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unfinished kit rifle cva .45 kentucky

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east texas

45 Cal.
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Apr 1, 2011
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i just picked up an old unfinished .45 cal kentucky kit rifle it is an old cva kit with the jukar barrell 50 bucks and not screwed up too bad.put the calipers to the barrell and it looks like 440rb and 10 patch ought to do it, does anyone know how i could date it from the serial number and find out the rate of twist? thanx in advance mike
 
Mike,
Don't know about dating it but the rate of twist is probably 1:48". Put a tight patch on the ramrod with cleaning jag in place and run it all the way down. Put a piece of masking tape around the rod even with the end of the barrel and mark it in line with the front sight. Consider that mark to be at 12 o'clock. Now withdraw the rod and allow it to rotate with the rifling until the mark reaches the 3 o'clock position. Measure from the muzzle to the edge of the tape and multiply that number by 4. That's your rate of twist.

John
 
I have 2 old Jukars and they have a 1 in 60 twist. With the .440 rb's I use .015 or .018 patching.
 
thanx john thats a real neat formula i have one of these kit rifles from traditions it came with a 1-66 and is 50 cal this cva looks exactly like the traditions only in 45 cal i was trying to determine if it would make a goood sabot gun for deer
 
The CVA 45 kits that I have worked on with the Jukar barrels had a 1/66 twist and were very accurate barrels. The old cva locks need polishing and usuallly rehardened on the sear and tumbler. But they have accounted for many deer as well as winning many target shoots. My boy's likes a 445 ball and ten thousands patch, or 40 ball and 15 thousands patch. Over 45 grain FFF target and 65 FFF grain deer loads.
 
Welcome to the Forum. :)

Most of the old CVA rifles that have Jukar marked on them were made back in the 1970's.

They were made by Ardesa in Spain and unlike the Italian guns which mark a date code when their proofed the Spanish guns have no date markings.
That makes guessing the age of your rifle just about impossible except to say it is probably between 30 and 40 years old.

Back in those days there was little if any thought given to shooting elongated bullets from these guns so the rifling is usually too slow for anything over 220 grains.

As we don't talk about the modern plastic stuff here on the forum we can still talk about lead slugs or patched roundballs.

Don't be fooled by a patched .440 diameter roundballs 128 grain weight. They are quite capable of taking deer sized game as long as the range is kept under about 80 yards.

With a 60 grain 3Fg powder load they will have a muzzle velocity of around 1720 ft/sec and unless they hit bone they will often pass completely thru a deer.

Because the .45 caliber guns start to develop some pretty high breech pressures with the larger powder loads I don't recommend going over 90 grains max. (16,200 psi breech pressure), but a 80 grain powder load of 3Fg will give a muzzle velocity of around 1770 fps with a patched roundball.

As with all muzzleloaders, accuracy is the key ingredient to a successful hunt.
Many people find that the maximum powder loads are not as accurate as the smaller loads but each gun is different. Some guns like the heavier powder loads so the only way to find out what yours likes it to shoot it for accuracy changing the powder load (and the target) every 5 shots.

By the way, many of those Spanish guns have very accurate barrels on them.

Have fun. :)
 
thanx zonie that is quite a bit of good info on this jukar ive never used those plastic things yet i was wondering about the rifles design as some of the rifles twist were made for them and not too accurate with the prb i have the 50 kentucky and used it last year to tag out and filled the freezer ! it came with 1-66 and advertised as the magic twist for prb and it is indeed very accurate out to about 80-90 yrds might even be better if these #%^&$@! old eyes of mine could actually focus on the sights and target at the same time! i know the prb has more knockdown power as ive been lucky enough or maybe skilled enough to not have had to track any wounded game yet but it also might be the fact to only take the right shot!! thanx for the reply and the info on the muzzle velocity mike
 
I have one and it's a shooter won many rondys with it. now my wife shoots it. my load is a cast .440 ball a .012 cotten patch lubed with olive oil and 60 grains of FFg goex or 777. fond mine also likes 40 grains of FFFg 777. shoots spot on!
 
i have two cva .45's. my percussion is 1-66 twist, but my flintlock has a very fast twist of about 1-13 (the ramrod makes a full 2 1/2 turns from muzzle to breech.) both will shoot round ball very accurately, but the flinter will also throw a 285 grain buffalo bullet quite nicely :wink: they're great little guns. enjoy :thumbsup:
 
I cut them to size then put them in my tin I have. then I sprinkle a little oil in close the lid then shake then. you just want them damp. if I need more I add some more. works great.
 
