What Say Ye!

[Uncle Miltie]

Just like I will not shoot someone elses reloads in an "unmentionable", I wouldnt fire an arm that I can not confirm myself what is in it....pull it.

Excellent advice.

 

[Billy Boy]

I just acquired a TC .54 Renegade that has the scope mount that sets to the side for hammer clearance. Luckily the guy still has the original rear sight so that will be changed back. The rifle is absolutely beautiful except for one minor issue and that is where I got the thread title from. He claims is has been loaded for 8 years with pyrodex rs and a maxi ball. It was not fired prior to loading and there was tape “for air tightness” over the end of the barrel. He also had a wad of plastic over the nipple with the hammer down to seal that side as well. Here is the question, do you think it can be fired to clear or would it have set too long? What Say Ye!

Pull it out, could be 80 grains of Unique…

 

[johnraleksa]

I would recommend that you get a high pressure CO2 discharger or air compressor to blow the charge and maxi-ball out. Perhaps removing the nipple and installing a 1/4-28 zerk fitting and using a grease gun to push the charge out.

Pyrodex is known to deteriorate over time and may be very difficult to ignite.

I don't recommend shooting the charge out.

I'm still shooting 20year old pyrodex and ttt7 just finished a bottle that been open for 2 years never a miss fire or lose off anything. I don't store it anything different often in the back of my jeep for weeks

 

[Grenadier1758]

@johnraleksa, some people have had acceptable performance from Pyrodex that has some age on it. About 35 years ago I experienced consistent hangfires and unacceptable performance with a new cylindrical can of Pyrodex. In any event, in the case of @Reds 8 year old load of Pyrodex that he didn't load, the best approach is to remove the load by any means other than shooting it out.

The grease that lubricated the original loading of the Maxi-Ball has certainly hardened, effectively gluing the projectile in place. A ball puller might be able to budge the ball after soaking in penetrating fluid for several days to dissolve some of the dried grease. An air compressor can generate up to about 100 PSI and in many cases will be enough to expel a ball from the barrel. A CO2 discharger can generate as much as 800 PSI and is great for most range use. The grease gun can generate over 1,000 PSI of pressure and is the most certain of the ball removing options. I think Reds would make the ball removal easier by applying some good penetrating solution to the barrel and using one of the non-shooting options.

 

[Crow#21957]

I would fire it.

 

[SOLANCO]

I'd be equally concerned about the possibility of corrosion: moisture has a way of getting in to 'sealed' chambers and pyrodex is not immune. I'm with the 'pull the load' faction. Then you can inspect the bore and see what condition both the load and the barrel are in.

mhb - MIke

Black powder is hygroscopic. Meaning give it the chance and it will suck up moisture. As in water.
If you think water is ok, consider what fish do in it.

 

[TDM]

I’ve talked to @Reds, he knows the seller very well and for a long time. Certainly no one would argue that removing the conical/ball by pulling or CO2 or grease would be best with an unknown gun, where there was no telling what was in it. But in this case he does know. Don’t know which course he will take, either pull or shoot, but it will work out fine either way.

 

[Dale Allen Raby]

I don't often find myself in disagreement with TDM as he is a very wise man, but I do in this case. The problem is that you only know what you were told the gun is loaded with, you didn't load it yourself, so you don't really know. When you trust someone with this kind of question, you may be literally trusting him with your life.

You also don't know how well the Pyrodex has held up, or the condition of the bore down at the breech.

What I would do is ask the seller, who presumably knows how much of and exactly what it was loaded with, to shoot it out for you. Since he loaded it, he should have no issues doing that. If it does not fire, then remove the ball using a CO2 cartridge ball remover or some other methodology cause if it didn't fire, it might be because somebody loaded it with something dumped out of some WWII era 30-06 shells.

If he won't shoot it, then you really gotta be asking yourself "why not?"

Safest way is still to remove the load without firing it, but if you choose to fire it, prop the gun into an old tire, point it in a safe direction and put a string on the trigger. Fire the gun from a safe distance so if it blows up nobody gets hurt. If it won't fire instantly, wait a little while, it could be a hang fire.

I've been burned a few times... and I won't go into details, but there was that '72 Impala with bubble gum plugging the hole in the gas tank, a Remington rifle with no magazine and more than a few business deals. Long story short, I trust no one very far these days.

 

[TDM]

I don't often find myself in disagreement with TDM as he is a very wise man, but I do in this case. The problem is that you only know what you were told the gun is loaded with, you didn't load it yourself, so you don't really know. When you trust someone with this kind of question, you may be literally trusting him with your life.

You also don't know how well the Pyrodex has held up, or the condition of the bore down at the breech.

What I would do is ask the seller, who presumably knows how much of and exactly what it was loaded with, to shoot it out for you. Since he loaded it, he should have no issues doing that. If it does not fire, then remove the ball using a CO2 cartridge ball remover or some other methodology cause if it didn't fire, it might be because somebody loaded it with something dumped out of some WWII era 30-06 shells.

If he won't shoot it, then you really gotta be asking yourself "why not?"

Safest way is still to remove the load without firing it, but if you choose to fire it, prop the gun into an old tire, point it in a safe direction and put a string on the trigger. Fire the gun from a safe distance so if it blows up nobody gets hurt. If it won't fire instantly, wait a little while, it could be a hang fire.

I've been burned a few times... and I won't go into details, but there was that '72 Impala with bubble gum plugging the hole in the gas tank, a Remington rifle with no magazine and more than a few business deals. Long story short, I trust no one very far these days.

I agree with what you’re saying completely. And as I stated I certainly wouldn’t fire any gun unless I knew exactly what was in it. But in Reds case the seller is a long time personal friend, not somebody in another town or state. Under his circumstances I don’t see a problem either way.

 

[sportster73hp]

I dry balled my .36 at the range one day and couldn’t get the ball out. Once home poured a generous amount of oil down the barrel, let it sit a while . It came right out. I’m on the pull it side of this argument.

 

[TDM]

@Reds i have decided to succumb to the group peer pressure and now recommend that you pull it, not shoot it out. That will make everyone happy and it is the safest thing to do. Personally, I still have a bit of daredevil in me, but not much anymore. Spray some penetrating oil down the barrel and let it sit, order a good tapered screw jag from TOW and pull it out.

 

[Steve Wagner]

I do not understand the mind that leaves a charge sit in a BP gun. Even if you know the seller personally there should be a question in your mind about what is actually in the barrel. Suppose 8 years ago he was a rank newby and accidentally loaded with smokeless? Pull, CO2, grease gun or air compressor.
Maybe it's just me. But if I am going to load a firearm then at the end of the day I will unload it. Even if it is a ML and I need to fire it to do so. Presumably you didn't load it to sit around the house with it. Only exception is unmentionable personal defense weapons.

Well, you beat me to it on this one ! And, as Banjoman hinted at, who knows how many times the previous owner or someone else loaded it again only to [fortunately] have it not fire, and then put it back in the closet for the next layer. Seems like a bad method of keeping your powder dry. And keeping it sealed on both ends could be as good or bad as the humidity in the air that got trapped in there. Although I doubt you could really keep it completely sealed like that for 8 years. I have Murphy's luck and if I tried leaving a load of charcoal, saltpeter etc. [or something even worse] in a barrel for even a month, I know I'd have a ferrous oxide globule fused in there until the 2nd coming. I have shot my own loads out, but in this case I'd buy a zirc and take it to my mechanic buddy that has a power luber. Why mess w a regular grease gun. I'd pay him for the mess and grease. I tried pushing one load out with my compressor at 125 psi and it was a no go. Came out fine using Black Powder Maniac's method of shooting it out. But who knows what lurks in that rifle after 8 years ? SW

 

[Reds]

Well after all of the views offered from all on the forum and based on the known fact that my pal “Has been Known to Take a Taste”that’s alcohol I decided to pull it! The suspense is over and it came out way to easy. The Natural Lube was a little hard yet still very pliable and the pyrodex poured right out. I am going to give it a thorough cleaning now and chalk it up as a great find. Guess he had remembered correctly after all. I wonder if sealing the barrel gave longevity to the lube as I have a few old boxes of maxis that were lubed from the factory and they are hard like clay. Here is a photo of powder and pulled maxi! Again Thanks for all the input! PS puller only had to grab by about 2 threads.

 

[TDM]

Great! Glad you got that taken care of.

 

[SOLANCO]

Well after all of the views offered from all on the forum and based on the known fact that my pal “Has been Known to Take a Taste”that’s alcohol I decided to pull it! The suspense is over and it came out way to easy. The Natural Lube was a little hard yet still very pliable and the pyrodex poured right out. I am going to give it a thorough cleaning now and chalk it up as a great find. Guess he had remembered correctly after all. I wonder if sealing the barrel gave longevity to the lube as I have a few old boxes of maxis that were lubed from the factory and they are hard like clay. Here is a photo of powder and pulled maxi! Again Thanks for all the input! PS puller only had to grab by about 2 threads.

LOL I like a taste also. But NOT before guns are unloaded, cleaned and properly stowed.

 

[Reds]

Yes I am fond of a taste as well but not around unmentionables and smoke poles. Now if he could only locate that rear sight I would be set. The scope and mount came off easily and only had a little mess between the mount and barrel. I cleaned that up with a #45 cleaning pad and oil. The mount was installed using the existing rear sight holes and one tapped into the rear end of breechplug. I will fill that with a threaded plug.