wats a preflintlock?

[muzzman]

i was wonderin what a pre flintlock is?Wats diferent about it then a flint lock?

 

Good Lord you're going to get them started again!!!

:crackup:

They'll be all the way back to twelve hundred-whatever and counting foreward slowly!!!

 

[robinghewitt]

There's a list under the pre-flintlock heading.

wats a preflintlock? wats a conical? Obviously a man of few words, I can appreciate that :huh:

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Any type of gun that pre-dates the flintlock mechanism: Snaphaunce, miquelet, wheellock, matchlock, arquebus, handgonne (basically just a barrel on a primitive stock with no type of lock mechanism, or maybe just a simple serpentine), cannons, mortars, etc. Take a look at Teleoceras' website for some good examples of the early stuff:

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/1945/Guns/BP.htm

 

[benvenuto]

don't forget the snaplock, the segment lock, and the rasp lock

 

[musketman]

i was wonderin what a pre flintlock is?Wats diferent about it then a flint lock?

Any muzzleloader design prior to the flintlock falls into this section...

 

[muzzman]

okdoky i gota learn somehow

 

[Teleoceras]

Squrrielsarus Rex:

Any type of gun that pre-dates the flintlock mechanism: Snaphaunce, miquelet, wheellock, matchlock, arquebus, handgonne (basically just a barrel on a primitive stock with no type of lock mechanism, or maybe just a simple serpentine), cannons, mortars, etc.

Don't forget the English Lock! It pre-dated the Flintlock by about a decade or two.

Ahhhh....Just give me some burning slowmatch on a linstock, a tube at the end of a stick, and let the fun begin! :: :imo:

Merry Christmas!

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Don't forget the English Lock! It pre-dated the Flintlock by about a decade or two.

I was just giving him a few examples, by no means is that little list all-inclusive. There were probably a few other oddball contraptions that never made it into the modern historical records.

Ahhhh....Just give me some burning slowmatch on a linstock, a tube at the end of a stick, and let the fun begin! :: :imo:

Merry Christmas!

Pyromaniac. :nono: ::

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

okdoky i gota learn somehow

You're in the right place! Post any questions you have, there won't be any shortage of answers. :thumbsup:

 

[Leonredbeard]

Ok Bienvenuto,
I am almost afraid to ask. What is a rasp lock? I don't know if I can handle this.
God bless.
volatpluvia

 

[Teleoceras]

volatpluvia:

Ok Bienvenuto,
I am almost afraid to ask. What is a rasp lock? I don't know if I can handle this.

If it is what I think it is, then this is the lock that was found on the Monk's Gun. You could say that this would eventually lead to the Wheellock. :imo:

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Anyone got a picture (and maybe a little background info) on a monk's gun? Never heard of it.

And what's a segment lock?

 

[Wes/Tex]

Monk's gun wouldn't be a Holy Water pistol would it? I'm going to blame all this on having the flu for Christmas!!

-----------------------------------------------
Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati :blah:

 

[benvenuto]

Yes, the lock found on the monks gun and one or two cannons /wallguns from south germany
basically you have a dog with a piece of pyrites in it, but instead of a wheel spinning, you manually pull a straight rasp past it (towards you) to make a shower of sparks fall into the pan.

A segment lock is similar to a wheel lock, except you only have a 90 degree segment of the wheel and generally you cock it by hand instead of winding it with a key. They are pretty rare

I'll try and scan some pics...
Have been pretty hung over lately with all these holidays

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

I've been doing some searching but haven't been able to find any info. What time period would these two guns be from? Do you know of any sources of online information about them?

 

[benvenuto]

Haven't seen anything online.
monks gun is from 1480-1520 depending on who's doing the telling. The only ID on the piece is the letter "i" carved in a ring around the muzzle several times (short for iesus?)

segment lock is a late development of the wheelock, from around 1640-1680. They didn't catch on...

 

[benvenuto]

Another unusual lock, although not strictly in the catergory of wheellocks can be mentioned here as there is at least, a resemblance between the two. This was the segment lock, in which the wheel was replaced by a pivoted segment of steel. No key was necessary with this lock as the segment was simply pulled back until it was held against the pressure of the mainspring by the sear. The mainspring acted on a tumbler fastened to the cock-spindle inside the lock in the manner of a flintlock. A cock, similar to that of a wheellock was employed to hold the pyrites against the serrated edge of the segment. Thierbach illustrates a combined segment lock and matchlock in which the cock is connected to the segment by a slotted link, and acts as a handle to pull back the segment for cocking. The invention of the segment lock is attributed by Antonio Petrini in his "Arte Fabrile" of 1642 to the Italian Gunmaker Rafalle Verdiani (c1580-1630). This gunmaker worked for the Medici in Florence and must have been a mechanic of no mean ability; but only one example of his lock is known. It is on a gun in the Tower of london Armouries and is signed and dated inside RAF. VERD. 1619"
Howard L Blackmore, "Guns of the World"
(pictures to follow)

 

[Okwaho]

Actually the English lock appeared about 1650 in response to the French true flintlock which was invented in France[url] Ca.1630.In[/url] the interim period between the 1630's and the 1650's a number of snaphaunces were converted to flint and these locks which retained the horizontal sear were equipped with a dog catch to prevent the gun from accidentally discharging.The English lock,although having the appearance of a true flintlock,retained the horizontal sear and was equipped with a dog catch.The best explanation for the retention of the dog catch was that the gunsmiths probably didn't completely trust the half cock notch on the tumbler.About 1670 the English lock dropped the horizontal sear in favor of a vertical one and became a true flintlock although some gunsmiths continued to use the dog catch until the early 18th century.The dog catch continued to be used with the result that many collectors and students of English arms erroneously term any lock with a dog catch a dog lock.
Tom Patton

 

[Teleoceras]

Okwaho:

Actually the English lock appeared about 1650 in response to the French true flintlock which was invented in France[url] Ca.1630.In[/url] the interim period between the 1630's and the 1650's a number of snaphaunces were converted to flint and these locks which retained the horizontal sear were equipped with a dog catch to prevent the gun from accidentally discharging.....

No, that is a Doglock (Some call it the English Doglock). English Locks do not have the dog. Examples of the English Lock have been dated to precede the (French) Flintlock. Also known as the Jacobean Flintlock, the earliest examples of these guns were dated from between 1600-1620.

The English Locks were used by the artillery train guards during the English Civil War in the 1640's. The fact is the the English Lock did not survive for long was BECAUSE of the Flintlock. It was not until the restoration in 1660 that Charles II brought many of the french guns with him that the true English Lock was finshed.

:m2c: