What is about a Hawken Rifle

[William Lincoln]

Again, nothing shoulders and points like a Hawken Style
rifle. It is just a magical design. You have to feel it and
it imparts an immediate satisfaction as you aim it.
It just hits the sweet spot of a period functioning rifle.

 

[Bigpete]

They just do it for me too. Just look right,and seem to fit me well.

 

[DuncNZ]

My first BP rifle was a TC Hawken kit , I had a lot of fun building and shooting that rifle , then I purchased both of J Baird's books , and Charles Hanson's book on the Hawken , and discovered to my horror that the coil spring locked little rifle was in no way authentic . I sold the TC and purchased a Uberti .54 Hawken, that was better , it shot very well and looked the part .There is one design fault in the Hawken and that is the crescent butt plate , it is painful to shoot from prone , great sitting, kneeling , standing , off a horse etc but a shoulder killer lying down . A few years ago I had a titanium right shoulder fitted ( not the Hawken's fault) and that was the end of the Hawken . So no more cap locks for me. Just flint , wheel and match locks in my gun safe now . And I have to admit I do like the style and balance of an American Long rifle . If I was to buy another plains type caplock it would be a Pedersoli Tryon .

 

[Howard Pippin]

My first BP rifle was a TC Hawken kit , I had a lot of fun building and shooting that rifle , then I purchased both of J Baird's books , and Charles Hanson's book on the Hawken , and discovered to my horror that the coil spring locked little rifle was in no way authentic . I sold the TC and purchased a Uberti .54 Hawken, that was better , it shot very well and looked the part .There is one design fault in the Hawken and that is the crescent butt plate , it is painful to shoot from prone , great sitting, kneeling , standing , off a horse etc but a shoulder killer lying down . A few years ago I had a titanium right shoulder fitted ( not the Hawken's fault) and that was the end of the Hawken . So no more cap locks for me. Just flint , wheel and match locks in my gun safe now . And I have to admit I do like the style and balance of an American Long rifle . If I was to buy another plains type caplock it would be a Pedersoli Tryon .

As someone who has titanium shoulders on both sides, I'm wondering why you didn't want to use the Hawken, as I have three styles of them, but I don't shoot them laying down, I guess never had reason to. I don't load Heavy charges, 47 grains Of triple F in a .45 And 52 in a .50 of triple F. Black in 50 flintlock, about 55 grains. 1 .50 percussion rifle only weighs 6 pounds but it does have a recoil pad. Is there danger of hurting my titanium shoulder? I'm left-handed, tried shooting right-handed while the left shoulder was healing, but found it very uncomfortable.
Squint

 

[Patched]

I’m getting anxious to put the final finish on yet another “Hawken”…

Back in the mid 70s, I found out that my TC Hawken would start spraying em above 60 grs of powder…so I got a GRRW ”kit” to assemble. (and another)…my GRRW “kit” didn’t quite resemble the TC or those two real Hawken rifles for sale in my town.
I had a lotta whittlin, drilling and inletting to do…not to mention research, measuring and tool buying…(I was able to handle and photo the two Hawken rifles in town. One gun displayed Sam style and the other was clearly Jacob. I don’t think Jacob was a fan of that beaver tail cheek rest thingy happening in the shop.)
The guns felt right in the hand, shouldered with ease, the barrel muzzles landed right at my chin for spitting in balls in a gun fight.
I decided I’m making one of these for me…it’s all somewhat subtle but not too hard to imagine why a western explorer/”mountain man” would choose a Hawken/Harper’s Ferry style gun over a seemingly delicate woodswalker.
Bigger bores, bigger balls and bigger powder charges in slower twists are what’s called for out here in the west.

 

[Patched]

Wow, Patched . . . .

Is it the camera angle . . . .or, does the stock have a ton of drop?

Seems that at 54 cal., your cheek might suffer some bruising, . . . .yes?

None-the-less, that’s some beautiful wood!!

This gun does have slightly more drop than “late“ Hawken rifles…actually the extra drop eases the recoil, sorta causes a gun to roll up rather than drive straight back into your shoulder…this comb stands a little taller to accept a tight cheekweld and quick access view of the more authentic lower primitive sights found on originals…in practice this seems to work out well for me. (after handling a few original Hawken rifles and studying them for 40 years, I observe that the earlier Jacob influenced guns had more drop and some curve and fluting on the comb,as portrayed in this rendition of Hawken

 

[beardedhorse]

Lots of examples of full stock Hawkens in percussion. Many in a museum in New Mexico that I have handled. Later full stocks were also made by Sam Hawken. A Mormon (John Brown - NOT of Harper's Ferry attack fame) used his .66 caliber full stock to defend a canyon from U.S. Military. Thought I read about an original Hawken in flintlock owned by collector in Alaska but not seen or heard more of the claim. Were certainly full stock flinters by father of pre St. Louis Sam and Jake. Nice picture of it in Peter Alexander's Gunsmith of Grenville County. Another rifle by a Hawken in Museum of the Fur Trade in Chadron attributed to a Hawken not named Sam or Jake or William.

 

[beardedhorse]

Cornstalk, Thanks for the literature on rendezvous orders for Hawkens. If you study the preferred rifles out in the Plains and mountains they were generally shorter and stouter than many Pennsylvania's. Some longrifles were cut down or sent to be refreshed or bored to a larger caliber if possible. I've had a wrist broken on a Kentucky but not on Hawkens. The heavy short barrel and adequate breech could take stouter loads for more knock down power at longer ranges. Harmonics on pre-cast (forged) barrels weren't affected by the vibrations on the "dead" iron on early Hawkens. Not too many longrifles could handle a fall from a horse or be loaded on a running horse. Shorter barreled rifles take less time to reload. 200 yards shots on gongs doable offhand with a Hawken and enough power to tip over rams and bear silhouettes. .53 caliber is listed for many Hawkens but some fired an ounce ball about .66 caliber. Suitable for bison and griz and moose and elk. Sam recalled later in life a "super Hawken" he built for William Ashley to fire back at Arikara shooting down on his keelboats going up the Missouri. It was purported to be .66 caliber. It is true they were more expensive and occupied a small minority of rifles used in the Rocky Mountain Fur Trade. That they were carried by the majority of mountain men is false. Their popularity and use certainly increased in the Santa Fe Trail and Oregon Trail days. J. J. Henry's and other trade rifles were stoutly built with strong wrists. The long tang on the Hawkens were there for a reason. Many of the Southern Mountain rifles were is lesser than .50 caliber and the drop and deep crescent butts were a pain to shoot in terms of recoil, especially if they were larger (than .50) calibers. This opinion on performance and comfort is based on building and shooting Kentuckies, Poor Boys, Hawkens and trade guns. On the practical side for hunting on foot a longrifle balances nicer and weighs less. A heavy Hawken is definitely a horse back rifle. Glad some movie fans are inspired by Jeremiah Johnson. Too bad the rifles couldn't be authentic for the flick.

 

[Spikebuck]

Great thread.

I have had a .54 Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken for around 15 years now. I've had more hunting success with that rifle than any other I've owned. A couple of years ago I sold off all my cappers except for the RMH. That one will be buried with me.

John Bergmann and Brant Selb make beautiful Hawken rifles, at least to my eye. I know I'd be proud to own a custom from them or from other exceptional Hawken builders that have been mentioned.

I will say, however, that the weight is less attractive in proportion to each year added to my age! Somehow, that Kibler SMR now feels better to carry around all day!

 

[rocullen]

I began my search for a good half-stock percussion rifle in late 1973. Read what I could find. Decided on the TC "Hawken" kit. Found The Longrifle Shop in Richardson TX. On entering the shop, I saw a few authentic Hawken rifles on the wall. I knew I'd found what I didn't know I was looking for! I went home with a kit of parts from Cherry Corners, a GR Douglas barrel in 54 cal. and a set of blueprints of Kit Carson's Hawken, and a walnut semi-inlet stock. This kit cost me more than a finished TC sold for, but I was stoked! A lot of work and a few mistakes later, and I had a rifle I STILL admire and love to shoot! I went on to compete (and win!) with it. Later I built several for others, and finally got a Hawken Shoppe kit from the Original Hawken Shoppe in St Louis. It is my crowning achievement! It is heavier, being a copy of Jim Bridger's Hawken.
"But it's a genuine Hawken! Ya can't git none finer!"

The Longrifle shop is where I bought my Bedford Country kit with Douglas 36 cal barrel. and my first TC Hawken.
The TC got stolen. I now have a Pecatonica Plains Rifle flinter in 54 put together from kit and a LGP rifle in 54 put together from kit. I took the fish belly out of the GPR and added a toe plate.

 

[springfield art]

Kits from The Hawken Shop are $1,400.00 and finished rifles are $2,995.00. There are wood upgrades available at extra charge. Our barrels are from Rice and all other component parts are made in house from original part patterns and tooling. The barrels are marked S. Hawken, St. Louis. Our rifles are historically correct and are a direct continuation of the 1825 St. Louis enterprise.

Interesting to note. I didn't know Hawken Shop offered finished guns. Will check out site.

 

[marwat06]

Bought my T/C Hawkens ~15 years ago at ****'s Sporting Goods, they had it 50% off Brand New. Picked up a Traditions Hawkens used for $50.00. Would love to own a PC Hawkens but have too many hobbies to float that kind of $$$. Both guns shoot great, won a few club matches with them.

 

[William Hagewood]

Jim Bergmann built me a pre-1840 full stock percussion Hawken using many Hawken shop parts for only $1800 in 2020. It is first class and I have owned 5 Hawkens in my lifetime. His is the most historically correct, great shooting and best priced one I have ever owned

 

[VJM]

Not rich enough to be a collector but am more like a Hawken hoarder. I picked this one up recently. Sharon rifle barrel company, Long’s lock and trigger.