My first ML was a CVA factory-finished percussion Kentucky that I bought at a gun show for $75.00 around 1990. It is a JUKAR with a serial number but I have never tried to date it. It was new-old-stock and had never been fired.

I have killed 3 deer near Junction, Texas with this rifle and all 3 were 1 shot stops; 1 head shot at about 45 yards with entry and exit wounds, 1 at about 75 yards broadside with entry and exit wounds, and 1 hit broadside at about 85 yards that nicked a rib,, went almost straight up along / following the rib and broke the spine from the under side up.

After several sessions at the range I filed the front sights for 75 - 100 yards and learned the best load for both hunting and target shooting is 70 grains of FFFg with a patched .440 round ball and .15 cotton pre-lubed patch.

FFFg powder is the granulation that was initially recommended to me and that is what I have always used. The ML pistols I have shot use the same granulation.

I have experimented with R.E.A.L. bullets, powder charges of anywhere from 45 to 70 grains of FFFg (I always use GOEX) but this weapon prefers the aforementioned hunting/target load above. I settled on this load with the groups it produced at 75-100 yards, set the sights at this distance, and thereafter have measured all other variables using Kentucky windage from there.

I can sometimes get away with using a 60-65 grain charge of the same powder but then again I have shot this weapon enough that I know the right amount of Kentucky windage to use to compensate for that particular variable.

As for patch and percussion cap variations I have noticed no difference(s) whatsoever with using different brands of percussion caps. This weapon does not like .10-.12 cotton patches. Regardless of the powder charges I have experimented with I have always suffered blow-by and cuts using patches thinner than .15, thus it seems the thinner patches have almost always produced 1st. and 2nd. shots being somewhat erratic until the bore is fouled by the 4th. or 5th. shot. Again, after shooting this particular rifle many, many times I've settled on the .15 patch being the minimum thickness for consistent accuracy.

I prefer to swab the bore clean after the 3rd. shot using the load above, and I have to swab after the 5th. shot or the ball will be too stubborn to load and will suffer significant deformity if I push it beyond 5 shots.

Due to the problems I’ve encountered when using the .10-.12 patches, this weapon cannot use the .445 round ball for the same basic reasons. The thinner patches still get cut and the .445 ball is too tight to load.

I have been to one (and unfortunately one only, to date) shooting match here in Texas hosted by the Red River Renegades (Wichita Falls, Texas ... VERY NICE FOLKS THERE) back in 2000. I came home after the match with nine (9) medals won by this weapon.

I have thoroughly enjoyed this rifle and have never felt that I needed more than what it offered. I made a point to apply myself right after the purchase and "learned" this particular weapon, testing and experimenting with every variable I could think of. I think that is the key here, as with most firearms, it pays to "know" your weapon as each one shoots a little differently even if they are "mass-produced".

Go buy some FFFg powder, .440 round balls, .15 cotton pre-lubed patches, and some percussion caps along with some cleaning patches, cleaning jag(s), and bore cleaner and go shooting. Take your time, go slow, and enjoy yourself!

I hope this all helps point you in the right direction. If you have any further questions, by all means please ask! :thumbsup:
 
thanx thats quite a lot of good info and very heartening news all i have left to do is the front sight , and find the right size balls and patches for this one. most of the shots here in the pineywoods never exceed 75-85 yds. i hope to do well this season with the new 45 the fifty put seven in the freezer last winter still eatin backstrap!! :grin:
 
I love hunting in the Piney woods. That's where a lot my family is from (San Augstine county). If you run across a place for an extra hunter please let me know, as I've had a hard time finding a good place these past several years. :hatsoff:
 
ok ill keep my eyes peeled are you free to hunt during weekdays? im in houston county outside of crockett the county next door!
 
I got one much the same way, semi-finished. I cut it down to half stock, shortened the barrel did a little carving on the stock and installed a capbox. It's very light and quick and a tack driver.
 
I got one last week still in the plastic wrapped box. That is except for the termites. It's the flintlock. Deer Creek is sending wood fore arm the rest was ok only has some pitting on the outside of the barrel just love those termites. They will give it a little carricture called random etching on barrel. Going to be a fun project. I've never seen of heard on one of these guns that was not a shooter.
Fox :thumbsup:
 
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[/img] Full buckhorn rear sight, brass blade front sight.
 
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