer hunting I didn't shoot does, nobody did. After a while we realized that we needed to kill at least as many does as bucks, but probably 2 for 1. It helps take the pressure off too, so I don't shoot a dink and regret it later [wink].

Here is one my son and I still hunted up on while we were hunting on Saturday.

Had some grilled backstrap yesterday and it was dang good.

Good luck if'n you get out.

 

[Huntinfool]

Congrats KyFlintlock,
:redthumb:
I can't make out if it's a buck or a doe from that pic. shadow is covering the head or something!

Chuck

 

[Plains99]

In our Kansas unit I will take one buck and four does this season. This will be my third season doing such because they are overruning our farm. It seems to have no effect on the local population. Doe management is critical to a healthy deer herd. Does are good eating and fun hunting. You owe it to the deer herd to take those does. We all need to change our minds on this issue. It is nice to have that big buck on the wall but a healthy herd is nicer. Over population will drive our deer herds into sickness and increase the likelihood of some devastating plague. We must and should take those does.

 

[Huntinfool]

Here, Here, I agree with ya Plains99 100%.
Chuck :thumbsup: :redthumb: