Uberti Cattlemans Carbine ?
- Thread starter KyBill
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45 Cal.
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I'm not familiar with that particular gun. However most 44 Cals use a .454 round ball. Some shooters use wads some don't. A lot is trial and error to see what works well for your gun.
no patches for one.
You will want to get some .454 round balls. They should shave just the right amount of lead to ensure a good seal.
15-25 grains of 3f should be a good load. Some filler to bring the ball closer to the barrel. And some form of greese to seal the cylender. I imagine you already have percussion caps.
I would sugest going to youtube and watching some videos of guys loading/shooting BP revolvers.
Oh and I am tottaly jealous. I have wanted one of those for years.
You will want to get some .454 round balls. They should shave just the right amount of lead to ensure a good seal.
15-25 grains of 3f should be a good load. Some filler to bring the ball closer to the barrel. And some form of greese to seal the cylender. I imagine you already have percussion caps.
I would sugest going to youtube and watching some videos of guys loading/shooting BP revolvers.
Oh and I am tottaly jealous. I have wanted one of those for years.
Patches are not used with a Cap & ball pistol.
You will need some .454 or .457 diameter lead roundballs which are loaded directly into the chambers after the powder charge is poured.
The loading lever will force the ram against the ball and push it down into the chamber.
It is important that a thin ring of lead is sheared off of the outside of the ball when this is done.
This assures the tight fit of the ball in the chamber to keep the ball from backing out due to recoil when another chamber is fired.
The tight fit also prevents flames from the discharging chamber from getting into the adjacent chambers and creating a "chain fire".
The percussion caps must fit snugly on the nipples, also to prevent their loss and to keep the flames from the discharging chamber from getting to the powder in the other chambers.
Powder loads can vary but either real black powder or a synthetic powder can be used.
The load can be between 22 and 30 grains.
When you shoot your carbine keep your free hand behind the cylinder.
Flames and lead will come out of both sides of the gun in that area.
There are hundreds of posts on the forum dealing with loading and shooting the Remington 1858 that your gun is based on.
The suggestions in those posts will apply to your gun as well as the one being discussed.
Have Fun! :grin:
For those who don't know the "Cattlemans Carbine" is a long barrel Remington 1858 with a shoulder stock where the normal grip would be.
You will need some .454 or .457 diameter lead roundballs which are loaded directly into the chambers after the powder charge is poured.
The loading lever will force the ram against the ball and push it down into the chamber.
It is important that a thin ring of lead is sheared off of the outside of the ball when this is done.
This assures the tight fit of the ball in the chamber to keep the ball from backing out due to recoil when another chamber is fired.
The tight fit also prevents flames from the discharging chamber from getting into the adjacent chambers and creating a "chain fire".
The percussion caps must fit snugly on the nipples, also to prevent their loss and to keep the flames from the discharging chamber from getting to the powder in the other chambers.
Powder loads can vary but either real black powder or a synthetic powder can be used.
The load can be between 22 and 30 grains.
When you shoot your carbine keep your free hand behind the cylinder.
Flames and lead will come out of both sides of the gun in that area.
There are hundreds of posts on the forum dealing with loading and shooting the Remington 1858 that your gun is based on.
The suggestions in those posts will apply to your gun as well as the one being discussed.
Have Fun! :grin:
For those who don't know the "Cattlemans Carbine" is a long barrel Remington 1858 with a shoulder stock where the normal grip would be.
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No patches is OK, but may I use the lubed wads I've been using for 20+ years? :idunno:
been reading the forums . the 1858 should help watched some U-tube also they are useing are felt wad also . (powder/filler/wad/ball) Filler? was to bring the ball closer to the end of the cylinder and stop cross fires.(powder/wad/ball/crisco) crisco or bear grease to seal the cylinder .Just what did they do in 1858 ? they were not sitting in a controlled environment.
Lube wads are another product invented by moderns to sell to people.
44 perc. revolvers use 45 caliber balls
Use enough powder to allow the ball to be seated with slight compression of the powder.
Grease over the balls with something like SPG Bullet Lube (developed for BPCR competition but is near perfect for this too ).
The Lube will help keep the fouling soft at the cylinder face.
I would use Blackpowder. No "substitutes". It works better.
I would advise that you not place any part of your anatomy forward of the the cylinder while firing. There was a reason these never caught on though they were tried right into the cartridge era see the "unsucessful" S&W 320 revolving rifle.
There is even a modern version being made in 45 Colt/410 by Taurus. This one has a flash guard to protect the shooter from powder gas etc exiting at the cyl. gap
Dan
44 perc. revolvers use 45 caliber balls
Use enough powder to allow the ball to be seated with slight compression of the powder.
Grease over the balls with something like SPG Bullet Lube (developed for BPCR competition but is near perfect for this too ).
The Lube will help keep the fouling soft at the cylinder face.
