What caliber rifle to get?

[Songwriter]

Yep. The powder you have on hand might be less than one twentieth of the price of a gun. Don’t let that influence the decision at all.
You should base your choice on what others have recommended above. Don’t let the tail wag the dog!

 

[Wireforhire]

View attachment 272344
Caliber 1, anything less is a toy!

Please provide more information on this NON-TOY. Who wants a wall gun....? "Me" Regards, ZEE

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I have a good amount of 4f Swiss and 3f Tipple 7. I have no muzzle loading rifles. I live in Canada and would like a flintlock. What caliber is my best bet to use with these powders? Can you recommend a builder or manufacturer? No cap locks or in lines. Just the best bet flintlock rifle. I'm new to this. The purpose is to get into the sport.
Thanks,
John

John,
the BP powder substitutes are notoriously hard to ignite with a flinter, even if one did some sort of duplex load, although such would help. The reason is to avoid the "explosive" classification for transport, and storage at a retail facility. Pyrodex for example IS Black Powder but they substitute potassium perchlorate for some of the potassium nitrate, and this drops some of its ignition qualities. Makes it easier for "mom and pop" muzzle loader shops to stock some sort of powder.

The question on a "duplex load" would be how much of the chamber needs to be filled so that the black powder is at the touch hole. Otherwise if you used too little, the Triple 7 would be what was receiving the flash, and there would be no advantage.

As for the caliber, .50 is probably the most commonly found caliber. It's a toss-up between .54 and .45 as to which is the next favorite, but I think .54 is a bit more common these days than .45. On the other hand, years ago, I knew fellows who got .45's and loved them because the recoil was puny, deer were not difficult to down, and..., late in the season all the .50 and .54 round ball was sold off, but .440 ball (the common size for the .45) was still found.

I'm a big fan of folks looking for a good, affordable rifle, between .45 - .58 caliber, and getting that when it presents itself, in whatever caliber. I kinda have a superstition that some rifles pick their owners.

LD

 

[DementedMindOfJac]

Four F is good for priming, Tripple 7 wll not work in a flintlock. Start with a 45 or 50 is my opinion. There are so many options out there, just make sure you get one that has a good lock and a good bore. A poor flintlock lock will discourage a new shooter.
Larry

777 works well in my flintlock as long as I prime with BP. Guess, I got a Elven-forged flinter by accident.

Could I use the 4f as a main charge in a 32 or 36 cal?

Yes. Black powder burns at the same rate. In order to vary burn rate slightly, it's granulated. 4f might even give you better results in shorter-barreled weapons. I'd stop short of loading a coastal battery with 4f, however.

What are you going to use the rifle for?? That should determine the caliber, not what powder you happen to have .

The first post that made sense to me. I normally get what fits the intended purpose best, then divide by money available.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Powder is easy to come by. Buy any gun you want.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

777 works well in my flintlock as long as I prime with BP. Guess, I got a Elven-forged flinter by accident.

Yes. Black powder burns at the same rate. In order to vary burn rate slightly, it's granulated. 4f might even give you better results in shorter-barreled weapons. I'd stop short of loading a coastal battery with 4f, however.

The first post that made sense to me. I normally get what fits the intended purpose best, then divide by money available.

Good for you! Glad you are happy with T7. For me, shootin only real black for over 50 years in my flinters will not change. T7 may work for you, but is it as reliable and fast as real black?
Larry

 

[springfield art]

Four F is good for priming, Tripple 7 wll not work in a flintlock. Start with a 45 or 50 is my opinion. There are so many options out there, just make sure you get one that has a good lock and a good bore. A poor flintlock lock will discourage a new shooter.
Larry

Yes, you must use real black powder in a flint lock; the whiz-bang modern stuff is for whiz-bang modern "in-lines" and such.

