What do I need for a .44 percussion revolver?

[Loc]

Hello I'm new to this forum, me and my dad are going to be purchasing a Pietta Model 1851 Navy Confederate .44 Caliber Revolver with Starter Kit I just copied that from Cabela's thing. We are new to black powder firearms and this will be the very first black powder gun we purchase, how do you clean these types of handguns? What do I use to clean it and lubricate the gun if it needs to be lubricated. When shooting it does the patch have to be lubricated as well as the round ball? Are lead round balls the only type of projectile it can shoot? What kind of black powder do I buy? What size percussion caps do I need? And how many grains of black powder should be loaded? Like I said completely new to black powder.

 

[pargent]

FFFg powder
.451 balls
#10 caps
flask or measure for 20gns of powder
44/45 lubed wads optional
bullet lube/ patch lube
NO PATCHING IS USED ON CAP AND BALL REVOLVERS
warm to hot water and dish soap for cleaning
gun oil
That should get you started , look up the topics history to find vids & dissmantlihg instructions :thumbsup:

 

[pargent]

Duellist has some good utube vids on loading etc on here look them up

 

[M. De Land]

Dang, no patches in cap-n-ball revolvers? No wonder I can't hit nutten!
But all kidding aside, wonder how that would work to shoot a patched undersize ball out of a revolver? Wonder if the patch would transition the forcing cone intact with the ball or cause a barrel obstruction by peeling off?
Anybody got and old revolver they want to tie to a tree or tire and remote fire with a lanyard and report back? :rotf: Just might work, to what gain I have no idea, other than just curiosity. Actually the more I think on it the more I think it totally feasible. MD :wink:

 

[Zonie]

I suppose before we get to worrying too much about what a patched ball would do in a cap & ball revolver we ought to try to help our new friend by just saying that cap and ball revolvers don't use patches on the ball.

The recommended bare ball is going to be larger than the chambers in the cylinder.

After loading the powder charge and placing the ball on the mouth of the chamber the loading lever forces the ball down into the hole.

This will shear off a thin strip of lead making the ball the exact fit that it needs to be.

Many people will put some bullet lube over the loaded ball to lubricate it. If a bullet lube isn't available, lard or something like Crisco can be used.

Load as many chambers as you wish and then place a percussion cap on the nipples.

These must fit snuggly. If they are loose there is a good chance of one of them falling off when the gun fires.

If one falls off, the flame from the firing chamber can enter the nipple hole and set off the powder in that chamber. This is called a "chain fire" and although it usually doesn't hurt the gun it can scare the poo out of everyone around.

 

[hawkeye2]

If you have not already ordered the gun I would recommend that you forget the starter kit and just get the revolver. You don't need some of the items and you can save money by buying just what you need. You need balls, caps. lube/sealer and/or wads, powder, powder measure and a nipple wrench. You don't need the flask and you can probably buy a better quality capper and nipple wrench elsewhere.

 

[swathdiver]

Track of the Wolf has the most durable cone wrenches. The traditions one will not last a year as it's too soft.

Keep your loads under 25 grains or so to ensure the longevity of your brasser's frame. Sure it can hold more powder, but brass is not as strong as steel and it will eventually stretch, either ruining the arbor threads if you're fortunate or the frame's threads for the arbor if you're not.

Get a Colt (6oz) or Remington (4oz) powder flask, they come with a 24 grain spout. You can also get an adjustable measure with pour spout for experimenting with different loads.

Pyrodex black powder substitute is very corrosive. Should you choose to use it, clean the gun right away after use. I suggest you obtain real black powder instead. Graf's & Sons and Powder Inc. have great prices if not available locally.

Remington #10 Percussion Caps usually work best on Pietta revolvers.

The Traditions compact cleaning kit it not long enough to go through an 8" barrel. I use a Treso Pistol Loading Rod from Track of the Wolf (PL-5) and attach a jag and phosphor bronze brush for cleaning.

Get a tube or two of Thompson Center or Traditions Wonder Lube/Bore Butter. You can lube your wads, over the balls, lubricate and clean the gun with it. Speaking of wads, I personally like the ones over at the Possible Shop but Ox-Yoke and others work well. After a time, you may wish to make your own like many of us do from Duro-Felt using a custom punch made by a fella on this here forum.