I would use Blackpowder. No "substitutes". It works better.
I would advise that you not place any part of your anatomy forward of the the cylinder while firing. There was a reason these never caught on though they were tried right into the cartridge era see the "unsucessful" S&W 320 revolving rifle.
There is even a modern version being made in 45 Colt/410 by Taurus. This one has a flash guard to protect the shooter from powder gas etc exiting at the cyl. gap
Dan
In 1858 they didn't have the gun because it wasn't made until 1861.Ky Bill said:
The revolver your gun is based on is called a 1858 because that is the Patent date.
As far as we know, the people back in those days loaded their pistols with a full powder load with the ball directly on it.
According to the Colt loading instructions that came with his cap and ball pistols, no mention of a wad or of grease over the ball was made.
Yes, a lot of shooters like using greased wads under the ball to help reduce the chance of a chain fire and to keep the ball closer to the face of the cylinder but, in my opinion these are not really needed and they do add to the cost of shooting the gun.
For right now, I suggest that you just use the (powder, ball, grease) method and enjoy your gun.
When you get to the point that your trying to put all of the shots thru one hole, then worry about fillers and wads. :thumbsup:
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OK, I can see that I don't have a few thousand posts on this forum, like some of you. truth to be told though I had my first gun 49 years ago and my first black powder gun 45 years ago.
I know when wads came into the scene and know that I like them more than Crisco or some other grease in front of my balls. A few of you guys need to quit talking down at others on here. :idunno:
I know when wads came into the scene and know that I like them more than Crisco or some other grease in front of my balls. A few of you guys need to quit talking down at others on here. :idunno:
I havent used wads think may be a good ideal they have used them in shotguns for a hundred years there must be something to them.been reading some use a dry wad followed by a lubed one.U-tube shows a lot of revolver loads with Lubed wads.1 guy just put bore butter on the ball side Dealers choice i guess.I will find what works for me/ :stir:
There were a certain amount of different models of the Colt "carbine" and some date back to the Patterson NJ plant. These very early Colt carbines had a top strap so the idea of a top strap was used by Colt and didn't originate with Remington. Some of the early Colt carbines used barrels made by J.J. Henry (Bolton, PA) and I believe they were sold to the U.S. Government. My memory is slipping on some of this but I think some of those early Colts also had a wood fore-stock that was later omitted. Check out the Henrys of Bolton Booklet sold by the Jacobsburg Historical Society.
BTW, I lived for awhile in the Hartford, Connecticut area. Colt factory doesn't have a museum, all the old Colts are about a mile away in the State Museum but the last time I was there the collection was extensive and anyone interested in the subject would be well advised to contact the museum.
On the wads- sort of a gray area IMHO. Elmer Keith in his book SIXGUNS speaks about learning to shoot a Navy 36 that he used on rabbits, etc. This was when he was still a kid in Missouri and the old timers that taught him how to load up were Confederate veterans. He used wads cut from an old felt hat but the "gray area" is whether he figured this out on his own or the old Confederate veterans told him and if the later- was that something they recently started doing or were they using wads as far back as the Civil War? It's probably safe to figure wads were being used in at least a few areas in the 1890's or so.
BTW, I lived for awhile in the Hartford, Connecticut area. Colt factory doesn't have a museum, all the old Colts are about a mile away in the State Museum but the last time I was there the collection was extensive and anyone interested in the subject would be well advised to contact the museum.
On the wads- sort of a gray area IMHO. Elmer Keith in his book SIXGUNS speaks about learning to shoot a Navy 36 that he used on rabbits, etc. This was when he was still a kid in Missouri and the old timers that taught him how to load up were Confederate veterans. He used wads cut from an old felt hat but the "gray area" is whether he figured this out on his own or the old Confederate veterans told him and if the later- was that something they recently started doing or were they using wads as far back as the Civil War? It's probably safe to figure wads were being used in at least a few areas in the 1890's or so.
Have not even thought of wads being used in the 1800s . Thought it was a more modern ideal to stop crossfires instead of sealing the loaded cylinder with a lube .and it gets messy , melts and spatters the adjoining rounds.Have to wipe down before loading again.
Well, as I said, not more should be read into what I posted than that Keith says he was using them as a youngster. In any event it seems they were used long before the modern replica era (1950's-1960's) got started but it pays to keep an open mind on such things.
On the ring of lead... there is some contention that a pure lead ball rammed in under obvious pressure but doesn't leave a ring of lead will still oburate to the chamber, so the ring of lead isn't needed as long as the ball requires some force to ram into the chamber.
The proof is in the pudding so what say others.
On the ring of lead... there is some contention that a pure lead ball rammed in under obvious pressure but doesn't leave a ring of lead will still oburate to the chamber, so the ring of lead isn't needed as long as the ball requires some force to ram into the chamber.
The proof is in the pudding so what say others.