 

[DementedMindOfJac]

Good for you! Glad you are happy with T7. For me, shootin only real black for over 50 years in my flinters will not change. T7 may work for you, but is it as reliable and fast as real black?
Larry

Yup. only the price-point as bothers me. Better for shooting at longer ranges, imho.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Yup. only the price-point as bothers me. Better for shooting at longer ranges, imho.

That's odd. All the long-range shooters that shoot in competition shoot real black. Swiss 1.5 mostly, a few old Eynsford.

 

[Psycho Mike]

I don't know where abouts up here you're from, but in Alberta, Fish and Game stipulates that the minimum calibre for deer is a .45 cal. If you want to hunt with it, that'd be a good place to start as a minimum calibre. You could do both barrel and pan with 4f that way (though start smaller and work up the load, for sure).

I don't have experience with triple seven, but it looks to be more along the lines of what one could use for a modern inline BP rifle than a flinter. Perhaps you can do a swap with someone at the local range or at a rendez-vous.

 

[DementedMindOfJac]

That's odd. All the long-range shooters that shoot in competition shoot real black. Swiss 1.5 mostly, a few old Eynsford.

Yes. They don't use disguised modern tech molychrome barrels.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Yes. They don't use disguised modern tech molychrome barrels.

I have no idea what their barrels are made of

 

[stikshooter]

I have no idea what their barrels are made of

Your right ,he's wrong

cause it matters (SQUAT) but in his defense he probably thinks 4F will
blow up your gun as a main charge thou our Brit friend posts a impressive kill ratio with 4F in copious amounts along with serious portions of lead in his 10 ga.!!! Nay Sayers exist in every forum ,they just lack common sense/Ed

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Caliber: I started with a 58 which I bought, sold it, bought a 54, gave it away to a woman that could not afford one. Built a 45 cal. Dont need nothing else.

The amount of powder you use makes a difference. MOST new shooters and some older ones use way to much powder and the unburnt just goes out the muzzle.

When you get what ever caliber you end up with, you can use the Davenport Formula and find out the maximum charge you barrel can handle, and dont use more than that.

For my rifle I used 56gr for standard load, and 112 for longer distances. Using the formula I found that my barrel could not burn more that 74.5 grains.
So now my standard load is still 56gr @1630fps, and my distance load is 75gr @2050fps.
Powder is a terrible thing to waste.

 

[longcruise]

@Johnny Tremain I've never been able to get on board with the Davenport formula. Every comprehensive test over my chronograph has shown it to be non-applicable.

 

[tenngun]

Could I use the 4f as a main charge in a 32 or 36 cal?

Ask Britsmoothie a member on our founders about it.
#1 question is what do you plan to do with the gun? A .32 won’t be a moose killer, but a .58 isn’t needed to make holes in paper or plink tin cans.
#2 a little everything? A good hunter but cheep to play with
#3 is histoic accuracy important, a traditions gun looks right, but only from a in general standpoint, a true historic gun can run much higher

 

[Rifleman1776]

What about, 4f in the pan and a duplex (say 5gr 4f) with the triple 7 (say 40 gr) in something like a 20 gauge.

Duplex loads are always potentially dangerous things. Can be done but, personally, I would not try. I know powder acquisition is difficult but getting some 3Fg for the main charge is the only safe and reliable move for you.

 

[hanshi]

Personally, I wouldn't hesitate using 4F in a .32 or .36. I would probably use it in a .45 for that matter. I suggest you correspond with Britsmoothie since he regularly uses 4F in his guns.

 

[Splitear]

Looking for a rifle recommendation based on having powder is like asking for car recommendations based on having a set of tires.

Find a rifle you like, powder can be had. Triple 7 isn’t often used in Flintlocks, though there is evidence that it will work with certain rifles. It’s all about the ignition temperature of 777 vs BP.

Regardless, 50 caliber is a pretty standard caliber and materials are fairly easy to come by. Is that the correct answer though? It depends on what your wanting to use it for.

 

[longcruise]

Duplex loads are always potentially dangerous things.

I think when talking modern smokeless powders that's very very true but given the nature of black and the subs, not.