It's late and probably forgot something, make a list of the stuff that everyone mentioned and try to get all supplies from as few vendors as possible to save on shipping costs.

Graf's & Sons
Powder Inc.
Jedediah-Starr
Track of the Wolf
Possible Shop
Cabela's

 

[joe4702]

I will reiterate the suggestion to get on YouTube and watch some videos. Reading about the process is certainly worth while, but watching a well-made demonstration really helps clarify things.

Note that there is more than one way to do many of the things involved with BP shooting. Once you get some experience, you'll be able to "tune" the process to your liking (but always keeping safety as the first priority).

You're lucky. Wish my Dad had been into guns and especially BP.

Have fun!

Joe

 

[George T.]

That is very true! We all start someware. In fact if you wanted to go cheap tou need your Revolver , caps , powder and balls. If the balls shave a ring of lead your probably good to go but to be safe take some crisco with you to lube the chambers ib front of the ball to guard against chain fire. In time you can try felt wads under the ball but to start and have fun is easy and fairly cheap.

As far as a powder measure you only need a 38 speciak case. Thats a 24 grain load if tapped. As far as cleaning few things work better than a few dsrops of dish soap in warm water. For pistols I like to use a sprayer and a small paint brush. It really melts the powder residue off. Follow that up with a oil or light grease.

By the way welcome and be aware that any black powder shooting is the start of a life long quest!
Again welcome! Geo. T.

 

[cynthialee]

what the guys said ^^

Also I will lobby for you to go watch some youtube videos. Watch a number of them though. Because some guys are smarter than others and some are down right dumb. Then come here and post any questions you have before you load and shoot.

 

[Many Klatch]

The nice thing about cap and ball revolvers is that you can shoot all day for a couple of bucks. There are 7,000 grains in a pound of powder and you will be shooting around 20 grains per shot. That gives you 350 shots for the $12 to $20 that you spent on the powder. The caps will cost around $5.50 to $6.00 per 100 so there is another nickel per shot. I cast my own roundball but you can buy 100 for around $15.00. So each shot will cost you between 26 cents per shot if you buy the roundball or 11 cents if you cast your own.

38Spl costs $33 per box of 100 or more so that is .33 cents per shot.

With a cap and ball revolver you can't shoot up 100 rounds quickly, it will take you a while. With these guns you get 5 or 6 shots fairly quickly then you need to reload.

Cleaning is best done with hot soapy water. Some folks do a complete disassembly for each cleaning, some don't. Make sure you oil everything though.

Have fun and be safe.

Many Klatch

 

[rodwha]

Some people completely take apart their pistol each time they clean, and some just every now and again, but you'll need to clean it all up on occasion, which means you'll need hollow ground screwdrivers (or a set).

The screw heads will eventually booger up if you use a typical screwdriver. The hollow ground screwdrivers need to be the correct size. I recently bought a Chapman set, which was recommended by several people as the best choice without getting expensive. I bought the smaller set for $25.

This one: https://www.dixiegunworks.com/prod...cts_id=2787&osCsid=iuoquusv6v6katttsqvgmbnm77

 

[Dickydalton]

Where are you getting 38Special that cheap? Reloading is the only way.

 

[Jim Blair]

If you have not purchased a revolver yet,or even if you have,I'd recommend this book if you're new to shooting C&B pistols-

Percussion Pistols and Revolvers: History, Performance and Practical Use
by Mike Cumpston, Johnny Bates

 

[Many Klatch]

Dicky, I reload my own so I am not current on store bought ammo. That was a price I found online. I know that there are folks paying $50 for a box of 100. 50 cents per round seems ridiculous to me.

Many Klatch

 

[Jim Blair]

50 cents per round seems ridiculous to me.

Many Klatch

Really?

Below was a whole bunch of prices on cartridges that were deleted by Zonie because we don't discuss cartridges on the Muzzleloading Forum.

Needless to say, our muzzleloading and cap & ball guns are far cheaper to shoot.

 

[Many Klatch]

See now those prices are just plain ridiculous :grin: . That goes to prove what a bargain cap and ball revolvers really are.



Many Klatch

 

[Gene Koonce]

Do you know who carries this book?

 

[Jim Blair]

I bought my copy here-
http://www.alibris.com/booksearch?qwork=9072555

Amazon and Barnes and Noble carry it too I think.

 

[AZbpBurner]

Hello I'm new to this forum, me and my dad are going to be purchasing a Pietta Model 1851 Navy Confederate .44 Caliber Revolver with Starter Kit I just copied that from Cabela's thing. We are new to black powder firearms and this will be the very first black powder gun we purchase, how do you clean these types of handguns? What do I use to clean it and lubricate the gun if it needs to be lubricated. When shooting it does the patch have to be lubricated as well as the round ball? Are lead round balls the only type of projectile it can shoot? What kind of black powder do I buy? What size percussion caps do I need? And how many grains of black powder should be loaded? Like I said completely new to black powder.

So, by now you have a pretty good idea of how to load & fire, and the importance of proper fit screwdrivers.

After a trip to the range, plan on complete disassembly of your revolver & a thorough cleaning. To do it right will give you a firearm cleaner than when it arrived to you from the manufacturer & it won't take much more effort than a shortcut cleaning method.

What you will be doing is removing the wood grips, then putting everything else into the kitchen sink, or a cleaning pan. One of those little jars of jewelery cleaner with the basket & small brush inside are great to securely hold all small parts, screws & nipples.

the rest of the frame, backstrap, cylinder & barrel go into the sink. Spray them down with Windex (the generic stuff at the 99¢ store works great). You can melt off the bulk of your accumulated powder residue & excess ball lube accumulation, before getting down to brush cleaning. Brush everything down with a small toothbrush, then rinse off with warm water. Next, fill the sink with hot water & dish detergent. Brush down all parts, including bore & chambers with a nylon bore brush. Finish up the bore with a wet soapy patch. Go over all the small parts in the jewelery basket with soapy water. One of those tiny interdental brushes, designed for cleaning under dental bridgework, works great to brush out nipple channels.

Rinse everything in boiling water, then quickly remove & pat dry with a clean towel. Next, spray down everything with WD040, or that cheaper Ace Hardware Brand. The idea is to displace all moisture. Wipe everything down, and run your favorite bore cleaner down the barrel & thru the chambers.

Ask 10 people how to correctly lube their revolvers & you will get 10 different answers.

You're not likely to fire more than a hundred-some rounds at any one time, so an expensive grease containing micro particles of some magic friction reducer, isn't really needed here. I Use either Rem Oil or GI bore cleaner to wipe everything down. Oddly enough, Frog Lube will clean out that remaining bit of dirt left behind by brushing, scrubbing & patch cleaning. It also makes an effective anti seize compound for the nipples, and is more water soluble than that expensive Wonder Grease you should be saving for use on your M-14 or 1911 ...

I use a tiny dab of grease/Frog Lube on all screw threads during reassembly, then a final wipedown before storing the revolver for next use.

Grease or oil for lubing internal parts? Use what you're comfortable with. Those who insist that their way is the ONLY way, are usually only intent on compelling you to do it their way. Ask them about their Bible & they may also tell you that theirs is better than yours ... No harm in picking & choosing cleaning methods & materials, as long as you're thorough & avoid shortcuts that can leads to frozen nipples that require more than just a hi-dollar & properly tempered wrench to remove them. Anti seize is good stuff, but about any grease or even ball lube will do the trick, especially if you're on a budget.

My 46 year old 1861 Navy shows a little wear from use, but it is as clean as the first time I cleaned it, back while I was still in High School. The 35 year old ROA still looks like new, outta the box, despite extensive firing, and my newest (2nd Model Dragoon) looks new, because it still is. 10 years & more form now, they all will look and function like new, simple due to a little bit of time taken to thoroughly clean after use.

You can get pre-lubed felt wads to place between powder & ball; the lube is quite stiff & for a reason. If you get felt wads to lube on your own, a stiff mix of tallow & beeswax is ideal. Olive oil is a good lube for patched roundballs in your flintlock, but can have a bad effect on your revolver loads: When you place a greased wad over the powder then seat a ball atop it, you can severely squeeze the wad. This can wring out any liquid lubes, which have only one place to go - into your powder. Oiled powder doesn't burn & can require some disassembly to clear a chamber. Ask me how I know ...